how much TH would you pull with a Tundra crew max

camp-n-family wrote:

Actually camp-n-family is right on the mark with TT and TH being like apples and oranges - they are quite different in how they are designed. Traditional trailers are designed to be mostly balanced with approximately 10-12% tongue weight empty. Toy Haulers on the other hand are designed with substantially more tongue weight empty around 20%. They do this on purpose to offset the massive amount of weight that will be placed - often times behind the rear axles of the trailer.

That may not sound like a lot but you can't really tow around a TH properly without the toys in the back to balance out the load. The towing fundamentals stay the same with optimal towing around 13-15% tongue weight. Toy Haulers are more complicated to tow and balance properly and it requires a bit of forethought to place cargo appropriately.

I understand that THs are usually balanced differently to accomodate the loads in the rear and as such are normally tongue heavy and handle differently than a conventional TT but from the weights listed above this doesn't appear to be the case. I'm not familiar with the TH mentioned but if delivered weights are close to the listed dry weights, 4k with a tongue of 450lbs (11%), it could easily be loaded to maintain proper balance and tongue weight. For example if it is loaded with 500lbs worth of options and 2k worth of stuff would put it around 6500lbs loaded. A tongue weight of 15% is under 1k and should be achievable even for a toy hauler.

The only way to know for sure is to load and weigh it. Don't discount todays 1/2 ton trucks until you do the math. It may work just fine, it may not, but you don't need a dually for everything.

With a small TH like the 19 footer that has been mentioned a few times it seems that the only place to put any toys might be directly on top of the axles anyways ... however the OP has not made reference to a 19 footer he has been talking about a 24 footer.

I am not familiar with Ragen brand up here in Montana and I've never seen one. It doesn't really matter though how the trailer is designed or balanced when dry - as long as any weight that is added behind the rear axle can be offset by weight added in front of the axles closer to the tongue to achieve a 13-15% tongue weight. Most other brands do this by moving water tanks in front of the axles as well as adding 300-400lb generators as close to the tongue as possible.

In short .. doesn't matter what dry weight is only as long as it's properly balanced when full of your stuff. I think it would be harder with such little tongue weight but that is what is listed for the 19 footer Ragen :h

Actually camp-n-family is right on the mark with TT and TH being like apples and oranges - they are quite different in how they are designed. Traditional trailers are designed to be mostly balanced with approximately 10-12% tongue weight empty. Toy Haulers on the other hand are designed with substantially more tongue weight empty around 20%. They do this on purpose to offset the massive amount of weight that will be placed - often times behind the rear axles of the trailer.

That may not sound like a lot but you can't really tow around a TH properly without the toys in the back to balance out the load. The towing fundamentals stay the same with optimal towing around 13-15% tongue weight. Toy Haulers are more complicated to tow and balance properly and it requires a bit of forethought to place cargo appropriately.

I understand that THs are usually balanced differently to accomodate the loads in the rear and as such are normally tongue heavy and handle differently than a conventional TT but from the weights listed above this doesn't appear to be the case. I'm not familiar with the TH mentioned but if delivered weights are close to the listed dry weights, 4k with a tongue of 450lbs (11%), it could easily be loaded to maintain proper balance and tongue weight. For example if it is loaded with 500lbs worth of options and 2k worth of stuff would put it around 6500lbs loaded. A tongue weight of 15% is under 1k and should be achievable even for a toy hauler.

The only way to know for sure is to load and weigh it. Don't discount todays 1/2 ton trucks until you do the math. It may work just fine, it may not, but you don't need a dually for everything.

I have a 2009 Ragen FB2100 which has a 21' box 24' 9" overall length and has a 840 pound tongue weight, 7800 pound dry weight. I pulled it for 5 years with a 2002 Ford F-250 crew cab 4X4 V-10. I towed fine but the gas mileage was poor with or without the trailer. This january I bought a 2013 Ford F-150 crew cab 4X4 with the ecoboost tow max, and this truck pulls it better than the F-250. I'm sure that your Tundra will tow the 24' Ragen fine.

There are some light weight models in the 17-20' size that can be pulled by a 1/2t vehicle, but the question is how long will they survive hauling any kind of weight if they are that light.

You will find most toy haulers have the axle farther back on the chassis and 15% of the GVWR on the tongue even when empty. All this to counteract the load carried in back. When you add water, many of them have the tanks over or forward of the axles to add even more tongue weight - The guys that are not hauling toys and fill up with water are usually experiencing heavier tongue weights than those that cram the garage to capacity.

As a reference: My 22' wide body Weekend Warrior was about 7500 lbs dry but had over a 1000 lbs tongue weight before I added water. It was usually over 11K lbs once I added 2k lbs of toys (on and aft of axles), 40 gal fuel (aft of axles) and 150 gal water (on and fore of axles) and the TW was around 1500 lbs even with a good amount of weight in the rear.

mrkoje wrote:

camp-n-family wrote:

Apples and Oranges. Can't compare a traditional TT to a toy hauler.

The TH in question lists GVWR under 7500lbs and light dry weights of 4k and a tongue of 450lbs. The poster doesn't plan on putting heavy toys in it, just bikes and beach balls. The usual for most campers. If this is truly the case then he won't likely be anywhere near the GVWR and the tongue weight will be well under 1k. No reason for it not to compare to a conventional TT. It will haul very similar and the Tundra will have no problem with it.

Agreed that it will be a different situation if he actually planned to use it to haul heavy toys, but this doesn't appear to be the case.

Actually camp-n-family is right on the mark with TT and TH being like apples and oranges - they are quite different in how they are designed. Traditional trailers are designed to be mostly balanced with approximately 10-12% tongue weight empty. Toy Haulers on the other hand are designed with substantially more tongue weight empty around 20%. They do this on purpose to offset the massive amount of weight that will be placed - often times behind the rear axles of the trailer.

That may not sound like a lot but you can't really tow around a TH properly without the toys in the back to balance out the load. The towing fundamentals stay the same with optimal towing around 13-15% tongue weight. Toy Haulers are more complicated to tow and balance properly and it requires a bit of forethought to place cargo appropriately.

I would not recommend a toy hauler to anyone that has absolutely no intention of putting heavy toys in the back.

correct for tongue pulls but a 5er is a different story. I wouldn't pull anything larger than my utilitytrlr with a half ton period.

The FK1900 referred to is 19' long.

How does a 24 foot TH have a #450 tongue weight? My 22 footer had well over 1k #'s of tongue weight with no water (which increased tongue weight).

lincster wrote:

Apples and Oranges. Can't compare a traditional TT to a toy hauler.

The TH in question lists GVWR under 7500lbs and light dry weights of 4k and a tongue of 450lbs. The poster doesn't plan on putting heavy toys in it, just bikes and beach balls. The usual for most campers. If this is truly the case then he won't likely be anywhere near the GVWR and the tongue weight will be well under 1k. No reason for it not to compare to a conventional TT. It will haul very similar and the Tundra will have no problem with it.

Agreed that it will be a different situation if he actually planned to use it to haul heavy toys, but this doesn't appear to be the case.

Actually camp-n-family is right on the mark with TT and TH being like apples and oranges - they are quite different in how they are designed. Traditional trailers are designed to be mostly balanced with approximately 10-12% tongue weight empty. Toy Haulers on the other hand are designed with substantially more tongue weight empty around 20%. They do this on purpose to offset the massive amount of weight that will be placed - often times behind the rear axles of the trailer.

That may not sound like a lot but you can't really tow around a TH properly without the toys in the back to balance out the load. The towing fundamentals stay the same with optimal towing around 13-15% tongue weight. Toy Haulers are more complicated to tow and balance properly and it requires a bit of forethought to place cargo appropriately.

I would not recommend a toy hauler to anyone that has absolutely no intention of putting heavy toys in the back.


edited: Quote was wrong. It should not have read camp-n-family but instead lincster

Apples and Oranges. Can't compare a traditional TT to a toy hauler.

The TH in question lists GVWR under 7500lbs and light dry weights of 4k and a tongue of 450lbs. The poster doesn't plan on putting heavy toys in it, just bikes and beach balls. The usual for most campers. If this is truly the case then he won't likely be anywhere near the GVWR and the tongue weight will be well under 1k. No reason for it not to compare to a conventional TT. It will haul very similar and the Tundra will have no problem with it.

Agreed that it will be a different situation if he actually planned to use it to haul heavy toys, but this doesn't appear to be the case.

Thanks, good ifo. Pretty much what I expected.
Nayther, I see you have an 06 Ragen 30-05, I'm looking at one on Sat.
How do you like it? Any problems or issues?
I'll be towing with an 03 Dodge CTD DRW.