AZ LTVA 'self contained' rules

Think a rule is unfair has nothing to do with compliance.

You really seem to be looking for justification vs information.

Actual information was posted.......you do not meet criteria of self contained.

Simple.

2gypsies wrote:

rjxj wrote:
Buy a drain cap and fitting/valve and somehow neatly fasten it to the back of your rig. If you're an overachiever get a decal too. :) I was stopped for speeding many years ago and had a sawed of shovel handle. State police lady spotted it through the rear window and asked what it was for. I instantly realized it would be considered a weapon. I told her it was just a broken shovel handle and I cut it off to take it to the store to get the correct one. Lucky for me she knew little about which end of the handle goes into the shovel.

Sounds like you're one for 'that rule doesn't apply to me'.

Right on. I learned it from you after driving behind you for awhile. Right at the exact speed limit. Never one mile an hour over. yessireee After volunteering for clean up projects with the BLM last winter and seeing the trash and vandalism, the op is the last of their worries.

Last winter there was plenty of open space within 500' of the vault toilets at both LaPosa (80 miles from Yuma) and Imperial Dam (about 30 miles from Yuma). Pilot Knob is the closest LTVA to Yuma (about 7 miles), however I don't believe it has toilets so you would not meet the BLM requirements for that location.

The quote from the BLM that includes info on the different areas:

"Self-Contained Vehicles
a. In Pilot Knob, Midland, Tamarisk, and Hot Springs LTVAs, you may camp only in self-contained camping units. The La Posa, Imperial Dam, and Mule Mountain LTVAs are restricted to self-contained camping units, except within 500 feet of a vault or rest room.
b. Self-contained camping units must have a permanent, affixed waste water holding tank of 10-gallon minimum capacity. BLM does not consider port-a-potty systems, systems that utilize portable holding tanks, or permanent holding tanks of less than 10-gallon capacity, to be self-contained."

toedtoes, you are much more optimistic about the ability of the federal government to change a rule than I am.

Asking for forgiveness is not my excuse for disregarding the rule, it's what I see as the unfair application of it. I see nothing to apologize for, and would only apologize if for no other reason than to avoid jail time and being thrown in the slammer for having a potty that's 6 gallons instead of 10.


Does anyone know if when you purchase your LTVA permit the BLM inspects potty? Or have you had your toilet inspected?

DieselBurps wrote:
I have a permanently affixed toilet, sink, shower, stove, grey water tank, etc, according to the BLM rules I am not considered "self contained" because my toilet is only 6 gallons.

I understand the reasoning behind the BLM rules, but feel it unfairly applies to my situation. Cassette toilets are popular in Europe and not here, it works well for me and like I said I can go 3 weeks before having to dump.

In this situation I will ask for forgiveness instead of permission because I feel I am doing nothing wrong, and asking the BLM for permission is futile because it clearly states in the rules that I do not meet the definition of "self contained" as defined by the BLM.

Whether you FEEL you are doing nothing wrong isn't the deciding factor. They have a rule, you don't meet that rule. Either go elsewhere to stay or ask if they will make an exception for you.

Asking forgiveness afterwards is a lamea** excuse to disregard the law/rule.

If more people asked for exceptions to rules for legitimate reasons (which you may well have), the more likely those rules would get changed to ones that are more appropriate.

The more people ignore those rules and just do what they want, the more rigid they become.

I have a permanently affixed toilet, sink, shower, stove, grey water tank, etc, according to the BLM rules I am not considered "self contained" because my toilet is only 6 gallons.

I understand the reasoning behind the BLM rules, but feel it unfairly applies to my situation. Cassette toilets are popular in Europe and not here, it works well for me and like I said I can go 3 weeks before having to dump.

In this situation I will ask for forgiveness instead of permission because I feel I am doing nothing wrong, and asking the BLM for permission is futile because it clearly states in the rules that I do not meet the definition of "self contained" as defined by the BLM.

rjxj wrote:
Buy a drain cap and fitting/valve and somehow neatly fasten it to the back of your rig. If you're an overachiever get a decal too. :) I was stopped for speeding many years ago and had a sawed of shovel handle. State police lady spotted it through the rear window and asked what it was for. I instantly realized it would be considered a weapon. I told her it was just a broken shovel handle and I cut it off to take it to the store to get the correct one. Lucky for me she knew little about which end of the handle goes into the shovel.

Sounds like you're one for 'that rule doesn't apply to me'.

Self-contained usually means that you have tanks (fresh and grey/black) with toilet, sink, etc. They require that because the individual campsites may not have hookups, etc. and they don't want you dumping on the ground - so, you must have tanks and be able to empty them at a dump station (even if it's located in another area).

You should be OK, but I recommend you just call and confirm. Why get there and find out you have no way to empty your toilet when a simple call can resolve everything easily and quickly?

And no, I'm not a believer in "it's better to ask forgiveness than permission" - always found it to be a lot more work and hassle in the end than it was worth.

Buy a drain cap and fitting/valve and somehow neatly fasten it to the back of your rig. If you're an overachiever get a decal too. :) I was stopped for speeding many years ago and had a sawed of shovel handle. State police lady spotted it through the rear window and asked what it was for. I instantly realized it would be considered a weapon. I told her it was just a broken shovel handle and I cut it off to take it to the store to get the correct one. Lucky for me she knew little about which end of the handle goes into the shovel.