SurfnCamp
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Re: Is a HTT right for us? And a few other ??'s
Thanks for lead on the Jayco hybrid dealer as well as the info on the RV show coming up in Pomona - not sure how I missed that. Perhaps my Google-Fu is not so strong. It looks like we're back in the new market as the used 21SS I was investigating got sold before I could make the drive to check it. So Pamona and Riverside here we come... In the meantime, we're accelerating our plans for a new TV to replace the Tacoma. Probably going to be a used 5.7l Tundra but we haven't firmly decided yet. I'll probably pick some brains (and maybe start some battles) over in the TV forum. Thanks again. You folks have been tremendously helpful!333Views0likes0CommentsRe: Older vs Newer Roo 21SS
Thanks again for all the replies. There are many many ways of looking at this deal. And a lot of the decision will come down to the "actual" condition of the unit vs the seller's impression. The unit is fairly priced according to NADA but condition will trump the NADA value of course. And from what I've seen, west coast prices on HTT are in excess of NADA values generally (sometimes substantially). As an example, I just missed a 2009 that they were asking $2k above average retail, $4k above low retail. And Chuck is right. Putting $5k into a $5k trailer still equals a $5k trailer (well, perhaps a little more in CA). But there is simply a cost of ownership that has to be factored as well. If I can keep my improvements around $1000 for every year of ownership then this should work out fine (and be well under the average yearly depreciation) Another perspective is that my initial purchase price is about equal to the 1st year's deprecation on a brand new unit. So, I think I have enough info to make the 3 hour drive to go inspect the unit. If it disappoints then its back to the drawing board or maybe a trip to RVW. Either way we hope to be in a HTT by spring at the latest. Thanks again!499Views0likes0CommentsRe: Older vs Newer Roo 21SS
First, thanks to everyone for all the great info! You folks are saving us so much time and effort in this process. You all are awesome!! Now to the details of the 2004 Roo that I know so far (in addition to those mentioned already): Decals are faded due to the unit being stored uncovered in the sun. That and what I think are issues with deferred maintenance are disconcerting. Seller claims there has never been any water issues. But no updates have been done to door hatches or seals. Tires and battery were put in service 1.5 years ago. I'll get the manufacture dates soon. There is staining in the shower floor due to something being stored there. Likely I would replace the basin to make DW happy. WDH is included. Price is now at $5500 (+ tax) compared to $18K (+ tax + $1.5K trip costs + time) to buy a new one from RVW. We wouldn't even be considering his route if the price difference weren't so great. Even if we spent $5k on improvements (extreme I think), we would still be in for $10k under new. Or the other way I'm thinking about this, is this would give us a cheap way to try out a HTT and we could upgrade as soon as we wanted to with very little monetary risk. Of course I don't want to be chasing my tail fixing little problems all the time either - which is one of the main reasons for us to buy new. I'm going to to talk to the seller again and run down another list of questions about condition and maintenance. I'll let you all know how that goes. Thanks again! This forum is great!499Views0likes0CommentsRe: Older vs Newer Roo 21SS
Thanks Dan! A couple of followups if you don't mind: Can you tell me which year they went to the 8' width? Is the back bunk actually smaller or just the access to it? I know you mentioned before that the attached canvas was 2011 I think. As for the other differences, in your opinion, are these inconveniences or strong reasons to avoid the older units? DW is liking the idea of brand new, I'm looking at the cost difference and going whoa! :E Thanks again! bikendan wrote: two big things are that the 2004 will be 7'6" wide, while newer Roos are 8' wide, which makes a big difference in the back bunk. the other is that the canvas will attach with snaps and velcro and bungees, while the newer ones will have pre-attached canvas. also, the bunk seal system/hinges are much improved in newer Roos.499Views0likes0CommentsOlder vs Newer Roo 21SS
As a follow up to my thread "Is an HTT right for us", we have been studying floor plans and and really think the 21SS is the best fit for our needs. We really like everything about it except for the lack of counter space and the slightly smaller bathroom (as compared to a Jayco or the 23SS). Well you can't have everything... Anyway, we have found a 2004 Roo 21SS that we can get for a good price. Can anyone tell us what all we would be giving up with this older unit compared a a brand new one? It appears that the slide out is not as deep and that it does not have the side windows in the slide. We know that there are likely other issues that I will need to attend to but the cost savings would be so great ($7k used vs $19K+trip costs for new) that it may be worth it to buy and fix/improve. Known issues with the 2004 are: Torn awning Low water pressure in shower (even on city water - filter maybe?) I'm pretty handy so I can do a lot of work myself. But with saving so much money I could hire some repairs and updates out to the dealer and still be way ahead. But if there are fundamental differences between a 2004 and 2013 that can't be overcome, then I'd like to know that if possible. Thoughts? Thanks! SurfnCamp3.5KViews0likes13CommentsRe: Is a HTT right for us? And a few other ??'s
Thanks for the detailed info! We are very likely to follow this exact plan if we can't get lucky locally. But we have a few variables to deal with in this plan. -We'll have to deal with getting rid of our Niagara on our own (more work for me!) -Its getting to be fall so we have to think about weather and timing for a trip back east. -Its unlikely that I'll want to pull a bigger HTT back from OH with my Tacoma so that may affect the timing of either the TV or HTT purchase. -We still want to look at various models and floorplans prior to committing to a purchase. So we have to work out how to see the units that we're considering. Its challenging when so little is available on the west coast. I'm not seeing any big RV shows coming up either. The waiting could be the worst part! Thanks again dadmomh wrote: Well, if you have family in OH, your shopping may be over. Strongly suggest you go online to RV Wholesalers and check out their selection of hybrids. If you see something interesting, they'll email you the price. The price is the price...no games, no haggling. Our '07 ROO came from RVW and we saved over $4000 and we just made the move to the darkside and our savings was even more. Good folks to deal with. They're in Lakeview, OH...just east of I-75 and near Wapakoneta....east on some state hwy, think it's 33, but not sure. Allow plenty of time for your PDI and paperwork....new lending laws have generated more paperwork then we've had buying our house. Indian Lake CG - OH State - is about 10 min max from RVW and they have wonderful sites. Would not worry about full hookup. An excellent spot for the first night. If you find anything that's not quite right, it's a quick stop back by RVW and you'll be fixed up and on your way....we had an outside speaker that wasn't working....wire not connected and 10 min later we were outa there. If you don't see something in stock that meets your preferences, you can spec it out and they'll price it. Delivery times vary, so don't count on a "for sure" time....besides, you don't want to drive to OH twice. Good luck.333Views0likes0CommentsRe: Is a HTT right for us? And a few other ??'s
Thanks for the suggestion CJS - sure looks like a lot of trailer for very reasonable weight. Unfortunately, I think we're going to end up with something bigger. We've gotten somewhat spoiled with the slideout and king-sized beds in our current PUP so I think we're likely to be in the 19-23' range for a HTT to "feel" significantly bigger than our PUP. DW is still not happy about the idea of giving up our king beds as it is. I'm a little concerned too, as she's a complete bed hog! :E cjs2000 wrote: My KZ Sportsmen Classic 16BHT has the manual awning and the attached canvas of the bunk end, and it is a 2013. It tows well with my 2012 Sienna around the mid-atlantic area, dry weight is supposedly 2307 lbs. I've had it up to 4500ft in WV no problems towing. For some reason the KZ website lists the 16BHT at 2800 GVWR and 13" wheels, but mine was built with 14" wheels and is labeled as 3500 lbs GVWR.333Views0likes0CommentsRe: Is a HTT right for us? And a few other ??'s
popupcamping wrote: No one has mentioned this but have you thought how well OR poorly for that matter your 8 year old 225HP Taco is going to haul such a big HTT with a slide? I have thought about this of course - but would be happy to have someone check my thinking. And come on… my Tacoma has 236HP (not 225). Those 11 HP could make all the difference! A couple of points: My Tacoma, while being a 2006, just hit 50K miles last weekend. Well maintained, no mechanical issues at all. TRD pkg w/AAL. Tow rating is 6500# Max tongue weight is 650# * This TV would only be used for short local trips - and only for the next 6 months or so. We will be buying a larger TV before making any bigger trips. Also, I will be riding solo in the truck as DW&DD drive separately since my truck is an Access Cab and can't seat the whole family anyway. Besides. I like to get to camp early and do some setup prior to the arrival of the "Child Tornado"! We have borrowed a full size when we have needed to in the past. We will split cargo between the two vehicles and will travel with minimal water in the HTT system since there won't be any stops for a local trip. So here is a somewhat worse case scenario with my Taco pulling a Roo 233S with minimal water and 400# of cargo in the TV and HTT: Tow Vehicle GVWR 5,500 Tow Vehicle GCVWR 11,850 Theoretical Tow Rating (GCVWR - Dry Weight) 7,800 Trailer GVWR 6,402 GVWR = Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, GCVWR=Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating CALCULATION OF TOW VEHICLE WEIGHTS Tow Vehicle Dry Wt. 4,050 Gasoline - Gallons 18 6 lbs/gal 108 People 200 Cargo and Stuff 400 Weight of Hitch Receiver and Accessories 60 Actual Weight Tow Vehicle (GVW) 4,818 Percentage of Tow Vehicle GVWR 87.6% Under (Over) Tow Vehicle GVWR (lbs.) 682 CALCULATION OF TRAILER WEIGHTS Dry Weight Trailer 4,372 Options 400 Battery 45 Propane 2 20 lb Tanks 76 Water in Tank - Gals. 6 8.4lbs./gal 50 Stuff in Trailer (lbs) 400 Actual Weight Travel Trailer (TGVW) 5,293 Percentage of Trailer GVWR 82.7% Under (Over) Trailer GVWR (lbs.) 1,109 --------------------------------- Please let me know if I've missed or overlooked anything. Obviously, I'd be pushing closer to the limits than I'd like and pulling a barn door will challenge the Taco more than our big PUP. But I think its doable for the 4-5 local trips we're likely to make before getting a bigger TV. But again. I'm trying to be pragmatic here and I'll be testing the viability of this plan by renting an equivalent weight TT locally (no HTTs for rent) and towing it to a local CG for a weekend trip. That will give me some better perspective on towing a bigger rig and camping in a TT/HTT. Thoughts? Thanks!333Views0likes0CommentsRe: Is a HTT right for us? And a few other ??'s
We are find this to be very true in just the few days we have been looking! If we don't get (very) lucky and come across something local we are likely to do the same as you and buy in the midwest. We have family in OH and MI so we could make a vacation out of it anyway. And thanks for the info on attached bunkends and manual awning. I'm not against them particularly but its just something else to go wrong in the future. But that is just one thing among a few hundred on a camping trailer! bikendan wrote: SurfnCamp, you'll find that hybrids aren't embraced by most West Coast dealers. since very few dealers carry them, there are no deals on new ones and used ones fetch higher prices than NADA values them. we spent 2 years trying to find what we wanted at a fair price. we gave up and drove to the Midwest to get our new 23SS and still saved over $4,0000 after trip costs. and we paid less than a 6 year-old used 19' hybrid sold out here for. i'm just warning you that your search will be frustrating and don't look at what hybrids sell for in the Midwest. it'll just make you mad about what you'll have to pay for one out here. and the pre-attached canvas appeared around the 2011 model year and all had electric awnings by then. don't know if you'll be able to find one with pre-attached canvas and a manual awning.333Views0likes0Comments
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