Probably dumbest question ever

[Heyruthie]

Hi, all. I'm new to even *thinking* about getting an RV. But due to unusual family circumstances, I am considering purchasing an RV to live in, on my own property. I live in a fairly unregulated area, with zoning laws that do allow it, based on the acreage and the circumstances that I have.

However, I know nothing about RVs (except that I enjoyed staying in one with family members, as a child) including whether there are ways to "hook up" your RV in a residential area. I know the electricity hookup is totally different. And the water situation needs to be addressed. But I have absolutely no problem hiring a plumber and an electrician to come install the correct stuff. I just don't even know if it's physically possible--particularly the plumbing. Is there a way to empty black and gray water tanks at home without an RV-style sewer hook-up? I live in an area that does get freezing temps in the winter, but not most of the time.

Please don't flame me. I know I sound uneducated--and that's because I am. But I'd love to change that! Thanks for your help in advance.

[myredracer]

Hey Ruthie, (sorry, how can anyone resist saying that? :B )

What can be done would depend on how long you plan to do this and how much money you want to spend to make it more livable and bearable in the temp. extremes you'll have where your are. $$ can start to add up if you want to do all the right stuff.

This made me think of the article in the latest Trailer Life magazine where a guy lived in a smaller TT by himself through one winter up in the Yukon. Pretty extreme and a fun read on how he handled it.

You don't need an actual "power pedestal" like in a campground. You can get a 30 amp RV receptacle installed in a 4x4 PVC outlet box and mount it on wood post. If you end up using an extension cord of some type, don't have the plug & connector exposed to the elements. Same if you mount a 30 amp recept. on a post.

Heated underbellies are very inefficient because a duct(s) goes directly from the furnace into the underbelly and then goes into the outdoors. You will find yourself going through a lot of propane and the furnace running a lot in the winter (noisy too). There are electric heating blankets that can be attached to the bottom of a tank, but you'd have to remove the underbelly material to do that. Then you'd also have to install heat tape and maybe insulation. The best thing to do would be to start with a true 4-seasons (aka polar) model and I believe some have an option of ordering the tank heaters. A proper 4-seasons TT has thicker walls and substantially upgraded insulation throughout like the Outdoors RV Windriver for example.

If you're buying a used TT and it's not a 4-seasons unit, I'd install plywood skirting around the perimeter down to the ground. Rigid foam on the inside of that will greatly reduce heat loss. Would be a good thing on any TT too. This way you could run a water line right underneath so it won't freeze up.

I would plan on using an oil-filled electric heater or a cube heater to supplement the furnace. Oil-filled is noise-less and would allow you to hear the TV. You will want "solid" voltage too. If it tends to drop often and gets too low (which is more likely in a rural area), you can have problems. I'd get as a min. a simple plug-in voltage monitor. Best is an EMS unit (Progressive Industries or TRC) that automatically monitors the power and will shut down if needed. You need to consider the overall length of run between the TT and the panel in the house and maybe out to the street. What is the wire size to the garage? You'll be adding another 30 amps on top of what's there now. You CANNOT connect to 220 volts - MUST be 120 volts only if you have a 30 amp service in the TT. If it is a 50 amp, 220 volts is okay but you MUST have a 3rd wire for a neutral present. Make sure all grounding and bonding is up to snuff for safety reasons (ask your electrician). Might even make sense to run wire/cable directly from the house to the TT (ask electrician).

You should look into how to reduce moisture buildup inside in cold weather and along with that, ventilation. Good thread going in this forum at the moment.

You could get a 500 gallon or so holding tank buried in the ground next to the TT to dump the black tank into. This would greatly cut down the number of visits and costs of a guy going out to pump your TT out. It's okay to leave grey tank valves open but only if you have a sewer or holding tank in the ground. The only way to avoid not having to deal with a black tank valve all the time would be to install a residential flush toilet in place of the RV type, which can be done but a lot of work. And if flushing into a holding tank in the ground, you're flushing more water into it than an RV toilet. If you installed an in-ground holding tank, you'd just get an ordinary septic tank pump truck in. Call one and find out how much they charge per visit.

Does the old house have a septic system? Is it up to adding your RV to it? You can always add a cleanout fitting if you can find out where the piping is buried. Code has required an outside cleanout in recent years but probably not 60 years ago. If there is a septic system, you may want to get the tank(s) pumped out. They normally should be every couple of years and you don't want problems in the dead of the winter.

Have fun.

[Heyruthie]

OK. So I'm in complete understanding with the electricity. I have a wonderful electrician who can come and put in anything that I need. I'll get him on the calendar.

As far as the water, I'm still at a standstill. I was pretty sure I haven't seen a sewer clean out, and I went out to double check, and I don't see one. The house is 60 years old. Is it possible that they didn't put those in during that time period? The only thing I can find that is in the ground is the underground access to my water meter. But that's not sewer, and there is no clean out in there--I know, because I went out with tools and opened the lid, just to make sure. So, with it looking like there's no sewer clean out, will I need to deal with finding the nearest dump station? It's MILES away.

[opnspaces]

Sounds like you're close to a workable solution. But heed Westends last post.

You need 120v AC to power your trailer. If you manage to plug your trailer into that 220 V outlet in the garage it will instantly fry the microwave, air conditioning, the refrigerator and possibly the converter. Many people on this forum have done the same and they report multiple thousands of dollars in repair costs after making this mistake. Get an electrician and tell them you need 120V AC that you can plug the trailer into.

As far as the sewer, see if you can find a sewer cleanout plug outside of the house. If you are lucky it will be near where you want to park the trailer. If you're really lucky it will be within 20 feet and have a 3 inch threaded cap. Either way if you can find the cleanout you can use a macerator pump to drain the tanks into the cleanout and not have to even go in the house with the hose. pump kit

With a macerator and a 3/4 inch garden hose you can empty the tanks into a sewer cleanout 100 feet away and even uphill. It's a bit slower than the 3 inch slinky hose, but it will get the job done.

[westend]

You will want 120V, 30 amp RV service receptacle installed. Look for a clean out pipe exiting the ground near the house. An RV macerator pump can be attached to your RV and the sewage pumped to the clean out pipe.
Good luck.

[Heyruthie]

Excellent idea, and I'm sorry for the delay--busy week!

Geography: I'm in the state of Virginia, so we get both freezing temps in winter, and heat in summer. But both are in moderation. We have a month or so in winter when we can get snow and ice, and a month or so in summer, when the temps can get into triple digits.

Property layout: On the property is the "main house" with a very large, modern, well constructed detached garage with full electricity, its own circuit breaker, plug for an A/C unit (220, I think?) The garage does NOT have any form of water, either in the form of incoming (tap) or outgoing (sewer.) The main house and garage are about 30 feet apart, and connected by an enormous asphalt driveway, which is in excellent condition. There is a hose spigot off the main house by the driveway. There is a door off the main house, right onto the driveway, and 12 feet inside the door is a half bath (toilet and sink) and laundry facility, including a laundry sink. The house is on sewer, not septic. (The main house also has electricity, of course, but the garage has AMPLE electricity to spare, and the 220 plug is right there off the driveway.) So, within 15 feet in either direction, there is water, electricity, a toilet and a hose.

Maybe a diagram is better. I will try to post.

[2012Coleman]

It would be easier to use an existing toilet than pump stuff into it from a 25 - 40 gallon holding tank. It sounds like you will be in the vicinity of an existing home. Does it have a septic system? Is there a sewer clean out someplace? This is an access cap to the existing sewer line used for maintenance if necessary. Maybe ask a plumber.

[pira114]

I think it'll be easier if you describe the specific property. You mentioned an existing toilet. So is that on the property?

Tell us exactly what type of utilities the property has, where it is geographically so we can recommend seasonal issue fixes, and any other unique issues for your situation.

If you're willing to do the work and put in the miney, what you're wanting to do is actually very doable. Several of my neighbors are doing this.

[Old-Biscuit]

Heyruthie wrote:
OK, these are all VERY helpful responses. I'm going to go re-read this thread several times, and start considering the things you are sharing--very informative! A few other questions:

-Some people seem to indicate that they "just use an extension cord" if the electrical source is nearby. Even as a temporary measure, I thought this could damage your RV electrical system! Is that not true? Now I'm confused.

-There is no way to flush waste tanks into an existing toilet, right? (Gross, I know, but I'm just looking at ways that might even be temporary.)

-Are there specific models that have the "enclosed underbelly" that anyone can recommend?

Thank you!

Extension cord.........some have used an extension cord with adapters to plug into a 15A outlet. That will provide enough AC power to run converter (charge batteries) and the Television.
NOT for living in unless you use propane for fridge/water heater No microwave and probably A/C Unit.

Now if you already have a 30A RV outlet you can use with an extension cord..YES (That would be an regular 120V AC outlet wired for RV plug NOT 240V 30A outlet wired for welder/dryer etc. 120V AC only be it 15A, 30A or 50A)

You can purchase a portable macerator that connects right on end of RV waste drain line........uses 12V DC and can pump waste (black/grey) up to 100' with a 2' rise thru a 3/4" garden hose.

I have one.....FloJet Portable Macerator. Use it to pump into sewer cleanout at back of sisters house when I visit (75' plus and at least 2' rise)
Pumping into toilet could work.......toilet bowl will continue to evacuate as bowl level rises provided no blockage which shouldn't occur cause macerator grinds up solids to flow thru garden hose


Enclosed underbellies is probably available on just about every brand anymore. Entry levels maybe not but entry level is not what you would want to live in.

AND you can always enclose/insulate underbelly your self. Big Box hardware stores carry 'coroplast' (plastic cardboard) and 'reflextic' (aluminum backed insulation) plus couple boxes of self taping screws

[Heyruthie]

OK, these are all VERY helpful responses. I'm going to go re-read this thread several times, and start considering the things you are sharing--very informative! A few other questions:

-Some people seem to indicate that they "just use an extension cord" if the electrical source is nearby. Even as a temporary measure, I thought this could damage your RV electrical system! Is that not true? Now I'm confused.

-There is no way to flush waste tanks into an existing toilet, right? (Gross, I know, but I'm just looking at ways that might even be temporary.)

-Are there specific models that have the "enclosed underbelly" that anyone can recommend?

Thank you!

[kknowlton]

If your budget and availability allow, I would recommend getting a trailer that has an enclosed underbelly with ducted heat, and tank heaters. At worst, tank heaters will be a help in those below-freezing nights. That will help protect your water system from freezing - which can cause big damage if it occurs.

Propane can be replaced fairly easily, but it is an expensive way to heat. Just FYI.

[Chrisatthebeach]

It can be done with planning. I lived in two of mine for close to 6 years while relocating for jobs. As far as on your own property it depends on the area you live in. There are many rural counties in GA and SC where things are not zoned or even checked. Most that do this around here have the power company put up a construction pole, then have a local put in a well and septic system, if your land already has that then your biggest expense is done. Some in this area even purchase small tracts of land where an old house once stood and it has a well and septic system in place.

I did 3 1/2 years in northern Kentucky through some brutal winters, I did it out of necessity but would not do it again, the other part of the time was here on the SC coast where we rarely see freezing, that was easy.

Chris

[naturist]

westernrvparkowner wrote:
If you are going to be living in something full time and not moving it, get a used mobile home. It will be roomier, better insulated, designed for what you are wanting to do and probably cheaper.

There are also what are called "park models," which are designed to be placed once and left.

The drawback to RVs is not only that they are not designed heavy duty enough to live in but the sewer system is designed to be filled up and then dumped manually a couple times per week. This gets old fast in a live-in situation where you have a sewer hookup. A used mobile home or park model does not have a holding tank, but is designed to dump/flush directly to a sewer system, saving a bit of hassle as well as "one more unnecessary design feature."

[westernrvparkow]

If you are going to be living in something full time and not moving it, get a used mobile home. It will be roomier, better insulated, designed for what you are wanting to do and probably cheaper.

[rbpru]

RVs are often used for long term stays but generally they are fair weather shelters.

If you have the hook ups it is doable but humidity and single pane Windows plus the lack of side shirts to the ground make it tough in the winter.

I guess what we are saying is, RVs are designed for short term recreational occupancy. They must be adapted to full time use.

Good luck