New guy, quality question

Take heed of the advice on tow rating and especially the cargo capacity of the truck and the tounge weight of the trailer loaded. I think in all cases you run out of cargo capacity (meaning what the trailer tounge will load the truck, well before the towing capacity of the truck is reached.

s far as quality, its mostly visual that is of concern, as every trailer/motorhome nomater how expensive will give you issues to deal with. A freind just bought a $700,000 mh this summer and it has spent more time int he shop than living in it. Name brand mh to boot.

If you don't have the patience for warrantee work, skill to fix, or $$$ to fix, suggest you stay with a tent. That said, I love my last few trailers, but non of them came without a few problems, most I could fix myself.

Good luck.

campigloo wrote:
Not exactly a perfect comparison, but I bought a 2011 Keystone Outback and have been very happy with it. A few minor warranty issues the first couple of months, but overall a quality product. Keystone was extremely helpful and quick to respond when I had a big problem with the dealer. They straightened that several thousand dollar problem out in less than 2 hours.

I had a similar situation with my Keystone. The dealer was saying "Not covered" and when I contacted Keystone, they said "No problem!"

Not exactly a perfect comparison, but I bought a 2011 Keystone Outback and have been very happy with it. A few minor warranty issues the first couple of months, but overall a quality product. Keystone was extremely helpful and quick to respond when I had a big problem with the dealer. They straightened that several thousand dollar problem out in less than 2 hours.

The first thing you need to do is figure out the max. payload and what the max. weight of trailer is before you consider a TT's quality and weight.

As already said, you will run out of payload before you reach towing capacity. Do NOT go by the advertised payload capacity or what is on the door jamb sticker. And anything you've added takes away from the payload capacity, as does a WDH of about 100 lbs. If you've added a canopy, that's around 150-200 lbs. Since you say your towing capacity is 7900 lbs, it looks like you have model no. 8339 according to this Toyota data: 2012 Tundra towing specs. Payload capacity is shown as 1315 lbs.

If you use the Toyota payload figure of 1315 lbs (which may/will be less) subtract an average weight of cargo, passengers, pets, groceries, camping gear, firewood, etc., of 400-500 lbs and 100 lbs for WDH. Using the 500 lbs for total cargo wt., that leaves you 715 lbs of available payload capacity.

Tongue wt. can vary between 10-15%. Don't use an average of 12%. You will have NO idea what it will actually be until you buy the TT and weigh it. Tongue wt. on our TT is slightly under 15%. Take the 715 lbs payload. cap. and divide that by 0.15 and you get 4767 lbs for max. gross weight of the TT you can pull without overloading it. If you happen to end up at the low end at 10%, you'd be able to tow up to 7150 lbs max. actual weight. 12% = 5958 lbs.

Forget about factory listed dry weights. Never, ever use them for a buying decision if TV capacity is a concern, You can end up in serious hot water afterwards. The actual weight of our TT is 200 lbs under the GVWR and we only have some very ordinary stuff in it for camping. Always use the GVWR unless you know for certain what the actual wt. is going to be.

Additional weight of cargo you add to a TT, things you may add (2nd TV eg.) and things the dealer installs adds weight. Around 1,000-1,500 lbs. typically. For two TTs in a row (20' & 29') we've been at about 1500 lbs. Using the 1500 lb figure, and using the "average" tongue wt. of 12%, that gives you a dry wt. of 4558 lbs. as a max. wt. you can shop for. Not a heckuvalot....

GCWR may not be an issue, but I would also watch that too. Another thing is you want to avoid towing near the max. towing capacity. It won't be pleasant towing. You'll be slow to accelerate and will be a dog on hills. I doubt you'll end up anywhere near 7900 lbs tow max. though.

You really ought to go to a CAT scale and find your TV's weight. And when you get a TT, same thing.

Since you are going to end up weight restricted, you will probably end up looking at ultra-lites. Be wary. Very wary. Ultra-lites are of less substantial quality overall in order to save weight. Everything in them is "minimalist". This means they will be less durable and more prone to problems. Some of them now have an I-beam made from 3 pieces of sheet steel (lengthwise). These have more flex in them than the typical forged I-beam and can lead to some serious problems down the road.

Forgetting about TV towing limits, I would look at either Outdoors RV or Northwood products for best quality. People love their Outdoors RV units and I have only read about minor warranty issues. Quality means a weight penalty though. These two manufacturers also make their own frames. Substandard quality in the TT industry is the norm unfortunately and the trick is finding one of better substandard quality.

My last trailer was a Keystone Hideout and this one is a Forest River Wildcat. From a quality standpoint, both of mine were pretty good. My opinion would be that the Forest River product is better built than the Keystone was. That being said, if I found a floorplan on a Keystone product that I really liked, I wouldn't have a problem buying it.

LeeMajors wrote:
What weight and brand would you recommend?

It's quite common to run out of payload, long before you reach the rated tow capacity.

GVWR is gross weight rating for the frame, wheels, tires, brakes, and power train. What the truck is designed to carry.

Payload is what is left out of GVWR after you deduct scale weight.

You need to know your available payload, that will tell you the tongue weight you can carry.

To get your available payload, get GVWR from drivers door sticker. Load the truck for camping (full fuel, kayaks, etc) and weigh it on CAT scale. Do not use advertising numbers for GVWR or payload. Add 100 lbs (approximate weight of WD hitch) to actual truck weight and subtract the number from GVWR. The result is what you have for any additional passengers, cargo, and tongue weight.

With that info, you can do your calculations on trailer weight.

Some tips:

Average load in the trailer (dishes, pots and pans, BBQ, camping chairs, bedding, groceries, tools, spare parts, fresh water, etc) is about 1000 lbs.

Average tongue weight is twelve percent of loaded trailer weight.

Example:

Trailer UVW is 4000

4000 plus 1000 camping load = 5000 loaded X .12 = 600 lbs tongue weight.

We have no way of knowing what your cargo (on the truck) weight is. Without that, we and you, are only guessing.

There aren't any light Arctic Fox trailers. Ours is 31 ft, 11k. I alwys tell people to jump up and down on the kitchen floor. If the salesman has a fit, run, or worse the floor collapses.

LeeMajors wrote:
Toyota uses SAE standard J2807, so towing isn't quite as skewed as the 150 pound guy driving the truck solo. However, you guys seem pretty insistent that 5000# is too much trailer. What weight and brand would you recommend?

Personally if the truck is rated for 7900# then I don't think you'll have any problem with 6K and your family.

Toyota uses SAE standard J2807, so towing isn't quite as skewed as the 150 pound guy driving the truck solo. However, you guys seem pretty insistent that 5000# is too much trailer. What weight and brand would you recommend?

LeeMajors wrote:
I realize I'll never pull a dry trailer. That's why I'm not considering anything over 6000#, and most of them are under 5000#, which leaves me close to 4000# for fuel, water, passengers, gear, etc. I'll never actually carry that much, we're used to going light, having tent camped so much (we once did a week with me, wife, and kids in a honda civic, from Tacoma WA to Yellowstone and back) We've always been minimalists until now.

Any insight on quality of those travel trailers would be appreciated.

Your math isn't right, you'll run out of available payload before you load 1/4 of those numbers. This is an often unknown fact, 1/2 ton trucks are really limited by their payload, the amount of weight that can be carried by the truck. In your case, it's around 1500 lbs.
The hitch weight of the trailer and the weight distributing hitch will add around 800 lbs. That will leave you 700 lbs, of fuel, passengers, and gear. Load everything right to the limit and it will not be an enjoyable towing experience.
The trailers you've listed are all middle-grade, usual quality (or lack thereof).