Suggestion for small 4 season TT please

With your list of must haves, 4 seasons, shorter length, and budget, the field narrows dramatically...Why not look in another field? (or pond for that matter):B

Ice Castle Fish House 17RV mfr site.

Ice Castle Fish House 17RV at dealer

They advertise heavy duty cargo trailer-style construction, spray foam insulation, They show 2 x 3 wall studs, lots of room for insulation.
Maybe you could custom order one without the "fishing holes" in the floor? Seems like a well built unit, certainly designed to withstand the elements. If you stay put for awhile, you could "drop-it" just about anywhere?

Edit: look at their standard features and options, seems they could build you whatever you wanted, and insulate it far beyond the typical RV options.
Ice Castle features/options

Hey, you have to get creative these days, and with your list...

I've got a Jayco Whitehawk 25BHS that's a "4 season" rig with additional insulation in what they call the Glaicer Package.

The way they explained it to me at the dealership was that unless you're getting a bespoke, custom made TT specifically for extreme weather adventures, the 4 season rating should be taken with a grain of salt. A 4 season camper should have a sealed underside with winterized pipes and be able to keep the pipes from freezing in average winter temps. Insulation varies but mine is rated to efficiently heat down to 0 degrees and efficiently cool up to 100 degrees with the heat running though the floor to help keep the pipes from freezing.

I doubt there exists such a thing as a mass produced TT or motorhome that can withstand say the coldest months of a North Dakota winter and the hottest campgrounds in Death Valley.

I'm new to towing and I've learned so far that there's always a trade-off between weight, performance features and expense. You can only pick 2. So if you want a lightweight rig with awesome features, be prepared to pay and so forth.

Anyways, I'd recommend Jayco. They have a super teardrop called the Hummingbird which is similar to an RPOD.

stevennlv wrote:
Well city "camping" may be the wrong term? To me I'm permanently camping all the time now b/c I don't have a fixed structure to call home any more. I'll spend almost all of my time at some park somewhere with a *full* hook up.

I took "city camping" to mean Walmart parking lot or "stealth" camping on a quiet residential street.

Still finding a 3 burner stove AND a larger refrigerator/freezer will be very difficult in a smaller TT.

RandomAbstract wrote:
My choice would be an Outdoors RV Creekside 21RBS. Visited their factory last year. Very impressed.

I would already have one but it is pushing the limit for my Grand Cherokee.

I've done a lot of research on the whole ORV line. Most of the stuff I have read has been positive. That unit is out of my price range. And it is 25' long.

They have other units a little shorter, but not by much. And with my neck being the way it is I'm worried about having to pilot something in the 18'+ range with no assist.

I'm still working my way through the list compiled earlier. I've eliminated about half so far as either completely unsuitable, too expensive and / or too long. I still have to look at the lances, escapes, bigfeet, olivers, casitas, scamps and camplites.

Although at first glance that 13' scamp may be just the thing.

The search continues...

My choice would be an Outdoors RV Creekside 21RBS. Visited their factory last year. Very impressed.

I would already have one but it is pushing the limit for my Grand Cherokee.

RedRocket204 wrote:
If you've not read through the first post on the thread linked below, do it. Although the information is primarily derived from RVing in the snow with much lower temps than you'll most likely see, there may be some valuable information gleaned from it. Portland experiences freezing temps, possibly snow, at least a couple times per season. It may not happen every season but freezing temps at least a couple times per season was my experience living on the north west coast of Oregon for 9 years.

Winter RV camping

Thanks, lots of good info in there. Some new, some I figured out the hard way this past winter (my first winter in a TT). I bookmarked it for future reference.

Some nights last winter in Vegas in January were borderline crappy at best. When it hit 28 degrees with winds @35mph sustained, gusting to 70 the heat would run non-stop. The propane bottles were sucked dry quickly. And with the air in Vegas already being so dry the heater running all night would make the air in the TT so dry that my sinuses would bleed at night as I slept. That makes for a fun morning.

I've learned a lot about winterization, moisture control, ventilation and the "terrarium" by trial and error. If I had been staying in this TT I had been planning to add a skirt before winter hit again. As it was I was sucking bottles so quickly that my best solution at the time was to get the park management to agree to allow me to drop a 120 gallon tank that is on a remote monitor / auto-refill schedule.

I don't want to get stuck again needing to resort to that. Unlike most parks this place actually prefers long-term work campers. There are folks that have been here 7-8 years. But most places are not going to let me drop a big tank. And I don't really want to get tied down again like that at the moment. It required a 3 year contract and I'd have to schedule their truck 10-14 days in advance to come get their tank out of my way before I could hook up to the unit to pull out if I wasn't leaving it here for her. That kind of delay could cause big problems at most parks.

If you've not read through the first post on the thread linked below, do it. Although the information is primarily derived from RVing in the snow with much lower temps than you'll most likely see, there may be some valuable information gleaned from it. Portland experiences freezing temps, possibly snow, at least a couple times per season. It may not happen every season but freezing temps at least a couple times per season was my experience living on the north west coast of Oregon for 9 years.

Winter RV camping

Well city "camping" may be the wrong term? To me I'm permanently camping all the time now b/c I don't have a fixed structure to call home any more. I'll spend almost all of my time at some park somewhere with a *full* hook up. Part of the plan to survive on my own is to get camp host / work camper jobs to help offset rent and utilities.

Thanks everybody for the input.

stevennlv wrote:

With the bigfeet, olivers and lances pulling ahead on low maintenace and weatherability.

"Eggshell" TT (full fiberglass like Oliver, Scamp, Casita) will likely last longer.

stevennlv wrote:
I plan on mostly city camping. The ex was more in to the roughing thing.

Whoa ! This changes a lot of things !! With no electric hookup you are going to have to be more "creative". No way to heat under the camper and battery power is not going to last more than 1 or 2 days when running a furnace.

Don't forget, you need fresh water and a place to dump waste.

stevennlv wrote:
I just started this search. I've found recommendations on line about wintering in these smaller units by doing things like using a skirt and putting a ceramic heater underneath on an ext cord run from the podium.

No experience, but it sounds like a very good idea and probably the only way to prevent pipes from freezing ! I would rest the heater on a couple of bricks so that it is up off the ground. Make sure you have a good HD cord (12 gauge). I would not worry about fire.

If you really are paranoid about fire, rig up a sheet metal shield so that the heater is not directly pointing at anything. You could even temporarily put a smoke detector underneath when you are running this heater.

stevennlv wrote:
Something I noticed in the brochures I've seen so far is that the ones in this size range (~14'?) do not have a "full" fridge, I.E. no freezer and only have a two burner stove.

You are not likely going to find either of those in a small TT ! Good luck.