Hello all wise ones out there! I plan to hit the road full-time next spring. I will drive a fair amount to explore much of this grand country I call home-including some mountain areas (Rv at the park and unhitch is an option) and boondocking on BLM. I have a 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4X4, Summit with tow package, V8, 5.7L. Max towing 7200lb, max payload 1050lb, GVWR 6800lb.What is the max TT weight I can safely tow? I have my eye on a Dutchman Kodiak 2500rbsl, ship wt 5400, hitch weight 596, cargo max wt 1185. If so, any recommendation on anti-sway bars and WDH? I will need to add trailer auto brake, right? What else?I LOVE my Jeep and really do not want to sell for a truck. Hope this works but if not, what weight do I need to be under? I will need to re-do my TT search options!Thank you, in advance all you kind folks!

Your payload will be your limiting factor. Start with the payload capacity then subtractpassenger weight, items carried in Jeeps weightHitch weight. What you have left is your available tongue weight.When looking at advertised tongue weights remember those are without Batteries, propane and tanks, plus a portion of whatever you put in the forward part of the trailer. Normal tongue weight should be about 12% of the total trailer weight.

Weight while in many cases is the limiting factor, size also comes into play. Start looking at trailers in the 20 foot or under range. Trailers much longer could create a tail wagging the dog situation that you definitely would not like. You need to load your Jeep up like it would be when trqveling, kids, wives, dogs, cats, ice chests, toys etc, and drive acoiss a set of scales. That subtracted from the vehicles GVWR as listed on the drivers door post tag will tell you your net cargo capacity. Remember, any trailers you look at are without anything in them. So disregard the advertised dry or shipping weights. Instead take 12-15% of the trailers GVWR as your worst case tongue weight. Does that number fit under your available payload?

Thanks, KerrlakeRoo-but I'm not sure I follow. If max Jeep payload is 1050 and person, TT hitch wt, sway bar (170+596+100 = 866), that leaves me with available tongue weight of 184? Is this right? Does not take into account Jeep cargo, front TT cargo, propane tanks or batteries...I am missing something?

UntetheredExplorer wrote:I am missing something?Yeah, hitch weight won't be anywhere near 596 lbs. In fact, gross tongue weight will vary according to what you load into the trailer and where but as a general guide should be 13% to 14% of the trailer's gross weight, loaded & ready to camp. You haven't said whether anyone else would be in the Jeep at the time but even with you as just the driver it really doesn't have anywhere near enough payload capacity to be towing the size of trailer you have in mind.

UntetheredExplorer wrote:Thanks, KerrlakeRoo-but I'm not sure I follow. If max Jeep payload is 1050 and person, TT hitch wt, sway bar (170+596+100 = 866), that leaves me with available tongue weight of 184? Is this right? Does not take into account Jeep cargo, front TT cargo, propane tanks or batteries...I am missing something?You have it right, and the battery (50 lbs) propane tanks and fuel (80 lbs) and whatever materials are in the forward part of the trailer still have to be added. You will be right on the edge if you are travelling alone, and many folks do overload to varying degrees with equally varying results. Also you may want to look again at that trailer, you show it as having a 1100 lb ccc, so on that consider the same weights for battery and propane, plus whatever gear/clothing/supplies you intend to load plus water. Is that 1100 lbs enough?Best of luck in your decision process.

What can I tow safely with my TV | Good Sam Community

Anniewhereugo
Explorer
Aug 13, 2018
Hi, I have a Chevy Suburban 1500 4x4 with a max tow of 7k, I wanted to go as light as I could with as much room as possible. I looked at the Rockwood Mini Light 2405S (20'9" end to end 19 foot box with a slide) at 3650 and ended up with a keystone passport 199 at 3560 (dry) and it is pretty easy to tow. I don't want to stress out or blow my truck up so went with a little less room for safety sake. A dealer will sell you something bigger (although the gal where I purchased the Passport was very concerned about weight and TV) so research and know what you can tow. Happy trails and I envy you getting out there.
rbpru
Explorer II
Aug 07, 2018
Do not confuse the merits of canvas with the amount of additional labor involved. Everything has it price.

I have no problem packing my PUP wet and opening it up when I get home. So too my tent.

But in my case, I often want to stop and go, sometimes not even unhooking for the night. So that means a TT. It is just shear convenience.
Terryallan
Explorer II
Aug 07, 2018
SoundGuy wrote:
Ralph Cramden wrote:
This is the unit we were looking at back in 2013, actually a 254DSX.

Terryallan wrote:
That bunk end would be a deal breaker for me. We got out of Pups, Which I like a lot. But I just don't want to mess with canvas any more. 25 years was enough. High maintiance

Which only means you don't understand the target market for this trailer - grandparents who want to take the grandkids camping. It's also a wonderful solution for those who only occasionally may take another couple with them camping and want to offer completely separate sleeping accommodation from the main bedroom. In point of fact the 254DSX was brilliant but the problem was that most potential customers were like you and didn't understand it, and that's the reason it was pulled (too soon IMO) from the Freedom Express lineup. :( We sure could have used a 254DSX recently when we took friends of ours from Downunder camping - solved it with a tent but being able to offer their own sleeping quarters within the trailer would have been a much better solution. :B

Or it could mean that after Camping for more than 25 years under canvas. I no longer want to mess with it Maintaing canvas is a royal pain.

As for taking extra people. Our camper sleeps 10 comfortably The rear bedroom besides having two full size beds. also has curtains to separate it from the rest of the camper, plus their own AC vents. Plenty of room for all. And light weight on top of it
SoundGuy
Explorer
Aug 06, 2018
Ralph Cramden wrote:
This is the unit we were looking at back in 2013, actually a 254DSX.

Terryallan wrote:
That bunk end would be a deal breaker for me. We got out of Pups, Which I like a lot. But I just don't want to mess with canvas any more. 25 years was enough. High maintiance

Which only means you don't understand the target market for this trailer - grandparents who want to take the grandkids camping. It's also a wonderful solution for those who only occasionally may take another couple with them camping and want to offer completely separate sleeping accommodation from the main bedroom. In point of fact the 254DSX was brilliant but the problem was that most potential customers were like you and didn't understand it, and that's the reason it was pulled (too soon IMO) from the Freedom Express lineup. :( We sure could have used a 254DSX recently when we took friends of ours from Downunder camping - solved it with a tent but being able to offer their own sleeping quarters within the trailer would have been a much better solution. :B
rbpru
Explorer II
Aug 06, 2018
In the end the best TT is the one with the floor plan you like. Floor plan remains when all else is accepted or forgotten.

Aluminum vs. wood frames, insulation values, stick and tin (aluminum siding) vs. laminated panels, and most of the other "features" of various models mean little floor plan is not right for you.
Terryallan
Explorer II
Aug 06, 2018
Ralph Cramden wrote:
Terryallan wrote:

Thank you for confirming that it is well built

You're welcome, it's as well built as any other Forest River brand / product, or other manufacturers products, or maybe it's not depending on what way the wind was blowing on the production date. One thing it's not is some new and improved rig that is leaps and bounds above what else is out there, but if it makes you feel good believing it is, have at it.

This is the unit we were looking at back in 2013, actually a 254DSX. I looked at 4 different ones, they were touting the Azdel. The build quality on all 4 of them was nothing special compared to lots of other brands. The only thing special about it was the floorplan and they only made it for 2/3 model years.

That bunk end would be a deal breaker for me. We got out of Pups, Which I like a lot. But I just don't want to mess with canvas any more. 25 years was enough. High maintiance
dodge_guy
Explorer II
Aug 06, 2018
drsteve wrote:
UntetheredExplorer wrote:
Thanks, KerrlakeRoo-but I'm not sure I follow. If max Jeep payload is 1050 and person, TT hitch wt, sway bar (170+596+100 = 866), that leaves me with available tongue weight of 184? Is this right? Does not take into account Jeep cargo, front TT cargo, propane tanks or batteries...I am missing something?

Yes. Passenger weight is 170. Weight of the WD hitch is 100. Your proposed TT will probably run around 6000 or so when loaded for camping IF you pack really light. Tongue weight of 15% of that loaded weight, is 900 lb. That puts you at 1170 with NO cargo in the Jeep.

You need to look as a smaller TT.

900lbsTW on a 6500lb trailer!!!! why, that isn't even necessary! 12% is the normal TW for a TT which would put a 6500lb loaded trailer at 800lbs at most. 15% is too much.
Ralph_Cramden
Explorer II
Aug 06, 2018
Terryallan wrote:

Thank you for confirming that it is well built

You're welcome, it's as well built as any other Forest River brand / product, or other manufacturers products, or maybe it's not depending on what way the wind was blowing on the production date. One thing it's not is some new and improved rig that is leaps and bounds above what else is out there, but if it makes you feel good believing it is, have at it.

This is the unit we were looking at back in 2013, actually a 254DSX. I looked at 4 different ones, they were touting the Azdel. The build quality on all 4 of them was nothing special compared to lots of other brands. The only thing special about it was the floorplan and they only made it for 2/3 model years.
Fordlover
Explorer
Aug 05, 2018
UntetheredExplorer wrote:
Thank you, everyone, for your insight. Looks like I will need to make different choices!

There are so many different campers out there, I'm sure you can find one that is within the limits of your Jeep.

Keep in mind travel trailers tend to be the hardest type of trailer to pull, much more difficult than a boat, utility trailer or car hauler. I'd tow a car hauler trailer close to the max rating of a tow vehicle, but never a tall sidewall TT or cargo style trailer.
Terryallan
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2018
Ralph Cramden wrote:
Terryallan wrote:
Ralph Cramden wrote:
Terryallan wrote:
stevemorris wrote:
I agree with all of the above!!
basically, that's too much trailer for the jeep
also be careful with "ultralite" trailers, build quality is very "lite" you'll have floors that feel like a trampoline, I had one, hated the bouncy floor. had a hard time selling it because the floors were so "soft and bouncy"

You must have had a cheap ultra lite. Mine is very lite, and the floors are as solid as a rock. In truth the whole thing is solid. But then it is made from really strong lite weight composite material that won't rot.

All I'm saying is "many" lite weight TT are made very well. You have to be careful what you buy.

A Coachmen Apex is made from really strong lightweight composite materials? Thats a good one.

Do you know what it is made of?????? I do, and I did research on the material. The walls made from a material that was only available on high end coaches for a long time. The material is 50% lighter, and stronger than luan backed fiberglass. plus it has a 50% higher R insulation value. It also will not rot. Why do you have a problem with that????

In truth. Many Coachmen RV have started using the same material, and I believe the makers of Coleman RVs now use it or a variation of it as well. My Apex is 6 years old. It looks like new, The inside is like new. I have no problem with space age material. Why do you?

Google can be your friend

You have bought into the sales brochure BS. I dont have a problem with it and I do know what you're referring to.

Its called Azdel. The only place it is used on a Coachmen product is for the layer in the wall lamination that the filon is laminated to. And only on the two sidewalls. Not the floor, roof, front or back walls, or anywhere else. On the 2 sidewalls the inner layer is 1/8" luan plywood with the wallcovering glued to it.

The Azdel will not delaminate or rot, but get water in that panel and the low VOC water based adhesives will still let loose and the filon can delaminate from the Azdel, or the Azdel from the foam' or the inner plywood from the foam. Delamination is delamination.

Your floor, roof, and end walls are built just the same with the same materials as almost every other trailer out there thats not stick and tin. I have done the research when I almost purchased a Coachmen back in 2014. It was a front bedroom travel trailer with a single hybrid style bunk at the rear, the 243 DSX.

You may think you have some bulletproof indestructible space age miracle trailer. You're mistaken.

Thank you for confirming that it is well built

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