GVWR

[MT_Camper]

I Have a 2017 F250 GVWR 10,000 lbs, rear GAWR 6340, front GAWR 4400, E rated tires at 3640 lbs. I have added 8600 lb Timbrens, lower stable loads and a Hellwig bigwig sway bar. I weighed my truck full of gas, two passengers, camper full of water and everything else we thought we needed to bring. The Cat Scale weighed in at:
Front axle 4060
Rear axle 6340
Gross weight 10400
The scale shows I am 400 Lbs over my GVWR listed on my truck.
The truck handles the camper very well.
My question is will this present any problems and what can I do to help?
Any helpful suggestions will be appreciated.
Thanks!


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[Cummins12V98]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
"This is how I come to my conclusion to not exceeding GVWR."

Since you have this GVWR figured out please explain how my RAM Dually has 6k for axle rating and 9,750# rear axle rating and has 14K GVWR. The fact that the RAWR for example is part of the SAE rating and I do run 9,750# rear but even if I only add the unloaded front axle weight of about 5,250# that puts me at 15K.

No one can explain this? I did not write the first sentence above.

[Me_Again]

CWSWine wrote:



Quoted From Towing Guides must not cause vehicle weights to exceed rear GAWR or GVWR.

I'm not so stupid to believe the Forum Engineers that claim that the Tow Guides are incorrect and they know best. I'm not the type to take the word from some that say "Just Believe Me Because I'm Smarter Than the Manufacture." I don't believe the butt test and if it moves as standard to what a truck can tow. I don't make excuses for the stupidity of buying the wrong truck and now trying to justify my mistake it by ignoring the limits put on the truck by the manufacturer. I don't believe that lady behind the counter at DMV can raise the manufacture specs of the truck LOL. The weight you get from the DVM just another limit in the long list of specs not to exceed, it doesn't become the holy grail and voids all the manufacture ratings. LOL The "Forum Engineers" quote DOT specs but when ask about RV stopping at weight scales or log book they are first to say the DOT regs do not apply to RVs - Which Is It? It's just fun to watch people trying to justify their mistakes.... LOL

You never answered my question regarding how hotshot haulers can legally haul the loads they do.

[CWSWine]

blt2ski wrote:

MFL wrote:
Wonder what happened to Swine???

Either he ran out of copy/paste material, or he moved to an actual truck forum and learned where the ratings come from.

Jerry

Either that, or he has realized there are more than one limit that we can load our trucks to.

The manufacture warranty limit

The civil court limit, which may or may not be the manufacture limit, depending upon the reason for the issue to be in civil court.

Or the FBL limit, which is the engineer based limit the road can handle load wise. ie 20K per axel, 34K per tandem, which can be limited to 500 lbs per inch width of tire. Along with many other point load limits to the road bed which are beyond any scope I have had to deal with.

last, the most important limit, if you are required to pay tonnage on you tag, that is lower than any of the above limits, that is your max amount. As I am only legal to 8000 lbs in my 2000 C2500. I can not legally run down the road at 8600 lbs as the door sticker states. If pulled over, I can expect a potential 600 lbs over weight ticket if weighed. Altho reality is, the local CVEO/LEO will give me a 10 day raise my tag to 10K and send me on my way, as I am below the FBL laws, my states weight law limits etc. So all they really want is the tax for the damage to the road I am causing at that GVW.

I have yet to see a "GCWR" law limit per say in any states, or the Federal Bridge Law max amounts I can run down the road at.I can legally run down the road towing a 100,000 lb load with my old 76 Toyota with a 120 HP motor if I wanted too. I am also assuming I am in an area where the speed limit is on the low side, maybe towing an over width load in farm country, or even city roads in Seattle lets say, where max limit is 25 mph, need pilot cars etc.

So reality is, there is more than one way to look at max weight you can run down the road at.

marty

So the question becomes, which load limit are you going to follow etc

l learned to read a long time ago and research my options.

Quoted From Towing Guides must not cause vehicle weights to exceed rear GAWR or GVWR.

I'm not so stupid to believe the Forum Engineers that claim that the Tow Guides are incorrect and they know best. I'm not the type to take the word from some that say "Just Believe Me Because I'm Smarter Than the Manufacture." I don't believe the butt test and if it moves as standard to what a truck can tow. I don't make excuses for the stupidity of buying the wrong truck and now trying to justify my mistake it by ignoring the limits put on the truck by the manufacturer. I don't believe that lady behind the counter at DMV can raise the manufacture specs of the truck LOL. The weight you get from the DVM just another limit in the long list of specs not to exceed, it doesn't become the holy grail and voids all the manufacture ratings. LOL The "Forum Engineers" quote DOT specs but when ask about RV stopping at weight scales or log book they are first to say the DOT regs do not apply to RVs - Which Is It? It's just fun to watch people trying to justify their mistakes.... LOL

[blt2ski]

MFL wrote:
Wonder what happened to Swine???

Either he ran out of copy/paste material, or he moved to an actual truck forum and learned where the ratings come from.

Jerry

Either that, or he has realized there are more than one limit that we can load our trucks to.

The manufacture warranty limit

The civil court limit, which may or may not be the manufacture limit, depending upon the reason for the issue to be in civil court.

Or the FBL limit, which is the engineer based limit the road can handle load wise. ie 20K per axel, 34K per tandem, which can be limited to 500 lbs per inch width of tire. Along with many other point load limits to the road bed which are beyond any scope I have had to deal with.

last, the most important limit, if you are required to pay tonnage on you tag, that is lower than any of the above limits, that is your max amount. As I am only legal to 8000 lbs in my 2000 C2500. I can not legally run down the road at 8600 lbs as the door sticker states. If pulled over, I can expect a potential 600 lbs over weight ticket if weighed. Altho reality is, the local CVEO/LEO will give me a 10 day raise my tag to 10K and send me on my way, as I am below the FBL laws, my states weight law limits etc. So all they really want is the tax for the damage to the road I am causing at that GVW.

I have yet to see a "GCWR" law limit per say in any states, or the Federal Bridge Law max amounts I can run down the road at.I can legally run down the road towing a 100,000 lb load with my old 76 Toyota with a 120 HP motor if I wanted too. I am also assuming I am in an area where the speed limit is on the low side, maybe towing an over width load in farm country, or even city roads in Seattle lets say, where max limit is 25 mph, need pilot cars etc.

So reality is, there is more than one way to look at max weight you can run down the road at.

marty

So the question becomes, which load limit are you going to follow etc

[blt2ski]

moresmoke wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:


Why license the tow vehicle for so much weight?

Truck tag has to cover the trailer weight here.

This is common in many states/jurisdictions. Especially if running commercial truck/trailer combo, where the truck is pretty much only carrying hitch wt. I see dump trucks with two door stickers showing X lb solo, Y lbs with trailer/tandem. Some even state US GVW in lbs, and Canada GVW in KGs, which the KG is overall higher in weight than allowed here in the US. All due to the road bed design limits one can put on the road bed before the design load limits are met.

Marty

[MFL]

Wonder what happened to Swine???

Either he ran out of copy/paste material, or he moved to an actual truck forum and learned where the ratings come from.

Jerry

[moresmoke]

Cummins12V98 wrote:


Why license the tow vehicle for so much weight?

Truck tag has to cover the trailer weight here.

[Cummins12V98]

"Hotshot hauls roll through scale houses daily across the country with loads that RV only dream about!"

I am sure there are those that haul more than I do but I am up there!

[Cummins12V98]

"This is how I come to my conclusion to not exceeding GVWR."

Since you have this GVWR figured out please explain how my RAM Dually has 6k for axle rating and 9,750# rear axle rating and has 14K GVWR. The fact that the RAWR for example is part of the SAE rating and I do run 9,750# rear but even if I only add the unloaded front axle weight of about 5,250# that puts me at 15K.

[Me_Again]

time2roll wrote:

MT Camper wrote:
I Have a 2017 F250 GVWR 10,000 lbs,

Is this one of those trucks that is derated to 10,000 GVWR for registration or classification purposes?
Does it have the 10,000 GVWR package?

I would ask what the GVWR was before the package.

Or just apply some forgetaboutit

All 250/2500 class trucks are limited to 10K max. Ford produces some class 3 350 trucks with a reduced rating as low as 10K as a special package.

[Me_Again]

CWSWine wrote:
This is how I come to my conclusion to not exceeding GVWR.

Here is what it says in the owner manual and tow guides.

“Note:
Trailer tongue (trailer king pin for 5th-wheel towing) load weight should be 10% (15% for 5th-wheel towing) of total loaded trailer weight. Make sure vehicle payload (reduce by option weight) will accommodate trailer tongue (trailer king pin for 5th-wheel towing) load weight and weight of passengers and cargo added to towing vehicle. Addition of trailer tongue (trailer king pin for 5th-wheel towing) load weight and weight of passengers and cargo must not cause vehicle weights to exceed rear GAWR or GVWR. These ratings can be found on the vehicle Federal Safety Compliance Certification Label.”

—OR—
Just take the word or a few very active posters that the factory information is incorrect and you can ignore manufactures GVWR but you should honor the manufactures ratings for the Axles (GAWR) which both are listed on the Federal Safety Compliance Certification.
Link
https://www.ford.com/cmslibs/content/dam/brand_ford/en_us/brand/resources/general/pdf/guides/18RV&TT_Ford_SuperDtyPU_Nov27.pdf

Next I contacted GMC Commercial Sales and ask about exceeding GVWR and loaded to GAWR and they sent me this link and this is the GMC official position.
http://www.gmc.com/gmc-life/how-to/understanding-gross-vehicle-weight-rating

I believe that it is very slim chance that you going to get ticketed for being over your trucks GVWR of even the GAWR/GCWR/tire ratings. My research turned to the legal side started at the link below.

“Towing in excess of the vehicle manufactures’s weight limits could not only prove dangerous but could be considered negligent In the event of an accident with an overweight personal vehicle, you could be held responsible for higher awards in a lawsuit for damages to other people, vehicles or property.”
Link: http://www.personalinjuryclaimsblawg.com/personal-vehicle-towing-liability-for-rvers/

Still not total convinced I made an appointment with my trusted family lawyer and he explained how manufactures specs on all kinds of products are used in civil court to gain higher awards and there doesn’t have to be a law prohibiting exceeding manufacture specs to play a role in court. The towing guids and the Trucks User manual will be gospile in civil court. The other question you might want to ask is what happens if a lawsuit exceeds my limits on my insurance policy and how to protect yourself. That question can’t be answered unless someone knows what assets would be exposed and what’s your income level. That was an eye opening meeting.

Also check with the local State Patrol, DOT scales operator, and a CDL Training center they agreed you should never exceed you GVWR and load to GAWR.

This is where my research led me and now I’m going to called the weight police and attacked. Your research may lead you in a different conclusion. Everything in life has risk but you have decided if the rewards are worth the risk. In my case towing above GVWR was not worth the risk.



What seemed strange to me that GVWR, GAWR GCWR, tire ratings are all manufacture ratings why would ignore just one but GAWR is not to be exceeded.

I love it when people say that the little lady behind the counter at the county offices can increase the payload of 1/2 ton truck to over 14,000 pounds that were set by engineers at the manufacturer sets. I guess those little ladies now have engineering degrees to work there. LOL

So how do hotshot truckers exist? If a state licenses tonnage and you comply by purchasing the tonnage for your load and are within the federal bridge weight limits please explain the issue. Hotshot hauls roll through scale houses daily across the country with loads that RV only dream about!

[time2roll]

MT Camper wrote:
I Have a 2017 F250 GVWR 10,000 lbs,

Is this one of those trucks that is derated to 10,000 GVWR for registration or classification purposes?
Does it have the 10,000 GVWR package?

I would ask what the GVWR was before the package.

Or just apply some forgetaboutit

[Cummins12V98]

moresmoke wrote:
Y'all are a bunch of lightweights.



F350 srw by the way.

If you are legally tagged in your home state, you are legal anywhere in the US.

Why license the tow vehicle for so much weight?

[moresmoke]

Y'all are a bunch of lightweights.



F350 srw by the way.

If you are legally tagged in your home state, you are legal anywhere in the US.

[JIMNLIN]

Ford markets F350 srw trucks with 13 different gvwr ranging from 10000 lb up to 11500 lbs.
This gets posted all the time on rv websites but a few rv folks don't seem to comprehend the truck maker may use different GVWR for the same exact truck when we look at Fords specs.
One example is a F350 srw in a 11500 gvwr or the same exact truck with a 10000 gvwr. And several other models with different GVWRs.

Ford F150 has 19 different GVWRs from 6000 on up to 8200 lbs ....but only around 5 different chassis/power trains.
GVWR or GVWR based payloads aren't the holy grail for how much load a truck can legally/safely carry.