Help a Newbie, question about gas vs. diesel

[cycler]

Towing a fw, approx 10,000 lbs, would a gas engine F250 be practical, or would it be better to go diesel? Remember I said Newbie...thanks, cycler.

This is an added question to my original post:
Worth the extra bucks for 4 whl drive?

[4x4ord]

blt2ski wrote:
Dan,


At the end of the day, figure $.50-.75 per mile or more in actual costs of a vehicle. Cost of vehicle, insurance, fuel, tires, maintenance etc. If you can write it off, great, if not, buy what pleases you, you're spending hard earned funds for fun!

Marty

I figure the cost to own and drive a new diesel vs an old gas powered truck is about $3k per year. (Based on 20k miles per year) $3k per year invested in something that earns a 10% return would result in a $172,000 pot of cash at the end of 20 years. That might be a reason enough for some people to make do with an old gas powered truck.

[blt2ski]

Dan,

Hence why using and buying a vehicle from a personal standpoint, buy what you want, as it will not pay for itself! You have the same dollars and cents equations to figure out the actual cost of things. For me, by the time I drive my rigs for 10 years, 150,000-200000 miles, if I get 2000 in trade in, be it gas or diesel, Im doing good! Then again, if you put two to three loads of gravel in the bed of a pickup on a daily basis, it gets body damage so bad, it will not matter what drivetrain you have at the trade in or sales time!
At the end of the day, figure $.50-.75 per mile or more in actual costs of a vehicle. Cost of vehicle, insurance, fuel, tires, maintenance etc. If you can write it off, great, if not, buy what pleases you, you're spending hard earned funds for fun!

Marty

[Hammerboy]

blt2ski wrote:
Cost $2000 for six years.....hmmmm...
Let's assume you paid cash, interest you could have earned on $8K at 3% or about $240 per year, time 6 years = $1450 in lost earnings, or potentially interest paid. I'd say said $8000 option cost you $3500 or so. More if interest income is better, less if lower.
Another way to look at costs...
Plus and minus between the two, their is a sticky post at top, read the twelve some odd years of comments, you will see what is good or bad about the two, time frame also can change which is better vs worst as far as fuel costs mpg savings.
You an auto worth $8000 more, comp and collision insurance will be higher, not major $$, but higher.....
Lots of ways to look at costs. It Will take many miles to pay for that $8000 difference.
Turbo part of diesel at 5000+ feet elevation is really nice. An eco boost or equal Will net the same grin factor at elevation!
Choose your poison. Don't look back!
Marty

Marty, I though about that as I was typing my last post and you can't figure out every penny on what something is going to cost over the life of a vehicle. Yes I paid $8000 more for my diesel but it will give me a much bigger down payment on the next vehicle when I trade someday whether it a gasser or diesel. So I saved by not having to borrow as much I guess on the next one, right?

Everybody's needs or wants are different. I could make the same cost analysis on buying a High Country or a Denali and investing the cost difference between them and my lowly LT trim. I just rather have the diesel than a higher trim package. My towing comfort is more important to me than air conditioned leather seats and 15 camera views.:)

Dan

[Grit_dog]

pianotuna wrote:
Hi,

I did not separate out engine maintenance--but it was all mechanical issues. For example a power steering repair, and a transmission repair.

I didn't see this post, so your cost was based on repairs as well, not just maintenance.
And power steering or trans repair isn't the cost of running a diesel engine, it's the cost of running a vehicle.
That be like me saying a gas engine costs more because the trans just get replaced in my half ton.

[Grit_dog]

pianotuna wrote:
Hi Hammerboy,

My diesel class c cost, on average, $0.25 cents per mile over a 9 year period. My V-10 costs about $0.05 cents per mile over a 10 year period.

This was for all maintenance expenses.

There were no "major" repairs to either. (crossing my fingers)

Speaking maintenance only, that doesn't make sense. There's some extenuating factors, service interval, low miles, something. Unless you were paying $2000 for a normal oil/filter and fuel filters change.

[Farmerkev]

Hammerboy wrote:
Its always funny listening to the arguments of gas vs diesel costs. I paid 6 1/2 years ago an extra $8000 and change for my diesel. Today that truck Bluebooks for $6000 TRADE IN value more than the gas equivalent. So I look at it this way, for 6 1/2 years it cost me $2000 to own that diesel if I were to trade it in today. Fuel costs are a wash as diesel cost more but gets 25-30% better mileage, maintenance is slightly more, nothing to complain about. Barring nothing catastrophic happens its not the huge cost difference some people make it out to be.

Dan

That's what I was trying to get at, in my area you wouldn't even have the 2 grand loss in the real market.
Pay the diesel tax once and then enjoy the benefits of diesel trucks the rest of your life.
Everybody is different though and I have nothing against gas trucks, just disagree it's a huge cost every time you trade.

[pianotuna]

Hi,

I did not separate out engine maintenance--but it was all mechanical issues. For example a power steering repair, and a transmission repair.

[Hammerboy]

pianotuna wrote:
Hi Hammerboy,

My diesel class c cost, on average, $0.25 cents per mile over a 9 year period. My V-10 costs about $0.05 cents per mile over a 10 year period.

This was for all maintenance expenses.

There were no "major" repairs to either. (crossing my fingers)

That's a big range between the two if we are talking just engine maintenance. When I say slightly I am referring to for example $100 for an oil change with a tire rotation (GM dealer) as I always do both at the same time, that's not high in my book. So over the long haul that is a small expense over years I've had my truck. Maybe in the Motorhome world gas vs diesel has a much bigger range but with pickups I thinks it's much narrower.

Dan

[blt2ski]

Cost $2000 for six years.....hmmmm...
Let's assume you paid cash, interest you could have earned on $8K at 3% or about $240 per year, time 6 years = $1450 in lost earnings, or potentially interest paid. I'd say said $8000 option cost you $3500 or so. More if interest income is better, less if lower.
Another way to look at costs...
Plus and minus between the two, their is a sticky post at top, read the twelve some odd years of comments, you will see what is good or bad about the two, time frame also can change which is better vs worst as far as fuel costs mpg savings.
You an auto worth $8000 more, comp and collision insurance will be higher, not major $$, but higher.....
Lots of ways to look at costs. It Will take many miles to pay for that $8000 difference.
Turbo part of diesel at 5000+ feet elevation is really nice. An eco boost or equal Will net the same grin factor at elevation!
Choose your poison. Don't look back!
Marty

[4x4ord]

gmckenzie wrote:

4x4ord wrote:

blt2ski wrote:
Farmerkev,
A normal person never pays off per say the cost if ones vehicle! So buy what you want, use what you want, call it a day. If you want a diesel, get one! Both fuels, both sets of motors have plus and minuses. Beyond that, it's not worth arguing over.
Marty

Sorry Marty but I think I must be completely missing the point of your post? My assumption is that almost everyone either pays cash for their vehicle or pays off their loan over a 3 or 4 year period. You say there is pluses and minuses to both gas and diesel but don't mention what any of those pluses or minuses are. I think the whole point of this thread is that the op is wanting to know what those pluses and minuses are. For instance the big plus of the diesel is the high torque output which makes towing a more pleasant experience. For only a 10 k trailer that plus mifht not not be enough to offset the big minus of diesel .... higher intial cost.

I think the argument is that the cost savings of a diesel over it's life are probably not going to cover the added upfront cost of the diesel. I know for me it wouldn't, but if someone tows a lot it could.

I don't want a diesel because I don't tow nearly enough and my normal commute is ~3km, so as a daily driver it would suck (had an 01 Duramax). I'd never pay off the added buying costs.

Get what you want. I'm looking at the new 6.6L and 7.3L gas motors and the numbers they put up are enough for my needs.

Ok .... and I would agree with that. A diesel, will, in most cases end up costing more to own than a gasoline powered truck. And even though a diesel isn't necessary to pull a 10k trailer those who can easily afford the little extra cost of owning one might choose to buy it for the one big hill they pull twice a year. Then there are those who buy a diesel pickup just to haul their ego around with. 🙂

[pianotuna]

Hi Hammerboy,

My diesel class c cost, on average, $0.25 cents per mile over a 9 year period. My V-10 costs about $0.05 cents per mile over a 10 year period.

This was for all maintenance expenses.

There were no "major" repairs to either. (crossing my fingers)

[Hammerboy]

Its always funny listening to the arguments of gas vs diesel costs. I paid 6 1/2 years ago an extra $8000 and change for my diesel. Today that truck Bluebooks for $6000 TRADE IN value more than the gas equivalent. So I look at it this way, for 6 1/2 years it cost me $2000 to own that diesel if I were to trade it in today. Fuel costs are a wash as diesel cost more but gets 25-30% better mileage, maintenance is slightly more, nothing to complain about. Barring nothing catastrophic happens its not the huge cost difference some people make it out to be.

Dan

[gmckenzie]

4x4ord wrote:

blt2ski wrote:
Farmerkev,
A normal person never pays off per say the cost if ones vehicle! So buy what you want, use what you want, call it a day. If you want a diesel, get one! Both fuels, both sets of motors have plus and minuses. Beyond that, it's not worth arguing over.
Marty

Sorry Marty but I think I must be completely missing the point of your post? My assumption is that almost everyone either pays cash for their vehicle or pays off their loan over a 3 or 4 year period. You say there is pluses and minuses to both gas and diesel but don't mention what any of those pluses or minuses are. I think the whole point of this thread is that the op is wanting to know what those pluses and minuses are. For instance the big plus of the diesel is the high torque output which makes towing a more pleasant experience. For only a 10 k trailer that plus mifht not not be enough to offset the big minus of diesel .... higher intial cost.

I think the argument is that the cost savings of a diesel over it's life are probably not going to cover the added upfront cost of the diesel. I know for me it wouldn't, but if someone tows a lot it could.

I don't want a diesel because I don't tow nearly enough and my normal commute is ~3km, so as a daily driver it would suck (had an 01 Duramax). I'd never pay off the added buying costs.

Get what you want. I'm looking at the new 6.6L and 7.3L gas motors and the numbers they put up are enough for my needs.

[4x4ord]

blt2ski wrote:
Farmerkev,
A normal person never pays off per say the cost if ones vehicle! So buy what you want, use what you want, call it a day. If you want a diesel, get one! Both fuels, both sets of motors have plus and minuses. Beyond that, it's not worth arguing over.
Marty

Sorry Marty but I think I must be completely missing the point of your post? My assumption is that almost everyone either pays cash for their vehicle or pays off their loan over a 3 or 4 year period. You say there is pluses and minuses to both gas and diesel but don't mention what any of those pluses or minuses are. I think the whole point of this thread is that the op is wanting to know what those pluses and minuses are. For instance the big plus of the diesel is the high torque output which makes towing a more pleasant experience. For only a 10 k trailer that plus mifht not not be enough to offset the big minus of diesel .... higher intial cost.

[Dave_H_M]

blt2ski wrote:
Farmerkev,
A normal person never pays off per say the cost if ones vehicle! So buy what you want, use what you want, call it a day. If you want a diesel, get one! Both fuels, both sets of motors have plus and minuses. Beyond that, it's not worth arguing over.
Marty

Totally agree. Not just cus you are a Mod though. :B

Get what turns your crank, not what turns someone else's crank. I tow a 10K fifth wheel with a 2012 F250 2WD cus that is what meets my needs. It is a 2012 and I don't give a flip about trade or value. I use my vehicles not trade them. And i do trek from central IL to see the daughter and grandies sometimes twice a year to just south of Myrtle Beach. BTW, the only draw back I see in my tow vehicle are the loud decals and emblems. 😉