Jumping off the Diesel Bandwagon - UPDATED

[ib516]

Well, after two Cummins diesels that I thoroughly enjoyed, I am going to place a factory order for a RAM 2500 with the 6.4L Hemi, 4.10 gears, rear air suspension, Laramie and plenty of added options. I don't care for the looks of the "Limited" with all the badges gone, and I think the cowboy theme of the longhorn is tacky.

WHY THE SWITCH FROM DIESEL TO GAS?

1) Well, when I bought my first Cummins powered truck, diesel fuel was almost always 30% cheaper than regular unleaded where I live. In recent years, that scale has tipped the other way. It used to be occassionally, and now it seems that Canada is following the trends in the USA, and it is becoming the norm. Of course this is a regional thing, but it seems here to stay. Our last road trip with my current truck, I paid $93.00 for 68L of diesel. That's $93.00 for 18 US Gallons when I topped it up. :E Regular unleaded is running $1.20/L and diesel is $1.42/L right now. That has been the trend for the last 6 months or so - maybe the last year.

2) When I bought my last two diesels, the HD gas offerings by the big 3 were gas hogs compared to the diesels. That has all but evaporated with the hp/tq war going on in the diesels, and the addition of DPFs, DEF, etc. The gas engines haven't improved much, but the diesel mpg has come down some which has narrowed the gap.

3) The gas engines just weren't all that powerful either. The 5.7L Hemi was tops at 345hp back then, the GM 6.0L was a measly 300hp, and Ford's 5.4L was a bit of a dog as I drove one 12 hrs a day in an Expedition and it didn't impress me power wise in the lighter Expedition. While the diesels today offer huge power and will certainly outperform the 6.4L Hemi I am choosing, the 6.4L Hemi is actually rated to tow more than my 5.9L Cummins, by 2500#! I know it will be a "different" towing experience with much less tq than my pumped up 5.9L Cummins, but I will live with the higher RPMs.

4) The kids are growing and we will no longer need a huge bunk house RV to save us from going nuts on those rainy days when camping. We are going to downsize to a smaller RV next time round, which will be in the next year or two.

5) Driving my 2014 Jeep Cherokee with the heated seats, new tech features, etc has me wanting a newer truck with the new features and upgraded interior from the Tupperware/Rubbermaid one in my current truck.

6) A new, loaded 2500 RAM with the Cummins is about $8,000 - $9,000 more than the same truck with the 6.4L Hemi here in Canada.

7) Lastly, the big Cummins diesel sucks to drive at -30* and -40*. It just starts blowing heat when I ARRIVE at work. I have the grill completely blocked off with a winter front, and have done all I can, this just doesn't get better. Nature of the beast.

So there you have it. Me talking myself into a new truck. 🙂

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

rjstractor wrote:

45Ricochet wrote:
Funny they have a thread over on the Cummins site which can't figure out the Bilstein single shock issue. Man they are all over the board as to why. Running out crawling under dealer trucks to figure it out. Some even demanded refunds cause their truck didn't have one.

To me it looks pretty obvious- to help prevent axle wrapup and wheel hop. My old Mazda had the rear shocks angled opposite ways for the same reason, although with only 110 ft./lb of torque it was not a big problem. 🙂

A third link shock does not really prevent axle wrapup. A solid rod would but would be harsh and cause other problems. They use the 3rd link spring shock as a buffer to control harsh shock loads to the tire.

Like I said, it's a nice setup and as far as I know only seen on race cars up till now. It's good to see it's coming around to the street stuff.

[rjstractor]

45Ricochet wrote:
Funny they have a thread over on the Cummins site which can't figure out the Bilstein single shock issue. Man they are all over the board as to why. Running out crawling under dealer trucks to figure it out. Some even demanded refunds cause their truck didn't have one.

To me it looks pretty obvious- to help prevent axle wrapup and wheel hop. My old Mazda had the rear shocks angled opposite ways for the same reason, although with only 110 ft./lb of torque it was not a big problem. 🙂

[45Ricochet]

Nice bump :B
Funny they have a thread over on the Cummins site which can't figure out the Bilstein single shock issue. Man they are all over the board as to why. Running out crawling under dealer trucks to figure it out. Some even demanded refunds cause their truck didn't have one.:W
I assume the torque management in the CTD engines mated to the auto's don't require it :H
Hey they did have the new Edge thread though :B I would pass though as you basically loose the EVIC information. Ahh tuners and kids, errrr wait I didn't say that.

[ib516]

Just as an FYI, here's a picture of the RAM 2500 rear suspension and 5th shock they come equipped with when they have the Hemi gasser or the CTD & G56 manual trans.

[Me_Again]

campingken wrote:
We went new truck shopping yesterday and after looking at what diesels now cost have pretty much decided to go gas. Since we almost exclusively use our truck for towing our horse trailer we can buy a 4x4 standard cab Chevy work, Ford XL, or Dodge Tradesman model with a V-8 and a new Honda fit type vehicle for close to what a new well equipped diesel would cost (no one out here is knocking $10,000 off the window sticker).

This way we can get 40 mpg when we buy groceries and have plenty of power to tow our 7500 pound GVW horse trailer.

Or you could offer 48 or 49K for this one. Chris

http://www.kingmandodge.com/New-2013-RAM-3500-Laramie-Kingman-AZ/vd/14765373

[campingken]

We went new truck shopping yesterday and after looking at what diesels now cost have pretty much decided to go gas. Since we almost exclusively use our truck for towing our horse trailer we can buy a 4x4 standard cab Chevy work, Ford XL, or Dodge Tradesman model with a V-8 and a new Honda fit type vehicle for close to what a new well equipped diesel would cost (no one out here is knocking $10,000 off the window sticker).

This way we can get 40 mpg when we buy groceries and have plenty of power to tow our 7500 pound GVW horse trailer.

[Wes_Tausend]

mtofell1 wrote:
If my dealer is telling me the truth.... and more accurately if the people at the "yard" are telling him the truth a 6.4 Hemi 2500 CC 4X4 will be sitting in my driveway tomorrow night at this time 🙂

It's supposed to be delivered to the dealership tomorrow AM and I'm picking it up after work.... it could turn into Friday AM.

I've got the 3.73 axle but am confident it is plenty of truck to handle my 8500lb TT. I carry lots of firewood and beer in the bed though so I'll report on how it holds up with that and all of my other "groceries" 🙂 🙂

My God! :E

I'd be worried about termites getting into my beer.

No, really looking forward to the report on the load capability.

Pre-congratulations to you and ib516. I just stuck money into an engine on my gasser TV, so all this helps validate that. Only thing is, I gotta open the hood to get that luscious new smell. 😞

Wes
...

[RescueTJ]

ib516 wrote:

mtofell1 wrote:
If my dealer is telling me the truth.... and more accurately if the people at the "yard" are telling him the truth a 6.4 Hemi 2500 CC 4X4 will be sitting in my driveway tomorrow night at this time 🙂

It's supposed to be delivered to the dealership tomorrow AM and I'm picking it up after work.... it could turn into Friday AM.

I've got the 3.73 axle but am confident it is plenty of truck to handle my 8500lb TT. I carry lots of firewood and beer in the bed though so I'll report on how it holds up with that and all of my other "groceries" 🙂 🙂

I can't wait for you to hook up to about a 8,000 lb trailer and give us a report…….

[ib516]

mtofell1 wrote:
If my dealer is telling me the truth.... and more accurately if the people at the "yard" are telling him the truth a 6.4 Hemi 2500 CC 4X4 will be sitting in my driveway tomorrow night at this time 🙂

It's supposed to be delivered to the dealership tomorrow AM and I'm picking it up after work.... it could turn into Friday AM.

I've got the 3.73 axle but am confident it is plenty of truck to handle my 8500lb TT. I carry lots of firewood and beer in the bed though so I'll report on how it holds up with that and all of my other "groceries" 🙂 🙂

[jmtandem]

I have compared with others on the Cummins forum, and several have the same pack. Mine is a very early 01 build date 4/00

That said, doesn't really matter as I am still about 1" short of using the upper overloads, even as over my GVWR that I am, still 800# to 1,000# under Rear axle rating.

Prior, I owned an '01 Ram with the Cummins and it came from the factory with the overload spring pack as shown in the picture. I never was able to get the overloads to touch even with a 2000 pound cabover camper on it.

[rhagfo]

Me Again wrote:

rhagfo wrote:


That isn't no stinking spring pack!!

This is a real 01 Camper special spring pack!

Russ, I think you will find that someone added the extra upper leaf in your picture before you purchased your truck with 200K on the clock.

I purchased my truck new in 2001 and went to NW bomber meets back in those days. Even the 3500 duallies did not have that extra overload leaf. I spend a lot of time comparing the spring packs and part numbers. The 3500 duallies look exactly like mine, however the upper over load leaf had a part number that was different by one number, but looked the same. I concluded that it was a different rated leaf.

Chris

I have compared with others on the Cummins forum, and several have the same pack. Mine is a very early 01 build date 4/00

That said, doesn't really matter as I am still about 1" short of using the upper overloads, even as over my GVWR that I am, still 800# to 1,000# under Rear axle rating.

[mtofell1]

If my dealer is telling me the truth.... and more accurately if the people at the "yard" are telling him the truth a 6.4 Hemi 2500 CC 4X4 will be sitting in my driveway tomorrow night at this time 🙂

It's supposed to be delivered to the dealership tomorrow AM and I'm picking it up after work.... it could turn into Friday AM.

I've got the 3.73 axle but am confident it is plenty of truck to handle my 8500lb TT. I carry lots of firewood and beer in the bed though so I'll report on how it holds up with that and all of my other "groceries" 🙂 🙂

[jmtandem]

I'm comparing MY two trucks - the one I have now, and the one I ordered. That's the way they are equipped.

In was in reference to this:


Quote:


Thus we have what we call grocery getter trucks(and your dozen eggs are safe), they are however not the trucks your father drove. No more install a set of air bags on your 2500 and it will do the job of a 3500 SRW.

Understood. It seems this thread started with lots of discussion on the new 6.4 gas engine; and is ending with a major difference of opinion regarding coil springs vs. leaf springs as it applies to hauling and towing. I certainly would not consider the new 6.4 gas or your 2007 Cummins a grocery getter. My 2005 Cummins has a payload of 4700 pounds and I have carried an approximately 4000 pound camper on it. It handled it well after air bags and overload suspension bumpers. But I guess perception is reality and reality irrevelant in these discussions and to the Volvo and Freightliner drivers a one ton pickup is the grocery getter. In 2007 you purchased a truck that was 'state of the art' at the time to be a workhorse for your RV; time has moved on and technology has passed by the 2007's capablities, but that does not make it any less of a truck nor does it make it a grocery getter.

[ib516]

jmtandem wrote:

2014 2500 6.4L Hemi gasser with 4.10s:
- 22,500 lb GCWR
- 10,000 lb GVWR
- 5500 front GAWR, 6500 rear GAWR
- 15,500 lb tow rating

2007 3500 SRW 5.9L Cummins diesel with 3.73s:
- 21,000 lb GCWR
- 10,100 lb GVWR
- 5200 front GAWR, 6200 rear GAWR
- 13,150 lb tow rating

Which one is the grocery getter again

It would be more meaningful if you compared both engines with the same axle ratios and same years. Your new 6.4 gas will compare to a 6.7 Cummins with 850 foot pounds and a 4.10 axle at almost twice what the 6.4 will tow especially if the 6.7 is a regular cab non optioned basic truck that is a dually.

I'm comparing MY two trucks - the one I have now, and the one I ordered. That's the way they are equipped.

In was in reference to this:

Thus we have what we call grocery getter trucks(and your dozen eggs are safe), they are however not the trucks your father drove. No more install a set of air bags on your 2500 and it will do the job of a 3500 SRW.

[jmtandem]

2014 2500 6.4L Hemi gasser with 4.10s:
- 22,500 lb GCWR
- 10,000 lb GVWR
- 5500 front GAWR, 6500 rear GAWR
- 15,500 lb tow rating

2007 3500 SRW 5.9L Cummins diesel with 3.73s:
- 21,000 lb GCWR
- 10,100 lb GVWR
- 5200 front GAWR, 6200 rear GAWR
- 13,150 lb tow rating

Which one is the grocery getter again

It would be more meaningful if you compared both engines with the same axle ratios and same years. Your new 6.4 gas will compare to a 6.7 Cummins with 850 foot pounds and a 4.10 axle at almost twice what the 6.4 will tow especially if the 6.7 is a regular cab non optioned basic truck that is a dually.