built with pride....

27% of Texans have no health insurance. Hmmm. Tax breaks doing a great job there. Or is it the low wages that prevent Texans from getting health insurance?

Spoon apparently you do not understand how tax abatements work. Toyota pays NO TAX on their profits, building, equipment and most get no interest loans. Go do some research on tax abatements here this will get you started.

The startling factor, revealed in a New York Times investigation, is just how friendly: At about $19 billion a year, Texas doles out more corporate incentives than any other state.

That amounts to 51 cents per dollar of the state's budget — the same budget lawmakers hacked to pieces last year, including $5.4 billion in cuts to public education. The New York Times article notes this “fundamental trade-off” and wonders “who benefits more, the businesses or the people of Texas.”

Yep sure would love to live in Texas....if I were a wealthy businessman that is.

Here is how GM treated the good state of Mich.

For years, mayors and governors anxious about local jobs had agreed to G.M.’s demands for cash rewards, free buildings, worker training and lucrative tax breaks. As late as 2007, the company was telling local officials that these sorts of incentives would “further G.M.’s strong relationship” with them and be a “win/win situation,” according to town council notes from one Michigan community.
LINK to the rest of the story

Think Toyota will treat Texas any different? Think again!

spoon059 wrote:

irishtom29 wrote:

spoon059 wrote:

Rape happens in America. Murder. Child abuse. Drug crimes. Corruption. Does that make it American? .

Superficial thinking there; those are crimes and not political or economic theories or actions with a voting constituency (except for corruption, a practice that is very American)...

We are currently past the 90 day limit for fighting in Syria right now. That is in violation of the Constitution. Is that American now too? Its political.

This is obviously an ideology issue, something I am not going to argue with you. I believe that our government has no interest interjecting itself into a private industry for any reason other than safety. A business that is properly managed shouldn't need a multi billion dollar bailout at taxpayers expense. A business that isn't properly managed should not be propped up by the government.

If the government wants to LOAN money (money is paid back with interest), then I am willing to consider (so long as the taxpayers aren't paying more interest on the borrowed money than they are earning in return).

I'm glad that you are happy with where America is going. I prefer the America where you worked hard to get ahead and lived within your means. I prefer the America where your house was where you raised your family, not a building you essentially use as a credit card to leverage money. I prefer the America where you had pride in yourself and in your work and you didn't take a handout that cost the country money.

My America is quickly disappearing, you are right. How many millions of people are on welfare right now, collecting money to sit at home and breed. How many millions of people are collecting social security right now for nonsense like ADHD and fake injuries? How many politicians are getting rich taking money from special interest groups? How many US military personnel are struggling to survive while awaiting proper treatment from VA hospitals while the US government is paying subsidies to degenerates so they can get better healthcare than our military? That doesn't mean that I have to accept it.

WELL SAID and very true
chevman

DaveF-250SD wrote:

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
They got 40 million in tax breaks when they moved their Headquarters to Texas and in 2003 - Texas is providing Toyota with $133 million in incentives. You might want to look into how much money our Gov gives to import companies. But Americans will cry like little babies about American car companies get a LOAN and @ 13.8% from our Gov.

Very true. It also doesn't seem to bother import buyers that the Japanese taxpayers (citizens) have bailed out Toyota three times already. Hypocracy at it's finest. :h

Not here. The bailouts have made logical sense, on both sides of the ocean.

irishtom29 wrote:

spoon059 wrote:

Rape happens in America. Murder. Child abuse. Drug crimes. Corruption. Does that make it American? .

Superficial thinking there; those are crimes and not political or economic theories or actions with a voting constituency (except for corruption, a practice that is very American)...

We are currently past the 90 day limit for fighting in Syria right now. That is in violation of the Constitution. Is that American now too? Its political.

This is obviously an ideology issue, something I am not going to argue with you. I believe that our government has no interest interjecting itself into a private industry for any reason other than safety. A business that is properly managed shouldn't need a multi billion dollar bailout at taxpayers expense. A business that isn't properly managed should not be propped up by the government.

If the government wants to LOAN money (money is paid back with interest), then I am willing to consider (so long as the taxpayers aren't paying more interest on the borrowed money than they are earning in return).

I'm glad that you are happy with where America is going. I prefer the America where you worked hard to get ahead and lived within your means. I prefer the America where your house was where you raised your family, not a building you essentially use as a credit card to leverage money. I prefer the America where you had pride in yourself and in your work and you didn't take a handout that cost the country money.

My America is quickly disappearing, you are right. How many millions of people are on welfare right now, collecting money to sit at home and breed. How many millions of people are collecting social security right now for nonsense like ADHD and fake injuries? How many politicians are getting rich taking money from special interest groups? How many US military personnel are struggling to survive while awaiting proper treatment from VA hospitals while the US government is paying subsidies to degenerates so they can get better healthcare than our military? That doesn't mean that I have to accept it.

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
Spoon, our Government collects money from it's citizens and private businesses in the form of taxes. Then they turn around and give businesses tax breaks to build plants here in the USA.
...
So no matter what, you (we) and I are paying for their plant to be built and that $H%T is not right!

And then Toyota pays taxes on the land, pays taxes on the building, pays taxes for its employees, collects taxes on sales, etc etc.

Texas is known as a business friendly state. They did the math and decided that it is better for them to provide tax breaks (in other words, charge LESS in taxes up front) to get a company to Texas. Once that company is in Texas, they figure that the amount of taxes they will collect from that company will offset the cost to Texas and still be profitable to the state of Texas.

That is like Honda selling cheaper motorcycles in the 1980's. They did the math and figured out that they can offer a product for cheaper than the competition. They know that eventually the lower price motorcycle will prove profitable.

Why do you think Texas, amongst other red states, provide these tax breaks? Do you think they are doing it out of the kindness of their hearts??? NO! They are doing it because they know that they will get a decent amount of tax money from that company, though less than in a blue state like Kalifornia.

I don't buy into your argument at all Don. Texas is not propping up Toyota, they are simply offering Toyota a slightly lower tax bill in order to convince Toyota to build a plant in Texas and continually pay taxes in Texas.

It is not like it costs Texas $1 million a year in public funds to allow Toyota to be there, and Toyota is only paying $750,000 of their bill and taxpayers are on the hook for the other $250,000. That is ludicrous if you believe that... I realize those numbers are made up, but I am just using them as an example. I promise you that there is a financial incentive for Texas to do what they do. The state of Texas is coming out ahead in this deal.

By the way, this entire thread is about "built with pride in the USA". What else is made in Texas and gets tax breaks? What else is made in the USA and gets tax breaks? If everyone is supposed to buy your argument that any company that gets a tax break is un-American, what are we supposed to buy?

My father-in-law owns his own contracting company. He gets tax breaks such as depreciation on his work vehicle, tools are tax deductible (another break). Does that mean that I can't support him as an American company because he gets those tax breaks?

Come on Don...

My 2015 GMC Sierra has it!

Craig

Ugh...

My Truck does, as does the Equinox. The Equinox is CAW...Canada.

The Buick I had did. The Trans Am and the Grand Prix do not. The Trans Am and Grand Prix are Canadian EH!

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:

RobertRyan wrote:

No they have never been bailed it out, it has never been bankrupt
Like Ford they asked for a loan to ride out the 2009 Crisishttp://www.abc.net.au/news/2009-03-03/japan-asked-to-bail-out-toyota/1607850

WOW really? So if it's Chrysler and GM it's a bailout, but if it's anyone else it's called a freaking loan?

Let me make this clear, Chrysler and GM did not want to go through Bankruptcy, it was three Congressman that demanded they go through a Government MANDATED

Don

Government mandated or otherwise, it is still Bankruptcy. Ford/ Toyota could still trade as the same corporation not a problem. If Bankrupt, outside NA, the you callin Liqidators to make sure the business can hopefully trade its way to health. On the other hand, the original legal entity is dead.

spoon059 wrote:

Rape happens in America. Murder. Child abuse. Drug crimes. Corruption. Does that make it American? .

Superficial thinking there; those are crimes and not political or economic theories or actions with a voting constituency (except for corruption, a practice that is very American). But government bailouts obviously do have a constituency of law abiding, respectable Americans. And as America changes what it means for something to be American changes, generally becoming broader and more inclusive. Indeed, two contradictory notions can both be American. You follow?

Often those who have it made under present conditions resist a change in conditions, lest change work against them. Such people, in order to further their own interests attempt to equate THEIR own interests with "Americanism" and tar competing interests as unAmerican; an appeal to emotion and ignorance. The early 20th Century KKK comes to mind, as does early and mid 20th Century Red baiting.