I'm having some electric brake issues on my 2014 Forest River Wildcat 327CK FW. I know I can buy the RVIA standards for about $100, but I'm trying to avoid that at this time. Does anyone know if there's a site online where I can research or post and receive specific answers for a particular standard?For example, I am experiencing random and uncontrolled braking. Whilst crawling under the unit, I noticed the electric brake wires are zip-tied to the springs. I'm fairly sure that's not an acceptable installation; in fact, I think it's prohibited to attach electric wires to part of the running gear, but it would help if I could point to a specific section of the installation standards/practices in my ongoing discussions with Forest River. I know uncontrolled braking signals could also be a TV issue, but I just had the truck checked out by Ford and they say the truck end is okay. This is just one of several poor manufacturing issues I've had with this unit. Anyone have a bright ideas? Thank you.

phillyg wrote:I'm having some electric brake issues on my 2014 Forest River Wildcat 327CK FW. I know I can buy the RVIA standards for about $100, but I'm trying to avoid that at this time. Does anyone know if there's a site online where I can research or post and receive specific answers for a particular standard?For example, I am experiencing random and uncontrolled braking. Whilst crawling under the unit, I noticed the electric brake wires are zip-tied to the springs. I'm fairly sure that's not an acceptable installation; in fact, I think it's prohibited to attach electric wires to part of the running gear, but it would help if I could point to a specific section of the installation standards/practices in my ongoing discussions with Forest River. I know uncontrolled braking signals could also be a TV issue, but I just had the truck checked out by Ford and they say the truck end is okay. This is just one of several poor manufacturing issues I've had with this unit. Anyone have a bright ideas? Thank you.Braking requires electrical power, and it has to come from somewhere. In my experience, there are only 2 places power can come from. First, and most obvious, is the tow vehicle. Either a bad brake controller or bad wiring, including the plug, is sending random power to the brake circuit. Second, and it's one that many people might not think of right off, is the emergency brake system. If the breakaway switch is shorted, you could be getting power from the coach battery.Lyle

I dont understand? If the wires are zip tied to the springs, how hard is it to take a pair of side cutters and remove them? How hard is it to get out your VOM and check brake voltage? This all assumes that you have already adjusted the brakes properly! What sort of proactive maintenance have you done in two years?

laknox wrote:phillyg wrote: Braking requires electrical power, and it has to come from somewhere. In my experience, there are only 2 places power can come from. First, and most obvious, is the tow vehicle. Either a bad brake controller or bad wiring, including the plug, is sending random power to the brake circuit. Second, and it's one that many people might not think of right off, is the emergency brake system. If the breakaway switch is shorted, you could be getting power from the coach battery.LyleI agree with you Lyle. Since the truck checks out (if I believe Ford), I'll investigate for shorting all the way from the battery terminals. Any opinion on the wiring zip-tied to the spring?

phillyg wrote:laknox wrote:phillyg wrote: Braking requires electrical power, and it has to come from somewhere. In my experience, there are only 2 places power can come from. First, and most obvious, is the tow vehicle. Either a bad brake controller or bad wiring, including the plug, is sending random power to the brake circuit. Second, and it's one that many people might not think of right off, is the emergency brake system. If the breakaway switch is shorted, you could be getting power from the coach battery.LyleI agree with you Lyle. Since the truck checks out (if I believe Ford), I'll investigate for shorting all the way from the battery terminals. Any opinion on the wiring zip-tied to the spring?Zip-tied to the =spring= is just weird; never seen that. Course who knows what the guys at the factories do? Axles, yes. If you were having braking =loss=, that's the first place I'd look, for broken or chafed wires, but with uncommanded brakes ON, that's power being shorted right across to the brake wire, IMO. Lots of times wires get chafed where they go =into= the axle tube, which is more normal than an external run.Lyle

phillyg wrote: Does anyone know if there's a site online where I can research or post and receive specific answers for a particular standard? As far as RVIA goes, someone did post a link to a PDF file some time ago. Good luck in your search. Then good luck getting manufacture standing behind them.If they post it again I'm going to save the link this time.

Electric Brake Installation Standards | Good Sam Community

phillyg
Explorer II
Aug 07, 2015
Axles yes, springs no. The thing is, if I can prove zip-tied electric wires to springs is an improper practice, that will be another piece of the case I'm putting together against FR.
lynndiwagon
Explorer
Aug 05, 2015
Almost got to be the emergency brake away switch as the brakes need voltage to activate. I don't see anything wrong with zip tying the brake wiring to the axles, not the springs. Just IMO.
donn0128
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
So, this was a left over 2014? OK, still it is quite possible the brakes need adjusting for starters. What has the dealer done for you? That afterall is your first stop.
phillyg
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
B.O. Plenty wrote:
You bought it used if it's a 2014 and you owned it for 8 months. There is no warranty at this point and Forest River is not obligated to help you as you are not the original owner and the time limit on the warranty has expired anyway. Why don't you go to a good independent repair shop and get it fixed and get on with camping. I doubt that the factory sent it out with the wires zip tied to the springs. Not difficult to fix this.You are beating a dead horse, the factory is under no obligation to fix anything. Sorry.B.O.

Um, it is a NEW unit still on the one year warranty. I looked at new 2014, 2015 and 2016 Montanas at a couple of dealer lots just this past weekend, for crying out loud.

Clearly, the factory sent it out with the jacked up wiring, or something happened to the unit between the factory and dealership resulting in some bozo doing an improper repair. I doubt the latter. The reason I posted here asking for help rather than criticism (you and dobbs) was because there are some smart folks here who might have some valid thoughts. I'm trying not to overreact to this and other issues because I know all RVS have problems, but this one is kind of the straw that broke the camel's back.

I've never in over 40 years seen electrical wires zipped to springs but I did miss them at PDI. This is just one of the items on my ever-growing list of unresolved issues, most of which are hidden items undiscovered during the PDI.
B_O__Plenty
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
You bought it used if it's a 2014 and you owned it for 8 months. There is no warranty at this point and Forest River is not obligated to help you as you are not the original owner and the time limit on the warranty has expired anyway. Why don't you go to a good independent repair shop and get it fixed and get on with camping. I doubt that the factory sent it out with the wires zip tied to the springs. Not difficult to fix this.You are beating a dead horse, the factory is under no obligation to fix anything. Sorry.

B.O.
phillyg
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
donn0128 wrote:
I dont understand? If the wires are zip tied to the springs, how hard is it to take a pair of side cutters and remove them? How hard is it to get out your VOM and check brake voltage? This all assumes that you have already adjusted the brakes properly! What sort of proactive maintenance have you done in two years?

We bought it in Dec 2014; we've owned it for 8 months and it's been in the shop for about 2 of those months. I can do what you suggested, of course, but I'm trying to document a case to FR to prove what a miserable piece of **** this unit is. The brakes are just one of many issues.
path1
Explorer
Aug 05, 2015
phillyg wrote:
Does anyone know if there's a site online where I can research or post and receive specific answers for a particular standard?

As far as RVIA goes, someone did post a link to a PDF file some time ago. Good luck in your search. Then good luck getting manufacture standing behind them.

If they post it again I'm going to save the link this time.
laknox
Nomad
Aug 05, 2015
phillyg wrote:
laknox wrote:
phillyg wrote:

Braking requires electrical power, and it has to come from somewhere. In my experience, there are only 2 places power can come from. First, and most obvious, is the tow vehicle. Either a bad brake controller or bad wiring, including the plug, is sending random power to the brake circuit. Second, and it's one that many people might not think of right off, is the emergency brake system. If the breakaway switch is shorted, you could be getting power from the coach battery.Lyle

I agree with you Lyle. Since the truck checks out (if I believe Ford), I'll investigate for shorting all the way from the battery terminals. Any opinion on the wiring zip-tied to the spring?

Zip-tied to the =spring= is just weird; never seen that. Course who knows what the guys at the factories do? Axles, yes. If you were having braking =loss=, that's the first place I'd look, for broken or chafed wires, but with uncommanded brakes ON, that's power being shorted right across to the brake wire, IMO. Lots of times wires get chafed where they go =into= the axle tube, which is more normal than an external run.

Lyle
phillyg
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
laknox wrote:
phillyg wrote:

Braking requires electrical power, and it has to come from somewhere. In my experience, there are only 2 places power can come from. First, and most obvious, is the tow vehicle. Either a bad brake controller or bad wiring, including the plug, is sending random power to the brake circuit. Second, and it's one that many people might not think of right off, is the emergency brake system. If the breakaway switch is shorted, you could be getting power from the coach battery.Lyle

I agree with you Lyle. Since the truck checks out (if I believe Ford), I'll investigate for shorting all the way from the battery terminals. Any opinion on the wiring zip-tied to the spring?
donn0128
Explorer II
Aug 05, 2015
I dont understand? If the wires are zip tied to the springs, how hard is it to take a pair of side cutters and remove them? How hard is it to get out your VOM and check brake voltage? This all assumes that you have already adjusted the brakes properly! What sort of proactive maintenance have you done in two years?