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Small TT Capable of handling cold weather

bobka7914
Explorer
Explorer
Greetings. My wife and I enjoy some cold weather tent camping in January with our pooch each year at Algonquin Provincial Park/Mew Lake Campground near Whitney Ontario! We currently have a 4 season Cabelas XWT 12x12 tent with electric heaters to keep us cozy and warm (Mew Lake has electric hookups!). It is very peaceful and beautiful. You can literally hear a snowflake hit the tent. Friendly, gregarious Chickadees & Nuthatches will eat bird seed right out of your hand. You have the whole campground to yourself. Anyway, we're getting a little older now and getting tired of hammering and removing tent stakes in the ground. So, we're contemplating buying a Toyota Highlander (or similar vehicle) with a small TT, something like a i18 Cobblestone made by Travel Lite. It has a heated holding tank pads. Or, is there a small TT (with Q bed, small kitchen, dinette, bath with small sink/shower) that you can recommend for that has year round camping capability (NE US, SE Canada)? Also, what can we do, if anything, to be able to use that will negate damaging the water tanks and lines in cold weather? Can a manufacturer add any options that will minimize tank/line freeze ups? Thank you for your advise. Hope to graduate from tent to trailer in '15!
14 REPLIES 14

Fast0ne
Explorer
Explorer
Well I just did two weeks in our tralier. It's a 20ft holiday rambler 187qb. The weight on the tralier is uvw of 2900 pounds and loaded and on the scales it was about 3300 pounds or so. I tow with a 06 chevy colorado with a 3.5 Inline 5. Had no issue towing through the mountains of BC.

We were at a full hook up site. The temps were -9 over night and about -1 during the day. Only single pane windows which was a bit chilly but closed the blinds all was good.

My wife was there 24/7 so heat was always on and it did keep a great 20 or so degees. With using heat none stop for two weeks and the stove and oven also propane for extra hot water for a shower. We only went through 2 and a half bottle of propane and we have 20 pound tanks.

We do have a inclosed underbelly but no heated tanks. And had no issues what ever with freezing.

Only thing I will recommed if doing winter camping is make sure the bathroom has a heat duct in it. We had the dealer run one into our bathroom we had two extra ports off the heater. Here in Canada it's nice having heat in there.

Best of luck on your search.
2013 Holiday Rambler 187QB
2006 Chevy Colorado Xtream Crew Cab I5 240hp 250ft torque

rexlion
Explorer
Explorer
I think a Highlander V6 will handle a TT the size and weight of that Cobblestone just fine anyplace except on long grades at higher elevations. I towed a similar size, but somewhat lighter (2700 lb loaded) KZ Escape E14RB and the long climbs around the Rocky Mountains were the only place where it struggled, necessitating 40 mph in 3rd or (adding in a strong headwind to boot) 2nd gear. Mind the 500 lb hitch weight limit, and buy one with the tow package which I believe includes extra cooling.

If you want to go one better, the Jeep Grand Cherokee and Dodge Durango have higher tow ratings and hitch weight rating. The V8 with the 8 speed transmission will have an easier time than the older trannies they used to use in those vehicles. But even the V6 should do it... unless you plan to head out west sometime, that is.
Mike G.
Liberty is meaningless where the right to utter one's thoughts and opinions has ceased to exist. That, of all rights, is the dread of tyrants. --Frederick Douglass
photo: Yosemite Valley view from Taft Point

FrankShore
Explorer
Explorer
The Lance frames are very strong. Unlike most RV manufacturers, Lance uses huck-bolting instead of welding on their frames. This is why I suggested a Lance. Welding has a tendency to rust, etc. With the huck-bolting, you don't have that issue! Also, the heated enclosed holding tanks (and gate valve) in the Lance is a propane heating system, not a 110v deal. Lance also uses Azdel, which is a thermoplastic which has a high R-value and also eliminates the mold and mildew in the walls.
2014 F-250
2014 Minnie Winnie 2351DKS (Traded In-Burnout-Use A Surge Protector!)
2015 Arctic Fox 22G (Great Trailer But Heavy - Traded In)
2018 Lance 1685 w/ Solar & 4 Seasons Package
1999 Beneteau 461 Oceanis Yacht
En Norski i en Fransk båt - Dette må jeg se!

SteveAE
Explorer
Explorer
bobka7914,

There is a lot to consider when setting a trailer up for winter camping. Most should be able to handle lows in the teens and 20's if it warms up above freezing during the day. But as you go colder, these factors come into play.

While light, insulation still has weight. So, all other factors being equal, a better insulated trailer will weigh more than a poorly insulated one. You will also have more clothes, boots, etc. that do add up in cargo capacity.

Compared to a wall tent, RV's have less usable space (bath, galley, Q bed, water heater, refrigerator, furnace, fancy cabinets, etc. all eat up a lot of space). And in the winter, we spend more time inside. So don't go too small.

Driving on packed snow is like driving on very bad washboard. It beats things up. So a well built, sturdy (which usually equals heavy), trailer is important to me. Not to offend the owners of the ultra-lite trailers, but you may want to take a look at the frame of whatever you are considering and compare it to the frame of something like the Artic Fox or Big Foot (neither of which I have). IMO, heavy frame = sturdy trailer.

Most tank heaters require either a shore power connection or a generator. I don't know if the places you like going offer this or not. Many manufactures (of "Four Season" rigs) will put the tanks inside an enclosed and heated space ("basement"), with a duct from the built in propane furnace into that space. This works well for all but the most cold conditions.

Keep in mind that when you get home, you have to drain and winterize the rig (I do this multiple times a winter). This can be difficult in freezing conditions (a real PITA), so you may have to heat the drain valves to be able to open them (I have built foam boxes with a heater that I place under the trailer for this purpose)

Power!!! If you have plug-ins, then no problem. But if you boondock, this is a problem. Not only do you use a lot more power in the winter (i.e.; heater fan and lights), but batteries have less available power when they are cold. So you may want to consider increasing battery capacity over what the rig comes with. More batteries = more weight. Without starting the 12 volt vs. 6 volt debate, I prefer two 6 volt batteries in series over two 12 volt batteries in parallel (I have two such pairs...or 4 batteries).
Of course, you will need some means of charging these batteries. Plug in, generator, and solar (I have 300 watts) are the most common methods.

If you do have plug-in's, then it is tempting to use a electric heater for your heat. But keep in mind that if your trailer has a heated basement, and you only use electric heaters in the cabin area, there may not be enough heat in the basement to keep the tanks and pipes warm. Fans can be used to circulate air where needed...but this also uses power...

Propane usage is higher in the winter. How much??? So many factors, but keep in mind that you may want more than just one bottle. (With lows in the single digits, I use about 5 pounds per day)

Big picture windows are nice, but are also a big hole in the trailer wall. And when it is really cold, you will wind up covering them anyway. Good quality double pane windows are a very nice option if you can get them (I had custom made ones built for my trailer). Warmer and reduced condensation.

Slide out's are very nice (I have one), but also are a source of cold air infiltration.

Absorption type refrigerators (of the type used in many RV's) don't work well when cold. There are solutions (that usually require power), but just something to keep in mind as you size the battery bank.

If I was to do it again, I would give strong consideration to the Artic Fox line. However, that said, I really don't believe that there is a perfect solution on the market and that all rigs are nothing more than compromises.
So I would choose a "Four Season" rated trailer that I liked the best and that I could tow ....and be prepared to make modifications.

Happy Shopping,
Steve

nomadictxn
Explorer
Explorer
I really think that almost anyone will tell you to go superlite with little options or get a vehicle more adept at towing. Buying a tow vehicle capable of easily hauling a load thats set up from the factory with a brake controller, trans cooler etc. Can be cheaper and safer in the long run.
nomadictxn
2013 RAM 1500 QC 5.7, 3.92 4x4 6 sp.
2021 Flagstaff E Pro 19FBS

bgum
Explorer
Explorer
Casita small light has low maintenance

gtkato
Explorer
Explorer
I towed our 2012 Lance 1685 with a Nissan V-6, then a Durango V-8. Both struggled and strained on Mountain roads. I would say the Highlander would be straining most of the time except on flat terrain.
The 1575 would tow great, and even smaller would be an R-Pod with tank pads.
FlyFishn
2017 Cirrus 820 Truck Camper, Torklift, Rear view camera, solar, glow steps, roof rack
2012 GMC "Texas Edition" 2500 HD Duramax, MBRP exhaust, Fuel wheels, Toyo Open Country tires, Sumo springs, Torklift stable loads

profdant139
Explorer II
Explorer II
Although Fun Finders are not advertised as true four-season trailers, we have just come back from a trip to Utah in very cold weather (9 or 10 degrees every night, days in the high 30s), and our trailer passed the test! So I would say that you might consider one of the well-insulated small Fun Finders. You could probably add heat tape to the tanks, as long as you are going to a campground with hookups.

Here is a link to our blog posting, where we discuss the trailer's ability to handle the cold:

Utah in November -- small trailer, very cold weather, no problem
2012 Fun Finder X-139 "Boondock Style" (axle-flipped and extra insulation)
2013 Toyota Tacoma Off-Road (semi-beefy tires and components)
Our trips -- pix and text
About our trailer
"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single list."

handye9
Explorer II
Explorer II
Check out Rockwood Mini Lite series. They can be had with electric holding tank heaters, thermopane windows, and heated mattress. There are a couple models that fit in your weight range.
18 Nissan Titan XD
12 Flagstaff 831FKBSS
Wife and I
Retired Navy Master Chief (retired since 1995)

GENECOP
Explorer II
Explorer II
Look at Bigfoot and Oliver Travel Trailers..

FrankShore
Explorer
Explorer
You should get the definitive answer at the group online that is dedicated to Lance Owners Lance Owners of America Someone there will tell you if you can tow the 1685 with whatever tow vehicle you want to buy.
2014 F-250
2014 Minnie Winnie 2351DKS (Traded In-Burnout-Use A Surge Protector!)
2015 Arctic Fox 22G (Great Trailer But Heavy - Traded In)
2018 Lance 1685 w/ Solar & 4 Seasons Package
1999 Beneteau 461 Oceanis Yacht
En Norski i en Fransk båt - Dette må jeg se!

magnusfide
Explorer II
Explorer II
Only the 6 cylinder Highlander can tow a trailer. They state it's rated at 5000 lbs but it does require special modifications for the rad at the very least. When we had a trailer we went with the rule of thumb of towing at least 1000 lbs less than the max rating. This gave us the room to tackle mountains and other challenging terrain without straining the tow vehicle.

There are a number of ways to deal with winter even without the extra insulation. I do recommend heated tanks if you do quite a bit of camping below 32F but you can get those as an option from most mfrs.
We did a thread recently on winter camping ideas for an RV.
http://forums.woodalls.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/28077385.cfm

Examples of heated water hoses here
http://www.campingworld.com/category/hoses-reels-fittings/189
"The only time you should fear cast iron is if your wife is fixin' to hit you with it."-Kent Rollins
First law of science: don't spit into the wind.

Magnus

bobka7914
Explorer
Explorer
Thanks for the suggestion!!! I like the 1575, but like the layout and capacities of the 1685 even better. However the dry weight of 3405 lb dry weight concerns me. Do you think it may be too much for a 2015 Highlander XLE with a 5k towing capacity to pull adequately and safely?

FrankShore
Explorer
Explorer
You should really look at a Lance 1575. They're just right for a Highlander to tow and they're 4 Season. They're on the pricey side, but you're getting what you pay for. Lance Travel Trailers
2014 F-250
2014 Minnie Winnie 2351DKS (Traded In-Burnout-Use A Surge Protector!)
2015 Arctic Fox 22G (Great Trailer But Heavy - Traded In)
2018 Lance 1685 w/ Solar & 4 Seasons Package
1999 Beneteau 461 Oceanis Yacht
En Norski i en Fransk båt - Dette må jeg se!