Well, we finally picked up our 2017 Northstar 12' STC! In this thread I will try to review the camper in general and also our solar/lithium install as it progresses. I know there isn't yet a lot of info on this model, so I hope this helps others with their decision making.
Basics:
Truck is a 2014 Ram 3500 Laramie, CC, DRW, diesel, Aisin, 4.10, with no suspension mods. GVWR 14000, payload 56xx lbs. Added a DeeZee bed mat, Torklift Tiedowns and Fastguns. Before loading the rear wheel well height was 46 3/8", loaded with camper 39". Looks like it still sits fine.
We took the rig to a CAT scale on the way home. Weight includes:
Heki skylight, AC, bunk bed, new flip up footrest, 7 cuft Norcold DC compressor fridge, 13' awning, passthrough boot to truck, 4 aluminum chairs, wireless rearview camera, cassette toilet, maggie rack, dually swing out brackets
2x full propane, ~8 gal water
4 solar panels, 400Ah lithium batteries, controllers, BMS, inverter, 2 cheap temporary 12V batteries
Full tank of diesel, 360lbs of people and very minimal personal stuff
Torklift tiedowns, Fastguns, bed mat
Steer axle 5460
Drive axle 7720
Gross 13180
We were a little surprised to be this heavy already. We are still missing our 2nd son, the fresh water, food, clothes, toys, and STUFF.
MPG were roughly 19 unloaded with mostly interstate driving, 13mpg loaded coming back with interstate and lots of stop and go and some back roads. Hubby says truck handles fine but we did notice some sway on certain roads. Might add some Stableloads.
We had the dealer mount 4 160W panels on the roof (yes, I am aware of possible AC shading:R). As we chose to get 400Ah of lithium batteries, we will be doing the rest of the solar/battery install ourselves. I will post as our install progresses over the next 2 weeks or so. I have all major parts here but needed more measurements and hands on camper before I could narrow down placement of components and order cables and such.
We think the inside looks BIG despite the no-basement, no-slide thing! So far, overall we are VERY pleased with the quality of construction. This thing is SOLID. Fit and finish looks great. There were 2-3 minor things the dealer fixed right away. There is an unattractive "dimple" on the front cabover fiberglass that we will probably have the dealer take care of in August as we pass through on vacation. He says he will add some support from the inside to bubble it back out.
There is no wall switch for the bathroom lights, so one must reach to the ceiling to push one of the tiny LED light switches. Could be interesting groping for that at night.
They have added the flip up footrest to the dinette to make seating more lounge-like. Haven't tried it out for comfort yet. There is now also an extra removable cushion on the step up to the bed for extra seating. They made fixed backrest cushions instead of the loose ones. Nice 4-hook coat rack at entry. No more tiny umbrella/walking stick cabinet at door. Also, there is now a really nice sliding generator tray in the back (we don't want a genny).
Mods we requested:
additional insulation (not sure what that really ended up being)
Driver side shelved wardrobe (like passenger side) instead of standard shelf and drawer
requested NO TV and antenna delete
delete window above bunk bed
7cuft compressor fridge (hated the absorption fridge hassles)
few more 12V/USB plugs
2 separate 110V plugs strictly for 1500W inverter power (microwave, etc.)
Things we wanted that they FORGOT or changed:
add shelving in kitchen pantry/wardrobe (rod is useless to us)
more fat solar wire pre-installed (can't use the single run they added, has changed our solar wiring approach a bit)
rearview camera is now prewired only (dealer installs unit) but with an on/off switch on back cabinets instead of more logical prewire into running lights (could however turn it on at night to see "visitors", welcome or not)
Couldn't accomodate:
larger FW tank
wanted to initially delete the Heki but the hole was already cut
We spent 2 nights in our camper at the dealer with full hookups while they worked on stuff. An employee hooked up temp coach battery in reverse prior to our arrival, blew 30A fuse, we didn't know since we were on shore power and forgot to check 12V side (duh). At home we wondered why our lights weren't working. Also discovered that 7-way pin from Ram to camper stays on when truck is off. Must now remember to pull the plug if we stay parked (DC fridge!) or will have to come up with some permanent disconnect (we really don't want the alternator to charge the lithiums anyway)
I must admit we were getting a bit (a LOT) frustrated by Bill's (dealer) lack of communication after we put in our order in Mar/Apr. There were sooo many ignored emails and a few phone calls. After 30 years in the Army, we were used to near immediate response times and have been having a hard time adjusting to the "civilian" flow, or lack of it.
After living on Bill's lot for 2 days and working with him and his son, we fully understand why: he is incredibly busy with a severely undersized staff! He hasn't had a day off since January, hasn't seen his wife for a month. He is really a GREAT guy, willing to accommodate anyone, hands-on, does it all. We had to totally forgive him for neglecting us. However, the place is a bit inefficient which is part of his chronic behind-schedule problem.
We can highly recommend him. Rex was also willing to accomodate some of our whims (threw in some extra wood and paneling so we could build an additional matching box for some of our battery components).
First pics, more to come.
Basics:
Truck is a 2014 Ram 3500 Laramie, CC, DRW, diesel, Aisin, 4.10, with no suspension mods. GVWR 14000, payload 56xx lbs. Added a DeeZee bed mat, Torklift Tiedowns and Fastguns. Before loading the rear wheel well height was 46 3/8", loaded with camper 39". Looks like it still sits fine.
We took the rig to a CAT scale on the way home. Weight includes:
Heki skylight, AC, bunk bed, new flip up footrest, 7 cuft Norcold DC compressor fridge, 13' awning, passthrough boot to truck, 4 aluminum chairs, wireless rearview camera, cassette toilet, maggie rack, dually swing out brackets
2x full propane, ~8 gal water
4 solar panels, 400Ah lithium batteries, controllers, BMS, inverter, 2 cheap temporary 12V batteries
Full tank of diesel, 360lbs of people and very minimal personal stuff
Torklift tiedowns, Fastguns, bed mat
Steer axle 5460
Drive axle 7720
Gross 13180
We were a little surprised to be this heavy already. We are still missing our 2nd son, the fresh water, food, clothes, toys, and STUFF.
MPG were roughly 19 unloaded with mostly interstate driving, 13mpg loaded coming back with interstate and lots of stop and go and some back roads. Hubby says truck handles fine but we did notice some sway on certain roads. Might add some Stableloads.
We had the dealer mount 4 160W panels on the roof (yes, I am aware of possible AC shading:R). As we chose to get 400Ah of lithium batteries, we will be doing the rest of the solar/battery install ourselves. I will post as our install progresses over the next 2 weeks or so. I have all major parts here but needed more measurements and hands on camper before I could narrow down placement of components and order cables and such.
We think the inside looks BIG despite the no-basement, no-slide thing! So far, overall we are VERY pleased with the quality of construction. This thing is SOLID. Fit and finish looks great. There were 2-3 minor things the dealer fixed right away. There is an unattractive "dimple" on the front cabover fiberglass that we will probably have the dealer take care of in August as we pass through on vacation. He says he will add some support from the inside to bubble it back out.
There is no wall switch for the bathroom lights, so one must reach to the ceiling to push one of the tiny LED light switches. Could be interesting groping for that at night.
They have added the flip up footrest to the dinette to make seating more lounge-like. Haven't tried it out for comfort yet. There is now also an extra removable cushion on the step up to the bed for extra seating. They made fixed backrest cushions instead of the loose ones. Nice 4-hook coat rack at entry. No more tiny umbrella/walking stick cabinet at door. Also, there is now a really nice sliding generator tray in the back (we don't want a genny).
Mods we requested:
additional insulation (not sure what that really ended up being)
Driver side shelved wardrobe (like passenger side) instead of standard shelf and drawer
requested NO TV and antenna delete
delete window above bunk bed
7cuft compressor fridge (hated the absorption fridge hassles)
few more 12V/USB plugs
2 separate 110V plugs strictly for 1500W inverter power (microwave, etc.)
Things we wanted that they FORGOT or changed:
add shelving in kitchen pantry/wardrobe (rod is useless to us)
more fat solar wire pre-installed (can't use the single run they added, has changed our solar wiring approach a bit)
rearview camera is now prewired only (dealer installs unit) but with an on/off switch on back cabinets instead of more logical prewire into running lights (could however turn it on at night to see "visitors", welcome or not)
Couldn't accomodate:
larger FW tank
wanted to initially delete the Heki but the hole was already cut
We spent 2 nights in our camper at the dealer with full hookups while they worked on stuff. An employee hooked up temp coach battery in reverse prior to our arrival, blew 30A fuse, we didn't know since we were on shore power and forgot to check 12V side (duh). At home we wondered why our lights weren't working. Also discovered that 7-way pin from Ram to camper stays on when truck is off. Must now remember to pull the plug if we stay parked (DC fridge!) or will have to come up with some permanent disconnect (we really don't want the alternator to charge the lithiums anyway)
I must admit we were getting a bit (a LOT) frustrated by Bill's (dealer) lack of communication after we put in our order in Mar/Apr. There were sooo many ignored emails and a few phone calls. After 30 years in the Army, we were used to near immediate response times and have been having a hard time adjusting to the "civilian" flow, or lack of it.
After living on Bill's lot for 2 days and working with him and his son, we fully understand why: he is incredibly busy with a severely undersized staff! He hasn't had a day off since January, hasn't seen his wife for a month. He is really a GREAT guy, willing to accommodate anyone, hands-on, does it all. We had to totally forgive him for neglecting us. However, the place is a bit inefficient which is part of his chronic behind-schedule problem.
We can highly recommend him. Rex was also willing to accomodate some of our whims (threw in some extra wood and paneling so we could build an additional matching box for some of our battery components).
First pics, more to come.
Mission complete, mostly. Everything is installed and hidden. Malfunctioning parts replaced. Things seem to be doing what they are supposed to but we are parked in our driveway which doesn't get much sun at all.
Installed the upper stableloads, here are some wheel well height #s:
driver rear: 40 1/4 no load, 37 3/16 loaded, 38 1/8 loaded with Stableloads
passenger rear: 43, 39 3/4, 40 3/4
So, upper stableloads reduced sag by an inch loaded (my previous sag #s in 1st post were off).
The cover to the new "box" under the fridge that hides everything solar/lithium/inverter isn't optimal in terms of how the cables had to be run and protrude. Maybe we will revisit in the near future.
Installed the upper stableloads, here are some wheel well height #s:
driver rear: 40 1/4 no load, 37 3/16 loaded, 38 1/8 loaded with Stableloads
passenger rear: 43, 39 3/4, 40 3/4
So, upper stableloads reduced sag by an inch loaded (my previous sag #s in 1st post were off).
The cover to the new "box" under the fridge that hides everything solar/lithium/inverter isn't optimal in terms of how the cables had to be run and protrude. Maybe we will revisit in the near future.
Ok, the solar/lithium system is now installed, minus some tacking down, trim work, sheathing, etc. The installation has been interesting, frustrating and weirdly fun! The whole process took 5 times as long and more $$ than one would have thought.
Although the basic design was figured out long ago, the actual placement of components and wire runs was an ongoing development. The whole process was 2 steps forward, one or two steps back...LONG process for us.
Our objectives were to use the current battery box as much as possible and keep all other components in as small a footprint and as close to the battery compartment as possible.
The original battery box only holds 3 out of the 4 100Ah batteries. We decided the 4th would sit adjacent to it on the floor in front of the fridge. This necessitated a homemade box to blend it all together. Rex from Northstar was kind enough to give us some extra paneling and trim material that will be used.
The 1500W inverter was supposed to go across the "hall" and live in a cabinet on the kitchen side. That meant running the 2 2/0 cables down through the floor,underneath the camper, and back up to the battery side. Not keen on losing part of the cabinet and feeling the weight of the 2/0 cable, we decided it would be easier to keep the inverter on the battery side with all other components. This would keep the distance super short and now make the 2/0 overkill! It will be easier to run the 2 110V cables under the camper to meet the preinstalled 110V cable ends that can feed the microwave and another designated inverter receptacle.
So, after tinkering with placement of all pieces and parts and their necessary cables, we fit everything into as tight a package as possible. TIGHT! We have built the box to take up the minimum floor space so we could still walk by without losing toes, and hold all components securely and safely. Two new holes in the backside of the dinette/battery box allow cables to pass between the compartments . In addition, the various parts that need ventilation should have plenty as 2 sides of the new box will have removable vents that will also help with some access. There will be a lift-up lid on top. If we have a major problem, the box can be fairly easily disassembled and the whole front half removed to allow full access. We have added around 10-15 lbs of wood/screws/bolts/L-brackets, etc...
The original battery box holds:
3 100Ah batteries in parallel, each with strip of cell balancers connected in series, wood strips to prevent sliding, strap
The custom box holds:
1 100Ah lithium battery w/cell balancer strip (all batteries are wired in parallel with 2/0 cable and copper lugs)
1 300A battery terminal fuse
iBCS battery control system ("the brain")
2 Blue Sky SB2512iX-HV solar charge controllers
2 30A fuses (car audio AGU glass) used as switches to disconnect solar panels
2 30A Blue Sea circuit breakers
1500W High Surge GoPower pure sine inverter
1 Class T 300A fuse
various pos and neg terminal studs, lots of cables/wires
It all looks like a mess, but follows a very logical layout (only if you are familiar with the flow ;))
The iBCS has a LCD video display that allows us to view battery pack info including individual cell temp and voltage, etc. The IPN ProRemote display talks to the charge controllers (now mostly hidden) and shows us all ins and outs of solar/charging. There is also a small 3 switch plate, one that is the master iBCS/battery output disconnect, one is a momentary switch that scrolls through the iBCS video displays, the 3rd was a blank which will be used to provide a convenient (and cheap) remote inverter on/off switch (small hardwire terminal on rear of inverter).
Initially we were going to mount the displays and switches on a wall in the dinette (and even moved the nifty clock to the other side to make way) but decided we would get tired of hitting our heads on them. Instead of cutting largish holes into the paneling to be able to flush mount the displays, these 3 units now reside in a "command central" box that my husband constructed with scrap wood and the paneling from Rex. It is located on the blank wall near some other switches at the entrance. We put it low so we could still use the space above and the coat rack without interfering with the displays.
The 4 160W solar panels came prewired with #12 that terminated in MC4 connectors. To keep it simple and reduce loss, we plugged in #8 MC4 cables that join at the top inside of the fridge roof vent. These cables have EXTREMELY stiff insulation and are a pain to make sharp turns (like over the fridge vent lip). We don't completely like it and may replace them with different #8 cable in the future.
Panel 1&2 in parallel go to one controller, panels 3&4 in parallel to the second contoller. Two sets of #4 cables run down the vent (supported with clamps) and snake into the gap under the fridge and out to the front.
As the wall and base under the fridge are the outside walls of the camper, we didn't want to risk drilling to pass any cable through. That means the cabling protrudes through the front fridge trim piece and turns down into the new battery box. Not optimal. We will have to camouflage them somehow or modify in the future. All the little wires that run to the switches and displays feed out the same run under the fridge in a plastic wire loom and come through a small drilled hole into the back of the mounted display box.
The SB2512iX-HV charge controllers are supposed to take a max of #10 wire in their tiny terminals!! Try finding a 8mm spade or fork lug for a #4 cable! I managed to cleanly cram bare #8 under those tiny screws. That means I had to splice some short #8 pieces in my overall #4 runs. I don't think it will add much loss.
The GoPower inverter asks for #2 cable and a 200A Class T fuse. It wasn't easy, but we managed to cram the 2/0 cables into the terminals (stupid design if you ask me). Overkill for my short runs, I know, but we already had this fat cable on hand. We put in a 300A fuse.
We did all our own lugging with a nifty, cheap, and effective little tool from Amazon (got nearly everything through them).
Bill from TCW only mounted the 4 panels on the roof for us, EVERYTHING else was up to us. He showed us some self-fusing silicone rubber tape which we used instead of various sizes of heat shrink tubing around all connections. That tape is amazing stuff! Go buy some!
Did a quick test of systems today. Everything is talking and "working". However, according to Murphy's Law, one of the 16 circuit boards of the cell balancer strings out of whack, so will have to get replaced under warranty. Also, the iBCS programming didn't quite take correctly (only reads half of the battery voltage for each cell, which is too low and shuts down automatically). Larry from Starlight Solar in Yuma, AZ has a replacement on the way.
I'll post more pics once everything is done!
Although the basic design was figured out long ago, the actual placement of components and wire runs was an ongoing development. The whole process was 2 steps forward, one or two steps back...LONG process for us.
Our objectives were to use the current battery box as much as possible and keep all other components in as small a footprint and as close to the battery compartment as possible.
The original battery box only holds 3 out of the 4 100Ah batteries. We decided the 4th would sit adjacent to it on the floor in front of the fridge. This necessitated a homemade box to blend it all together. Rex from Northstar was kind enough to give us some extra paneling and trim material that will be used.
The 1500W inverter was supposed to go across the "hall" and live in a cabinet on the kitchen side. That meant running the 2 2/0 cables down through the floor,underneath the camper, and back up to the battery side. Not keen on losing part of the cabinet and feeling the weight of the 2/0 cable, we decided it would be easier to keep the inverter on the battery side with all other components. This would keep the distance super short and now make the 2/0 overkill! It will be easier to run the 2 110V cables under the camper to meet the preinstalled 110V cable ends that can feed the microwave and another designated inverter receptacle.
So, after tinkering with placement of all pieces and parts and their necessary cables, we fit everything into as tight a package as possible. TIGHT! We have built the box to take up the minimum floor space so we could still walk by without losing toes, and hold all components securely and safely. Two new holes in the backside of the dinette/battery box allow cables to pass between the compartments . In addition, the various parts that need ventilation should have plenty as 2 sides of the new box will have removable vents that will also help with some access. There will be a lift-up lid on top. If we have a major problem, the box can be fairly easily disassembled and the whole front half removed to allow full access. We have added around 10-15 lbs of wood/screws/bolts/L-brackets, etc...
The original battery box holds:
3 100Ah batteries in parallel, each with strip of cell balancers connected in series, wood strips to prevent sliding, strap
The custom box holds:
1 100Ah lithium battery w/cell balancer strip (all batteries are wired in parallel with 2/0 cable and copper lugs)
1 300A battery terminal fuse
iBCS battery control system ("the brain")
2 Blue Sky SB2512iX-HV solar charge controllers
2 30A fuses (car audio AGU glass) used as switches to disconnect solar panels
2 30A Blue Sea circuit breakers
1500W High Surge GoPower pure sine inverter
1 Class T 300A fuse
various pos and neg terminal studs, lots of cables/wires
It all looks like a mess, but follows a very logical layout (only if you are familiar with the flow ;))
The iBCS has a LCD video display that allows us to view battery pack info including individual cell temp and voltage, etc. The IPN ProRemote display talks to the charge controllers (now mostly hidden) and shows us all ins and outs of solar/charging. There is also a small 3 switch plate, one that is the master iBCS/battery output disconnect, one is a momentary switch that scrolls through the iBCS video displays, the 3rd was a blank which will be used to provide a convenient (and cheap) remote inverter on/off switch (small hardwire terminal on rear of inverter).
Initially we were going to mount the displays and switches on a wall in the dinette (and even moved the nifty clock to the other side to make way) but decided we would get tired of hitting our heads on them. Instead of cutting largish holes into the paneling to be able to flush mount the displays, these 3 units now reside in a "command central" box that my husband constructed with scrap wood and the paneling from Rex. It is located on the blank wall near some other switches at the entrance. We put it low so we could still use the space above and the coat rack without interfering with the displays.
The 4 160W solar panels came prewired with #12 that terminated in MC4 connectors. To keep it simple and reduce loss, we plugged in #8 MC4 cables that join at the top inside of the fridge roof vent. These cables have EXTREMELY stiff insulation and are a pain to make sharp turns (like over the fridge vent lip). We don't completely like it and may replace them with different #8 cable in the future.
Panel 1&2 in parallel go to one controller, panels 3&4 in parallel to the second contoller. Two sets of #4 cables run down the vent (supported with clamps) and snake into the gap under the fridge and out to the front.
As the wall and base under the fridge are the outside walls of the camper, we didn't want to risk drilling to pass any cable through. That means the cabling protrudes through the front fridge trim piece and turns down into the new battery box. Not optimal. We will have to camouflage them somehow or modify in the future. All the little wires that run to the switches and displays feed out the same run under the fridge in a plastic wire loom and come through a small drilled hole into the back of the mounted display box.
The SB2512iX-HV charge controllers are supposed to take a max of #10 wire in their tiny terminals!! Try finding a 8mm spade or fork lug for a #4 cable! I managed to cleanly cram bare #8 under those tiny screws. That means I had to splice some short #8 pieces in my overall #4 runs. I don't think it will add much loss.
The GoPower inverter asks for #2 cable and a 200A Class T fuse. It wasn't easy, but we managed to cram the 2/0 cables into the terminals (stupid design if you ask me). Overkill for my short runs, I know, but we already had this fat cable on hand. We put in a 300A fuse.
We did all our own lugging with a nifty, cheap, and effective little tool from Amazon (got nearly everything through them).
Bill from TCW only mounted the 4 panels on the roof for us, EVERYTHING else was up to us. He showed us some self-fusing silicone rubber tape which we used instead of various sizes of heat shrink tubing around all connections. That tape is amazing stuff! Go buy some!
Did a quick test of systems today. Everything is talking and "working". However, according to Murphy's Law, one of the 16 circuit boards of the cell balancer strings out of whack, so will have to get replaced under warranty. Also, the iBCS programming didn't quite take correctly (only reads half of the battery voltage for each cell, which is too low and shuts down automatically). Larry from Starlight Solar in Yuma, AZ has a replacement on the way.
I'll post more pics once everything is done!
