GM trucks outsell Ford first quarter !

Dadoffourgirls wrote:

librty02 wrote:
Yeah same around here GM was basically giving the trucks away up to 12k off and 0% for 84 months...

Your bias is showing. GM was not doing 12k cash and 0% for 84. Additionally, you had to have near perfect credit to score the 84.

As for the other discussions regarding sales being higher in May for Ford F-series, it is proven that vehicles sales are seasonal based on factors. The auto companies all know and understand, and then we get politics and world impacts that disrupt.

Yes yes they most certainly were giving up to 12k off and 0% for 84 months this wasn't long after christmas...just as some Ford dealers in my area were giving up to 7k off and 0% for 84 months on all 19 Superduty's near the end of March up till March 31...not sure how you could say that is being bias FACTS are not bias :S

philh wrote:
I'm in the auto industry. I've provided information I've learned from outside of my employer. I also have several friends that are business owners. I've floated trial balloon of 50% small business closure in MI, and nobody has disagreed, and I've had a couple of people suggest I'm being overly optimistic.

GM and FCA have reduced salaried employees pay up to 25%. Ford as of yet hasn't done any salaried reduction program.

OEM's are running on thin profit margins. Chop the top line and it will get very ugly on the bottom line very quickly. Lose just 10% in revenue, your 5-10% margins quickly disappear. Take away 25% of an employees gross pay, and watch how fast they don't lease another 50, or 60, or 60,000 vehicle.

You are right, this is different from '08, IMO, this is much much worse, and my opinion has nothing to do with politics. In fact, I've warned my wife that by the end of summer, I may be done working. Luckily, near the end of my career anyway, and we have put in place our long term planning.

I agree that this may be as bad or worse on the state than 08-09, depending on duration, but I feel that the auto companies are better prepared, and that was my point. I am not sure that the state economy is prepared.

Additionally, it appears that the government is providing more help to more this time. I don't want to start a political discussion, so saying nothing more.

I wish you well through this year. Hopefully the US can recover without serious impact.

philh wrote:

Dadoffourgirls wrote:
The last time was also extremely different circumstances. I think you know Philh that they all went to their credit tools to have cash, GM and FCA are deferring salary to all salaried workers, some new and enhancement programs (cash sucking activities) have been delayed, and competition is not producing vehicles either.

I am ashamed that you correlated 10.5 to auto bankruptcy.

We need to have compassion for all companies and workers. Regardless of your political beliefs, there are many

I'm in the auto industry. I've provided information I've learned from outside of my employer. I also have several friends that are business owners. I've floated trial balloon of 50% small business closure in MI, and nobody has disagreed, and I've had a couple of people suggest I'm being overly optimistic.

GM and FCA have reduced salaried employees pay up to 25%. Ford as of yet hasn't done any salaried reduction program.

OEM's are running on thin profit margins. Chop the top line and it will get very ugly on the bottom line very quickly. Lose just 10% in revenue, your 5-10% margins quickly disappear. Take away 25% of an employees gross pay, and watch how fast they don't lease another 50, or 60, or 60,000 vehicle.

You are right, this is different from '08, IMO, this is much much worse, and my opinion has nothing to do with politics. In fact, I've warned my wife that by the end of summer, I may be done working. Luckily, near the end of my career anyway, and we have put in place our long term planning.

I truly feel for you guys and I hope that this disaster passes as soon as possible and we can start the recovery process.

Dadoffourgirls wrote:
The last time was also extremely different circumstances. I think you know Philh that they all went to their credit tools to have cash, GM and FCA are deferring salary to all salaried workers, some new and enhancement programs (cash sucking activities) have been delayed, and competition is not producing vehicles either.

I am ashamed that you correlated 10.5 to auto bankruptcy.

We need to have compassion for all companies and workers. Regardless of your political beliefs, there are many

I'm in the auto industry. I've provided information I've learned from outside of my employer. I also have several friends that are business owners. I've floated trial balloon of 50% small business closure in MI, and nobody has disagreed, and I've had a couple of people suggest I'm being overly optimistic.

GM and FCA have reduced salaried employees pay up to 25%. Ford as of yet hasn't done any salaried reduction program.

OEM's are running on thin profit margins. Chop the top line and it will get very ugly on the bottom line very quickly. Lose just 10% in revenue, your 5-10% margins quickly disappear. Take away 25% of an employees gross pay, and watch how fast they don't lease another 50, or 60, or 60,000 vehicle.

You are right, this is different from '08, IMO, this is much much worse, and my opinion has nothing to do with politics. In fact, I've warned my wife that by the end of summer, I may be done working. Luckily, near the end of my career anyway, and we have put in place our long term planning.

ksss wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:
I'm surprised that the GMC numbers are so low compared to the Chevy since the GMC actually looks good and the Chevy's front end has the only your mother could love look.

I don't think the buyers are finding it nearly as awful as you think it is. You clearly don't like and you have been consistent on that. However that feeling isn't held by as many as you would like to believe. They are selling pretty well. I agree the GMC is more traditional and to some degree I like it better, but I would own a Chevy as well.

Yes the numbers don't lie but I just don't see a lot of these trucks around here (less than a dozen to date). I just seen the first Chevy High Country yesterday and it confirms that it's slightly less ugly than the standard uglier front end. It seams every manufacturer goes thru a period where the design looks terrible and Chevy has this one dialed in.

I wouldn't call the GMC traditional but it looks sooo much better and I actually wouldn't mind owning one.

FishOnOne wrote:
I'm surprised that the GMC numbers are so low compared to the Chevy since the GMC actually looks good and the Chevy's front end has the only your mother could love look.

I don't think the buyers are finding it nearly as awful as you think it is. You clearly don't like and you have been consistent on that. However that feeling isn't held by as many as you would like to believe. They are selling pretty well. I agree the GMC is more traditional and to some degree I like it better, but I would own a Chevy as well.

I'm surprised that the GMC numbers are so low compared to the Chevy since the GMC actually looks good and the Chevy's front end has the only your mother could love look.

NJRVer wrote:


How do you know the guy is the "father"? Did you get the birth certificates?
So I guess when a single mother gets a HH house they have to sign a contract that they will not ever have a boyfriend or get married as long as they live.

Unless the mother is lying. As I stated, when we built a home, the people getting the house would come out and help when they could which was usually on weekends when I was volunteering. After working for a while, you get to know them. When you finish the house then you move the next one which was usually next door. While working on the house next door, you would usually see the owner of the last house and talk to them. Some would even flat out tell you hat they do not plan on getting married to them because their benefits will go away.

ShinerBock wrote:

NJRVer wrote:

NJRVer wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

NJRVer wrote:

So you lease all your vehicles too?

Don't know how you get internet for a computer without cable or satellite.

These people didn't lease vehicles. I don't think leases would allow you to put the types of wheels, exhaust, and sound systems in their vehicles. I didn't have cable or satellite growing up. It was a luxury that we could not afford. I can't believe you would defend people stealing from those in need.

You can buy used luxury brand for pennies on the dollar. Cheaper than a new econo brand. Cadillac dealer in my area sells 2-3 year old Caddy's for $20,000.
I can't believe you accuse everybody of being a thief.
That must be because you are so young and no life experience.
After all satellite tv has only been mainstream since the 90's and cable only became popular in the '80's.
So if you didn't have them growing up you aren't very old.

These weren't used 2-3 year old Caddy's. These were mostly new trucks and SUVs like H2 Hummers and Excalade's. I call it like I see it, and was far from being the only person there calling them that. I was there, and you were not and yet you are defending something that you were not even there to see. I knew what it was like to grow up poor and only afford what you needed, not luxuries like cable, computers, new trucks with wheels that costs thousands of dollars, sounds systems that cost hundreds, and so on. They were able to do this because they claiming a single mother home to receive benefits even though the father was living there. It was so common that even the lefties(like you) on my crew hated it because even they thought of it as stealing from those who really needed it(unlike you).

And no, cable was mainstream since since the late 70's (even though it has been around since the late 40's) after the FCC lifted rules that limited it's growth in the early 70's. In fact, in 1975, there were 10 million subscribers and 40 million by the end of 1979.

How do you know the guy is the "father"? Did you get the birth certificates?
So I guess when a single mother gets a HH house they have to sign a contract that they will not ever have a boyfriend or get married as long as they live.

NJRVer wrote:

NJRVer wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

NJRVer wrote:

So you lease all your vehicles too?

Don't know how you get internet for a computer without cable or satellite.

These people didn't lease vehicles. I don't think leases would allow you to put the types of wheels, exhaust, and sound systems in their vehicles. I didn't have cable or satellite growing up. It was a luxury that we could not afford. I can't believe you would defend people stealing from those in need.

You can buy used luxury brand for pennies on the dollar. Cheaper than a new econo brand. Cadillac dealer in my area sells 2-3 year old Caddy's for $20,000.
I can't believe you accuse everybody of being a thief.
That must be because you are so young and no life experience.
After all satellite tv has only been mainstream since the 90's and cable only became popular in the '80's.
So if you didn't have them growing up you aren't very old.

These weren't used 2-3 year old Caddy's. These were mostly new trucks and SUVs like H2 Hummers and Excalade's. I call it like I see it, and was far from being the only person there calling them that. I was there, and you were not and yet you are defending something that you were not even there to see. I knew what it was like to grow up poor and only afford what you needed, not luxuries like cable, computers, new trucks with wheels that costs thousands of dollars, sounds systems that cost hundreds, and so on. They were able to do this because they claiming a single mother home to receive benefits even though the father was living there. It was so common that even the lefties(like you) on my crew hated it because even they thought of it as stealing from those who really needed it(unlike you).

And no, cable was mainstream since since the late 70's (even though it has been around since the late 40's) after the FCC lifted rules that limited it's growth in the early 70's. In fact, in 1975, there were 10 million subscribers and 40 million by the end of 1979.