Need Your Screw Method Advice - 1968 Travel Queen Resto Mod

Oh and yes, I want to get all these posts into a sort of document for those coming after me. Preferably digital. Not exactly sure how just yet. :)

AnEv your comments are quite perceptive.

Yes, that back area has special considerations quite different from the front, not the least of which is the different support necessary due to the lack of truck bed support for the rear 6-8 inches and also the lesser amount of plywood wall due to openings and the constant in and out traffic of body weight plus folding step mount. There was an original angle iron bumper across this. I plan to build something similar, but with more size and support and less fasteners into just the rear 2x2 span board.

I guess I had lots of these thoughts in my head and was only asking about a preferred screw method of the two I was considering as a portion of the overall fastening support in these areas.

And I am very grateful to you all as your comments and skills have helped a lot in trying to think about a best way considering all of it together. That's quite a task I am finding. And it would really be easy to get bogged down in too many possibilities and give up the whole thing (that isn't going to happen btw).

This whole camper is an example of "spreading the load", built in flex, areas failing due to improper loads such as non-original designed tie-downs, and failure due to water intrusion.

Regarding "glued" joints, of course the reason that works well is because of spreading the load over the whole joint as opposed to the screw locations only. No doubt it is strongest albeit reducing flex. But - there are other ways, and no, glue wouldn't have been needed in the front wall as that joint was fine. The back few inches of the floor were rotted, so I replaced the whole floor. Same thing with many of the plywood walls.

Back utility areas and doorway cleats or steel angle brackets are a distinct possibility. And ticki2's thoughts on the overlapping sides is actually going to happen on the sub-box side walls. I'll explain why when we get to that part of the build. I've been thinking the cleats thing too back there, I am just so hesitant putting too much material removal into these plywood walls. I think the original engineers thought so too and why they used straps.

My intention has been to use several fastening methods in a same location, each using a minimal stress on the materials of that area, but with all together giving it that "share the load" feature. For example, the sheet metal siding itself is part of the camper's overall structural support.

There are probably no absolute correct answers here, and there are likely many excellent options and choices, and of course some that are "much better" than others.

It's fun huh?

AnEv, very thoughtful post. Will answer more detail when I get to a real keyboard instead of phone.

I briefly went back , Im sure theres a picture though I didnt find, of the area at back.
But is there something that precludes adding a block behind the section of wall between door and tank access? Preferably hardwood, or maybe a piece of steel angle, but using bolts, pair thru floor & block and thru (plywood) wall & block. T or elevator bolts.

While perimeter sides or even along the front of camper using pocket screws strongest of the options and the strapping assisting, Im seeing from the back wall, the door-and from inside the bath door, simply a lot of concentrated/constant forces applied at that span. Its also only area, albeit short, unsupported when in truck.
Pocketing that small section of back wall simply subject to movement, a lot of force relying on pocket screws in ply to my eye failure, at least I wouldn't. Just an opinion.

Last comment is about down the road, using pocket screws thru wall into floor, means removing the siding to access. Printing out your posts here for the 'next' person would give them insight to how its constructed. I personally wouldn't make allowance 'ease of disassembly' Unless I though I might. Certainly not at the expense maximizing strength for a very remote possibility this camper would see a second rebuild. (or how much of that rotted wood that you removed would you have noted or mattered that it was also 'glued'.)

Remember wood glue and gorilla glue gets hard and brittle. Best glue in the world is TiteBond Construction adhesive the non environmental stuff if you can find it. 9 years ago we glued studs to a concrete wall and would not come off/ had to split them off with a chisel.

I'm sayin it again... this glue is not lip service to an oratory it's the real McCoy

Oh and yes nycsteve, the pockets will all be covered by other materials - metal siding in most cases. I've got a slightly different cover planned for the sub-box sidewalls, and I've got a plan for pocket screws on those surfaces now too.

Thanks kohldad. Excellent points.

But it won't be here because I'm attaching assemblies. I have to think of that guy coming after me, if you know what I mean.

Built right, the next guy won't have to come behind you for repairs. Second, if I was the guy behind you, I would much rather have to deal with the glue and know it was built right, not half way. If I'm having to disassemble a piece, odds are one piece or the other will be trash any how.

Do an experiment, with make four test plywood corners. Use each of the two methods with and without glue. Let sit for just 30 minutes and try to pull apart. I just about guarantee that once you do, you will use the pocket screw with glue method. It is the glue, not the screws that give it the strength.

In regards to only having 1/2" of plywood left, it is like having a 1/2" beam spanning 1/4" which is extremely strong. Again, do the test.

Your camper, do as you want. My experience is from years of watching a good cabinent maker, my father, and building my own stuff. If I want it to last forever, I always use glue and pocket screws.

#2 as sending a screw from below though the ply will split and or weaken the plywood. Will the pockets in the wall be covered to cosmetically hide screw heads?

I appreciate all the responses. I too prefer the pocket screw method except for the one drawback, that of removing so much material from the plywood while making the pocket. And after making the pocket there is only approx 1/2" of plywood to pull on and attach to the framing below. But in truth I guess it really is a minimal amount removed, and it may be an adequate thickness remaining - however weakened, and since nobody has commented on that issue perhaps I am concerned for no good reason.

Alternatively, as stated, it may well be too difficult to locate the center of the plywood by screwing in from below, and of course the screw threads can push the plywood apart, causing splitting. But consider that the original floor was only attached on these edges with the sheet metal strapping and I'll also add the metal, and there is great support and strength on the sides with the carriage bolts, so there isn't as much strength needed in the screws as maybe felt by most of us, especially since this will be a minimally used "hanging" strength, rather than a normal "sitting support" strength.

Then again the rest of the camper is attached into the plywood, due to the nature of the roof/sidewall assembly, so going in from the bottom may simply be following the pattern. Those screws will be every 3-6" and there is a run of rubber gimp between with the screws that are meant to pull the materials tight into the gimp. In some of the rest of the camper I have pre-drilled the attached pieces larger to allow the screw to pull the "attached" tight into the "attachee". Attachee?

The splitting issue has been tested out in another post. Meaning the splitting might not be too big a concern, especially since although it's a #8 screw (for the length) I planned a 5/32" pre-drill instead of the 1/8" being used for the #7 screws.

Yes, the screws are more brittle than other designs but are probably strong enough for the overall method - every few inches where nails were originally used (for the walls edges anyway). And yes, rust (corrosion) compared to stainless, that's been discussed and I hope I made the right decision weeks ago, but time will tell.

So then if minimal strength per fastener is actually needed,then perhaps my concerns about the thinner attached thickness for the pocket screws is unwarranted. (thought bubble).

Glue? Yes, I love glue, and it is in many important places throughout the camper. But it won't be here because I'm attaching assemblies. I have to think of that guy coming after me, if you know what I mean. Most of the camper is being built to allow dis-assembling in major pieces for future rebuilding or repair. And there is the rubber gimp at the joint so the wood on wood doesn't exist anyway. The cleat idea is good too. But I've been finding the floor jack putting pressure from below seems to hold things tight enough while fastening. We'll see on these spots.

Full length metal strap as opposed to several smaller straps? Yes, I kinda like that idea. I was thinking along those lines too. But I wonder if the thicker is necessary. I bought that aluminum flashing weeks ago for such use, planned to double thickness it to reach approximately the thickness of the original straps, which were scrap siding. I have a third neighbor building part of a camper and he used some of my flashing and was plenty pleased with the results of a single thickness. He expressed to me the belief of plenty of strength because of no shear pressure. The pocket screw jig is his btw.

And the pocket screws on hand are anti-corrosive coated, better strength and lifespan than the gold construction (sheetrock) screws.

Someone mentioned they were enjoying the rebuild threads, good that makes me happy too.

So I guess I'll do the pocket screw method. Overall I agree, it really seems to be the preferred method of the two.

Thanks again for all the input. As said in The Money Pit, "The camper is going to be great!"