cab and chasis with utility body re-classified for scales

[mike_kellie]

I found this today because my travels took me by a Ca. weigh scale that had 5 officers (3 motorcycles, 2 trucks) ready to pull over vehicles not entering the scales. Pulled over the side of the road were 2-3 trucks with contractor boxes. They looked to be your typical 3500 series with utility beds and maybe lumber racks. I happened to be in the VW as it's being turned into the dealership tonight! My 5500 will be a daily driver for a couple months and I'll probably creep into a scale soon to see what might be required for a personal vehicle. I'm registered for 19K with stickers on both doors. They were all-out enforcing today!

DO THESE VEHICLES HAVE TO STOP AT THE SCALES?

PICKUP -- It depends on the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), unladen weight, and bed of the truck.

GVWR under 11,500 pounds, unladen weight of less than 8,001 pounds, and open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- NO.
GVWR 11,500 pounds or more, unladen weight 8,001 pounds or more, or not equipped with an open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- YES.

Discussion: According to CVC Section 471, pickups are a motor truck by definition, which is required to stop at the scales per CVC Section 2813. However, all California weigh stations have signs stating: "No Pickups." So, if a vehicle meet the definition of pickup in CVC Section 471, it is not required to stop at the scales because of the signs stating: "No Pickups." If the pickup has a GVWR of 11,500 pounds or more, an unladen weight 8,001 pounds, not equipped with an open-box type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length, or the pickup bed has been removed and a utility body or flat bed has been mounted, then it no longer meets the definition of pickup in CVC Section 471; it is then a "motor truck" under CVC Section 410 and required to stop at the weigh stations.

PICKUP WITH CAMPER SHELL -- NO (May have to stop under certain conditions. Contact California Highway Patrol Commercial Vehicle Section for verification (916-843-3400))

Discussion: It can also display passenger vehicle plates, as long as the cargo in the bed is not being hauled for compensation.

PICKUP WITH CAB / CREW CAB WITH BOX-TYPE BED -- YES

Discussion: The utility or box bed has to enter weigh stations.

[Kayteg1]

I just love those comments "I don't want to live in California" from people who have never been there for longer than a week.
Take it from the guy who did live in 3 countries, in 3 different system, visited for prolonged time 3 continents and for different periods over 30 countries.
CALIFORNIA IS THE BEST PLACE FOR ACTIVE LIFE.
Especially SF are where good professional can find top pay, you can water ski at least 10 months a year, takes you 3 hr of driving for snow skiing and you have all water sports you can imagine, with scenery that makes The City 2nd most popular destination in the World (who knows the 1st one?).
Top if with small detail that purchased house in the matter of 20+ years will make you a millionaire.
PS Texan steaks can be bought in CA for 1/2 what they cost in TX. (and yes, I did try Big Texan twice)

[DiskDoctr]

Just tell them your truck is Undocumented and you'll be free to go.

[2oldman]

California is a beautiful state. Lots to like here.

[pigman1]

Isaac-1 wrote:
There is an easy solution to this, don't go to California

Yep. Just one more reason to add to my already long list of "Reasons to NOTgo to California"

[HMS_Beagle]

Also CVC 2813:

"...Every driver who fails or refuses to stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection when signs are displayed requiring that stop is guilty of a misdemeanor."

[HMS_Beagle]

I can't tell you what the risk of interdiction is, but the law itself is pretty clear. From the OPs post it sounds like they may be starting to enforce.

A one ton is still a pickup - if it has a pickup bed and is less than 11,500 GVWR (and less than 8001 empty weight). Most new one tons won't qualify. A utility body or flat bed isn't a pickup by definition.

"CVC 471. A "pickup truck" is a motor truck with a manufacturer's gross
vehicle weight rating of less than 11,500 pounds, an unladen weight
of less than 8,001 pounds, and which is equipped with an open
box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length. "Pickup truck" does not
include a motor vehicle otherwise meeting the above definition, that
is equipped with a bed-mounted storage compartment unit commonly
called a "utility body.""

Here is the California DOT statement on the subject (bold is mine:

"DO THESE VEHICLES HAVE TO STOP AT THE SCALES?

PICKUP -- It depends on the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), unladen weight, and bed of the truck.

GVWR under 11,500 pounds, unladen weight of less than 8,001 pounds, and open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- NO.
GVWR 11,500 pounds or more, unladen weight 8,001 pounds or more, or not equipped with an open box-type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length -- YES.

Discussion: According to CVC Section 471, pickups are a motor truck by definition, which is required to stop at the scales per CVC Section 2813. However, all California weigh stations have signs stating: "No Pickups." So, if a vehicle meet the definition of pickup in CVC Section 471, it is not required to stop at the scales because of the signs stating: "No Pickups." If the pickup has a GVWR of 11,500 pounds or more, an unladen weight 8,001 pounds, not equipped with an open-box type bed not exceeding 9 feet in length, or the pickup bed has been removed and a utility body or flat bed has been mounted, then it no longer meets the definition of pickup in CVC Section 471; it is then a "motor truck" under CVC Section 410 and required to stop at the weigh stations.

PICKUP WITH CAMPER SHELL -- NO (May have to stop under certain conditions. Contact California Highway Patrol Commercial Vehicle Section for verification (916-843-3400))

Discussion: It can also display passenger vehicle plates, as long as the cargo in the bed is not being hauled for compensation.

PICKUP WITH CAB / CREW CAB WITH BOX-TYPE BED -- YES

Discussion: The utility or box bed has to enter weigh stations."

You may have gotten away with and may continue to. I might have taken that risk myself, till I learned the violation isn't a ticket - it's a criminal misdemeanor.

[Redwoodcamper]

Lived in California for 30 years. Driven many hundreds of thousands of miles in one ton trucks from one end of the state to the other. Never stopped at scales. Even with a couple flatbeds.

[HMS_Beagle]

Traffic is pretty much always a mess there, no? 🙂 A few decades ago I used to figure 50 minutes from Napa to downtown SF, but those days are gone....

In California, all pickups are registered as commercial vehicles unless you "permanently attach" a camper in which case it can be registered as an RV, or under certain circumstances register it as a passenger vehicle and never carry anything in the bed (for example a Top Kick 5th wheel puller can be registered as a passenger vehicle even though its a medium duty truck).

With my 14,000 GVWR pickup, I had been tempted to pull past the "no pickups" sign into the weigh station to see what happened. I half expected then to look annoyed and wave me out of there. But I never did, not really wanting to document the situation one way or another with my name attached. In the end I got the local DMV to change the body type - the branch manager had to take it on and everyone in the branch was pretty clueless as to the problem, issues, and statues involved.

[mike_kellie]

Thanks HMS. I have no problem stopping and have have all the paperwork needed. Since you're local, it was the scales before Lucas Valley Road. Traffic was a mess for a few miles because it's commute time and to change accross a couple lanes is difficult there. Today I was turning in my buy-back VW so this was my last trip. Now I will be stopping there and possibly Cordilia while I'm driving the truck.

[free_radical]

Isaac-1 wrote:
There is an easy solution to this, don't go to California

Im in Ontario Canada and all pickup trucks are registered as Commercial vehicles,,dont ask me why..

Ive never ever considered stoping at any scales since I am not using the truck for comercial purposes ie geting paid for driving carying loads..

[HMS_Beagle]

There really isn't any ambiguity or wiggle room here: CC with a utility box or flatbed has to stop at scales in California. Sure you can get away many times just bypassing them - as you can in a box truck or even a big truck. But it is illegal. It isn't just the inconvenience of getting pulled over, in California bypassing the scales when you are legally required to stop is a criminal offense, a misdemeanor. Are they going to arrest you? probably not, but they could.

There is some ambiguity on the new pickups - they do not meet the 11,500 GVWR limit for "Pickups" as defined in the CVC. If registered as other than a pickup body type, you will need weight stickers and have to (legally) stop at scales.

You can register most anything as a passenger car or RV, but in either case if you are caught with something else in the bed - it does not need to be commercial use, just hauling some 2x4s back from Home Depot - you are technically in violation of your license.

I went through this with my newer stock dually with pickup bed. 14,000 GVWR is listed on the door and the initial registration done by the dealer was body type "Commercial other" which is about the only thing that fit the letter of the law. The plates came with weight stickers and the law said I had to stop at scales. I spent 3 days at the DMV over about 5 months and got it changed to body type "Pickup". Now I don't have to stop at scales or put weight stickers on the door, but I might be in technical violation if I ever weigh more than 11,500 with something other than the camper in the bed. Even that could be argued: in the CVC a camper is a load in a pickup, in the Health and Safety code its an RV.

I have researched this extensively and have all the relevant CVC sections at my fingertips. CC with utility bodies have always had to stop at scales, it has just been weakly enforced. The problem with the newer pickups exceeding 11,500 GVWR is new, and the CVC hasn't caught up with it.

I really wanted to do a utility body on my truck but all this convinced me that it is impractical in California. You can continue to hope for weak enforcement, but getting arrested on the way to the campground puts a damper on the trip, for me.

[Kayteg1]

Yeah, go to AZ, they will charge you "entrance fee" even if you are in the state for 20 miles, like driving I15

[Isaac-1]

There is an easy solution to this, don't go to California

[Lwiddis]

Besides hard to understand, I’m not sure your analysis is correct.

[Kayteg1]

Just like I said in another topic 3 DOT officers will give you 3 different interpretation of the law.
I pass CA weight station with my F450 having 10 foot flatbed 100 times and never got pulled over.
Then it is not the camper itself that makes you non-commercial. It is going to DMV for inspection and changing truck classification that counts.
Actually before year 2010 my truck had no commercial stickers. It was few years later when I used the truck commercially.
But what I learned later (partially hard way) is that the law is very old, but it was not enforced for decades.
Than state turned LEO into revenue seekers and we have what we have.
From couple times I was send for inspection at weight station - checking emergency brakes on trailers is HUGE money maker for the state.