Hello Ram 1500 Diesel!

[sch911]

Have been driving/testing these for a while now, but couldn't say anything, until today!

And yes it'll have plenty of towing capacity...

Chrysler wrote:
Ram to Build Industry's Only Light-duty Diesel Pickup3.0-liter V-6 EcoDiesel to deliver best-in-class fuel economy, a title already owned by the 2013 Ram 1500

-Clean diesel features low CO2 emissions and impressive V-6 capability
-Diesel engines praised for outstanding range and torque
-Ram first to market with game-changing technologies

February 14, 2013 , Auburn Hills, Mich. - Beginning in third-quarter 2013, Ram will become the only brand to offer a small-displacement diesel for its half-ton line of trucks.

The 2014 Ram 1500 will offer a new, 3.0-liter EcoDiesel engine, mated with the eight-speed TorqueFlite automatic transmission. The powertrain is expected to deliver an outstanding combination of best-in-class fuel efficiency, best-in-class torque and impressive capability.

"Truck owners have been emphatically asking for it, and Ram will be the only manufacturer to offer a diesel powertrain in the half-ton segment with the 2014 Ram 1500 EcoDiesel," said Fred Diaz, President and CEO - Ram Truck Brand and Chrysler de Mexico, Chrysler Group LLC. "The half-ton truck market is incredibly competitive, and although we're honored the Ram 1500 has received a number of prestigious awards, we cannot rest on what we have accomplished, we must keep pushing."

The 2013 Ram 1500 won Motor Trend's Truck of the Year, The North American Truck of the Year and Truck of Texas -- a rare trifecta in the pickup segment. Building on the award-winning truck, the 2014 Ram 1500 EcoDiesel will further stretch its best-in-class fuel economy title lead and continue to raise the innovation bar in one of the automotive industry's most customer-loyal segments.

"The Ram 1500 with 3.0-liter V-6 turbo EcoDiesel and TorqueFlite eight-speed transmission deliver on the demands of truckers by providing best-in-class torque, fuel economy and range. There's no doubt that being the only truck manufacturer to offer this game changing technology will provide Ram with a competitive advantage."

The new 3.0-liter V-6 EcoDiesel is among today's most advanced diesel engines. Its emissions are 60 percent less than those produced by diesel powertrains 25 years ago. The impressive combination of torque and fuel economy marks new levels of performance for small V-6 engines.

Ram's newest turbo diesel engine is manufactured by VM Motori, a Chrysler Group diesel engine supplier since 1992.

Over the past 10 months, the Ram Truck brand has set an aggressive product cadence. Ram's big push began in April 2012 with the introduction of the Ram 1500 with class-leading 25 mpg fuel efficiency and innovative features such as Active Level four-corner air suspension.

The Ram Brand followed that news with the launch of the Ram 2500 and 3500 Heavy Duty pickups. Their 30,000-pound trailer-tow rating – more than three tons more than their closest competitor -- and 850 lb.-ft. of torque are at the top of their class. Most recently, Ram introduced the new 2014 Ram ProMaster van with its own list of best-in-class features, including fuel efficiency, payload, cargo capacity and lowest cost of ownership.

About Ram Truck Brand
The Ram Truck brand continues to establish its own identity and clearly define its customer since its launch as a standalone vehicle brand. Creating a distinct brand for Ram trucks has allowed the brand to concentrate on how core customers use their trucks and what new features they'd like to see. Whether focusing on a family that uses its half-ton truck day in and day out, a hard-working Ram Heavy Duty owner or a business that depends on its commercial vehicles every day, Ram has the truck market covered.

The Ram Truck brand has the most innovative lineup of full-size trucks on the market. Ram Truck has emerged as a full-size truck leader by investing substantially in new products, infusing them with great looks, refined interiors, durable engines and features that further enhance their capabilities. Truck customers, from half-ton to commercial, have a demanding range of needs and require their vehicles to provide high levels of capability. Ram trucks are designed to deliver a total package.

[Alan_Maschek]

Considering this is a RV site, most I would assume are going to want some form of tow capacity.

Diesel will use almost half as much fuel towing a heavy load as a comparable gasoline engine. I know a diesel Grand Cherokee running the same VM V6 diesel that is going into the Ram 1500 can tow a 26' caravan and use between 17 and 20 miles per gallon. This is driving between the speeds of 55-60mph.

I don't see why a Diesel Ram would be much different.

Now take the F-150 with the 3.5 Eco Boost, a very powerful and torquey. What would the FE be for the Eco Boost F-150? Somewhere south of 10mpg?

What will the Hemi powered Ram's FE be? Slightly better than the Eco Boost F-150.

The diesel will not accelerate like a drag car like the V8s and Eco Boost. It will accelerate like a V6 when pushed. When driving normal it will feel V8ish. Torque moving you along.

[Powerdude]

According to multiple sources, city mpg will be 23 mpg, and highway mpg will be below 30, but obviously above the 23 mpg for the city.

Towing performance will be at least equal to the Hemi powered Ram 1500, which is easily rated at 10k lbs.

See here

And here

To me, that's pretty revolutionary. It isn't for everybody, but if you need a truck that can do a decent commute to work, at a good mpg, and you need to tow an ~8k-ish trailer on a regular basis, or a decent sized boat, it looks pretty compelling.

Now, if they only came out with it in a Megacab version !!! That would be awesome !

[RobertRyan]

itgut08 wrote:
Bull$hit. The Ecoboost 3.5 is every bit as tough as a Diesel

No it is not. A diesel has much better longevity. That is why you get 350,000 a I million miles out of a relatively small one.

Look at the torque curve for an Ecoboost 3.5 and even the 4 banger Ecoboosts. I know the EB 3.5 is low and flat. Efficiency is because Diesel has more energy per gallon than gas not because of the engine construction. And in theory it's cheaper to make as it's less refined.

Efficiency is from the oil used as fuel ,longevity from construction and the Diesels operating charateristics.
The Ecoboost was partially developed in Australia using Ford Australia's expertise using the 4 Litre Turbo Barra engine. Same flat torque curve,beefier construction 410hp and 415lbs ft of totque at 2000rpm. It was a straight six and advantage over a V6,. Tuners could easily make it hit 1000hp and be 'streetable". Still compared to a diesel it was heavy on fuel.
Ford 4 Litre Barra engine. 365hp, 380lbs ft at 1800 rpm torque base engine, 410hp, 415lbs ft of torque(flat torque not peak torque) at 1950 rpm.

[wilber1]

itguy08 wrote:

RobertRyan wrote:
They only sell RAMS in the US and Canada. The diesel will sell well.

Just curious how? Diesel takes more expensive fuel (more expensive than Premium). It needs DEF, needs more expensive oil (more of it), filter maintenance, etc. And it costs more than the V8...

Let's do some math:
RAM Ecodiesel

The half-ton diesel truck will carry a base price of $30,180 for a rear-drive, long-wheelbase truck with an eight-foot bed. The EcoDiesel’s price represents a $2850 premium over a similarly equipped 2014 Ram 1500 with the 5.7-liter V-8, Ram says.

And for 2014, the Ram 1500?s 5.7-liter V-8 produces 395 hp and 410 lb-ft of torque. Even though the V-8 will be offered with an eight-speed automatic, the truck’s fuel economy will be no match for the 1500 EcoDiesel. The new Ram model has a 3.0-liter turbodiesel six-cylinder under the hood with 240 hp and 420 lb-ft, and also

uses an eight-speed automatic.

So you have:

RAM 1500 Hemi: $27,330
RAM 1500 Ecodiesel: $30,180

Or:
F150 Ecoboost XL RWD: $27,345 (has more HP and the same torque with a good broad powerband).

$2800 buys an awful lot of gasoline, especially when regular hovers around $3.40 and Diesel is around $4.00...

That's why I'm not sure about the US. Canadian diesel prices are on par with regular gas, give or take. My guess is a Canadian would recoupe the cost of the diesel option io less than two years on a daily driver. Same goes for many other countries. It's your tax atructure that make diesel so much more expensive than gas

[itguy08]

RobertRyan wrote:

No you will not get an Ecoboost 5 litre. Under load they drink fuel(they have them here2 Litre versions) A turbo gas engine is not as realiable as a Diesel , less sturdy construction.

Bull$hit. The Ecoboost 3.5 is every bit as tough as a Diesel. I know, I drive one and with 60k on the clock it's perfectly fine. Diesels have to be tough to stand up to the high compression. Yes they drink fuel when you get on the boost. But a flat out Diesel drinks too. Look at the study you posted - the MPG's for the truck engines are 1-4 MPG better for Diesel.

One of the characteristics of the diesel was torque delivered at very low revs and its general efficiency over Petrol. Common rail and Tubocharging have vastly changed the nature of the diesel engine.

Look at the torque curve for an Ecoboost 3.5 and even the 4 banger Ecoboosts. I know the EB 3.5 is low and flat. Efficiency is because Diesel has more energy per gallon than gas not because of the engine construction. And in theory it's cheaper to make as it's less refined.

[RobertRyan]

Itguy08 wrote:
I'll bet there will be an Ecoboost in the next F250/350. My guess is a variation of the 5.0. I think the only reason the EB V6 is not in the F250 is because it would kill 6.7 sales...

No you will not get an Ecoboost 5 litre. Under load they drink fuel(they have them here2 Litre versions) A turbo gas engine is not as realiable as a Diesel , less sturdy construction.

think the reason Diesels "tow better" is because they are turbocharged. That's what gives them their nice flat torque curve.

Turbocharging works better at altitude as well.The modern common rail diesel are vastly better than the older type. Diesel technology is now on a pretty rapid growth path. Petrol engines do lag behind.
One of the characteristics of the diesel was torque delivered at very low revs and its general efficiency over Petrol. Common rail and Tubocharging have vastly changed the nature of the diesel engine.

Try a turbo Gas motor (like Ecoboost)and bet I it will tow every bit as well as the Diesel.

No it does not. Their is a limit to the effective size of a turbocharged petrol engine as regards tradeoffs regards power and fuel economy, not so with a diesel and it is to do with the energy in the fuel.

[itguy08]

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
Itguy08, you forgot resale value, diesels sell for a lot more then their gas counter part. My 2004 still holds a resale value of $17,400 for average $11,400 for the Hemi. That is more then the cost of the diesel option.

I think that's because yours is one of the pre EGR, pre SCR, DEF, and whatever else they put on them in later years. There are a few around here that have 7.3's that try to get $20k for a 2001-2003 with around 150k. Granted they sit but it's because "it's the last of the good ones".

[itguy08]

RobertRyan wrote:

itguy08 wrote:
Just curious how? Diesel takes more expensive fuel (more expensive than Premium). It needs DEF, needs more expensive oil (more of it), filter maintenance, etc. And it costs more than the V8

Yes I am from Australia. Although it is dearer to buy overall it is cheaper and the towing performance is vastly better, To the point that the Japanese manufactuers are dropping their Petrol(gas) options for Pickups. Europeans already have.
About a week ago this appeared in US Automobile Blog.
Diesel cost of ownership lower than GAS

Interesting study. Diesel makes sense in cars where the MPG gains are real and the added costs are low.

You can read the whole paper here: Diesel Study

They even say that the HD trucks are a mixed bag and that increasing Diesel costs will eat into the "savings". But I seriously think that it may be a wash given that everything on a Diesel costs more. With a savings of $2k, have one injector fail or something else on your Diesel and your advantage is gone.

I think the reason Diesels "tow better" is because they are turbocharged. That's what gives them their nice flat torque curve. Early non-turbo Diesels (think GM 6.8, Ford 6.9, early 7.3, etc) were dogs. Try a turbo Gas motor (like Ecoboost) and I bet it will ow every bit as well as the Diesel.

I'll bet there will be an Ecoboost in the next F250/350. My guess is a variation of the 5.0. I think the only reason the EB V6 is not in the F250 is because it would kill 6.7 sales....

[Perrysburg_Dodg]

RobertRyan wrote:

itguy08 wrote:
Just curious how? Diesel takes more expensive fuel (more expensive than Premium). It needs DEF, needs more expensive oil (more of it), filter maintenance, etc. And it costs more than the V8

Yes I am from Australia. Although it is dearer to buy overall it is cheaper and the towing performance is vastly better, To the point that the Japanese manufactuers are dropping their Petrol(gas) options for Pickups. Europeans already have.
About a week ago this appeared in US Automobile Blog.
Diesel cost of ownership lower than GAS

Now why would you go and post the truth when you can just make things up? :B
Itguy08, you forgot resale value, diesels sell for a lot more then their gas counter part. My 2004 still holds a resale value of $17,400 for average $11,400 for the Hemi. That is more then the cost of the diesel option.

Don

[spoon059]

itguy08 wrote:
I think the Diesel will flop in the Ram. Why? Cost!! You have less power than the Ecoboost or Hemi. You have higher fuel costs and higher maintenance and/or repair costs. Just makes no sense when, say the Ecoboost has the flat torque of a Diesel, OK fuel economy, lower maintenance costs, and uses cheaper gas.

You may be right... but if this engine can get 30mpg highway, 24 combined and 15 towing an RV, it blows the Ecoboost out of the water. 10% higher cost but 30 to 40% better fuel economy... that is a game changer.

[RobertRyan]

itguy08 wrote:
Just curious how? Diesel takes more expensive fuel (more expensive than Premium). It needs DEF, needs more expensive oil (more of it), filter maintenance, etc. And it costs more than the V8

Yes I am from Australia. Although it is dearer to buy overall it is cheaper and the towing performance is vastly better, To the point that the Japanese manufactuers are dropping their Petrol(gas) options for Pickups. Europeans already have.
About a week ago this appeared in US Automobile Blog.
Diesel cost of ownership lower than GAS

[itguy08]

RobertRyan wrote:
They only sell RAMS in the US and Canada. The diesel will sell well.

Just curious how? Diesel takes more expensive fuel (more expensive than Premium). It needs DEF, needs more expensive oil (more of it), filter maintenance, etc. And it costs more than the V8...

Let's do some math:
RAM Ecodiesel

The half-ton diesel truck will carry a base price of $30,180 for a rear-drive, long-wheelbase truck with an eight-foot bed. The EcoDiesel’s price represents a $2850 premium over a similarly equipped 2014 Ram 1500 with the 5.7-liter V-8, Ram says.

And for 2014, the Ram 1500?s 5.7-liter V-8 produces 395 hp and 410 lb-ft of torque. Even though the V-8 will be offered with an eight-speed automatic, the truck’s fuel economy will be no match for the 1500 EcoDiesel. The new Ram model has a 3.0-liter turbodiesel six-cylinder under the hood with 240 hp and 420 lb-ft, and also uses an eight-speed automatic.

So you have:

RAM 1500 Hemi: $27,330
RAM 1500 Ecodiesel: $30,180

Or:
F150 Ecoboost XL RWD: $27,345 (has more HP and the same torque with a good broad powerband).

$2800 buys an awful lot of gasoline, especially when regular hovers around $3.40 and Diesel is around $4.00...

[RobertRyan]

Wilber 1 wrote:
True but the Euro 6 regs taking effect in 2015 will be very similar and that is what the Europeans will be shooting for with their new engines.

That maybe true. Still a problem with US sourced diesels in Australia with CO2 and particulates. No problem with Euro sourced or Japanese engines.

Wilber 1 wrote:
Don't know about the US but think the 1500 diesel will be a hit in Canada and many other countries

They only sell RAMS in the US and Canada. The diesel will sell well.

[wilber1]

Jarlaxle wrote:
In other words: fake Jeep.

I don't know. Looks like the 4wd systems are pretty serious. Definately more off road oriented than most suv's and crossovers.

Don't know about the US but think the 1500 diesel will be a hit in Canada and many other countries.

[rjstractor]

tomman58 wrote:

Great answer.
Did it have larger brakes , wheels , tires ...no
Did it have a different trans or engine .... no
It have heavier springs, a heavy duty cooling kit but still was a 1500.

At the risk of using facts to get in the way of rhetoric, yes, that truck has a "1500" on the side of it. However, that's the only thing it has in common with the standard 1500. As mentioned it has the 6.0 V8, 4L80E trans, 8 lug wheels, 9.75 inch rear axle. The frame is much heavier than the 1500.

In fact the 1500HD is identical in specs to the pre-2001 2500! It's RGAWR is 6000 lbs., a mere 84 lbs. less than the 2500HD, and much more than the 1500.