optimal 5er carrying capacity

outwestbound wrote:

ricatic wrote:

outwestbound wrote:

MTPockets1 wrote:
We full time and after weighing with the stuff we feel we need, including food & clothing, we're carrying about 2500 lbs. in the trailer. That includes full propane tanks and about 25 gallons of water. I carry more in the truck in bed tool box. Knowing we were going full time when we ordered the 5vr we upgraded axles and tires for a load cushion. 2 1/2 years and lots of travel we've had no issues.

Thanks. We're looking hard at the 2012ish BH 3055RLs or a new BH 3010 RE. We prefer a 40 length, but are concerned about access to state and national parks. Deciding on length is still undecided. We don't like RV Parks per se, which look like parking lots to us. We like mountains, trees and water. We know that we're asking for our cake and to eat it too, but we're thinking 35 is the shortest FW we could live full time in. Thoughts?

If you had it to do over, would you buy the trailer you have?

We have the BH 3055RL and live in it for months at a time...my earlier post is in reference to our weights in that exact trailer. My work requires that I haul some heavier equipment in my lower bays...tools and such add to my weight...I still have 500 pounds of capacity before I am at fiver GVW...

With that said, there is still plenty of space in the cabinets above the back window and along the curb side...I am not nearly at volume capacity with "living" stuff...Deb and I have often looked at the space we have remaining and ponder what else we might need to bring along to fill these empty cabinets...

Sometimes I start to think a bigger fiver might be nice...and then Deb asks some simple questions...What would you do different with a bigger fiver? How would you change the living room arrangement to suit you better? When I look at these questions, the answer is obvious...not much I would change...

I will comment on one thing I am not as happy with as I would like to be...and you might take a long look at this before closing a deal on a 3055RL...The tall kitchen cabinets that hang above the kitchen sink preclude watching the TV while working in the kitchen...it is a complaint I have heard from other 3055RL owners...when I return home from work at night and am fixing dinner, or cleaning up afterwards, I enjoy watching the news while working...the cabinets make it into "listening to the news"...small issue but really my only complaint...

Good Luck in your search

Regards

Thanks. Spend 2 hours today going over the BH 3055RL and BH 3570RS. The 3570 has an island and enough room in the rear for a soffa and is 37'9". Each has had such a long and successful production run that you got to figure Heartland worked out any bugs years ago. I hear you on the cab issue you mentioned. For me, I like your desk over the 3570 (and newer), because I need a desk. Desks only seem to be offered in real upper end units. I guess they quit selling.

Thanks for the input and happy trails.

I like the 3570 a lot...our 3055RL has residential furniture in it now...a full width rear couch like the 3570 and 2 lazy boy recliners instead of the POS Hide a Bed love seat...much more comfortable...

After we bought the new furniture, I towed the fiver to the local leader in furniture sales to pick them up. We had looked for a long rime for a quality couch that would fit in the rear space and still let the slides move in and out...the young guys who brought it out for delivery jaws dropped when they saw where they had to put it...one said it would never go in the trailer...and produced a tape measure...with the bottom feet unscrewed, it had a half inch clearance...and in it went...I do have to flip it on its back so the feet clear the slides but this is easier than wrestling with those clunky old OEM recliners...

Overall, we have been very pleased with our Heartland Big Horn...very few issues, all taken care of by our dealer and would buy another one in a heartbeat...unless we could afford a New Horizons...

Regards

Taking the truck out of the equation...the determining factor for most people is the load rating of the tires...which is one big reason you see stories about tire issues. IF you upgrade the tires beyond the axle capacity...then the axle carrying capacity becomes the weak link. Adding the truck back in, you can determine what is carrying the weight...how it is distributed.

Good luck really trying to figure out the actual structural capacity of the frame is.

ricatic wrote:

outwestbound wrote:

MTPockets1 wrote:
We full time and after weighing with the stuff we feel we need, including food & clothing, we're carrying about 2500 lbs. in the trailer. That includes full propane tanks and about 25 gallons of water. I carry more in the truck in bed tool box. Knowing we were going full time when we ordered the 5vr we upgraded axles and tires for a load cushion. 2 1/2 years and lots of travel we've had no issues.

Thanks. We're looking hard at the 2012ish BH 3055RLs or a new BH 3010 RE. We prefer a 40 length, but are concerned about access to state and national parks. Deciding on length is still undecided. We don't like RV Parks per se, which look like parking lots to us. We like mountains, trees and water. We know that we're asking for our cake and to eat it too, but we're thinking 35 is the shortest FW we could live full time in. Thoughts?

If you had it to do over, would you buy the trailer you have?

We have the BH 3055RL and live in it for months at a time...my earlier post is in reference to our weights in that exact trailer. My work requires that I haul some heavier equipment in my lower bays...tools and such add to my weight...I still have 500 pounds of capacity before I am at fiver GVW...

With that said, there is still plenty of space in the cabinets above the back window and along the curb side...I am not nearly at volume capacity with "living" stuff...Deb and I have often looked at the space we have remaining and ponder what else we might need to bring along to fill these empty cabinets...

Sometimes I start to think a bigger fiver might be nice...and then Deb asks some simple questions...What would you do different with a bigger fiver? How would you change the living room arrangement to suit you better? When I look at these questions, the answer is obvious...not much I would change...

I will comment on one thing I am not as happy with as I would like to be...and you might take a long look at this before closing a deal on a 3055RL...The tall kitchen cabinets that hang above the kitchen sink preclude watching the TV while working in the kitchen...it is a complaint I have heard from other 3055RL owners...when I return home from work at night and am fixing dinner, or cleaning up afterwards, I enjoy watching the news while working...the cabinets make it into "listening to the news"...small issue but really my only complaint...

Good Luck in your search

Regards

Thanks. Spend 2 hours today going over the BH 3055RL and BH 3570RS. The 3570 has an island and enough room in the rear for a soffa and is 37'9". Each has had such a long and successful production run that you got to figure Heartland worked out any bugs years ago. I hear you on the cab issue you mentioned. For me, I like your desk over the 3570 (and newer), because I need a desk. Desks only seem to be offered in real upper end units. I guess they quit selling.

Thanks for the input and happy trails.

outwestbound wrote:

MTPockets1 wrote:
We full time and after weighing with the stuff we feel we need, including food & clothing, we're carrying about 2500 lbs. in the trailer. That includes full propane tanks and about 25 gallons of water. I carry more in the truck in bed tool box. Knowing we were going full time when we ordered the 5vr we upgraded axles and tires for a load cushion. 2 1/2 years and lots of travel we've had no issues.

Thanks. We're looking hard at the 2012ish BH 3055RLs or a new BH 3010 RE. We prefer a 40 length, but are concerned about access to state and national parks. Deciding on length is still undecided. We don't like RV Parks per se, which look like parking lots to us. We like mountains, trees and water. We know that we're asking for our cake and to eat it too, but we're thinking 35 is the shortest FW we could live full time in. Thoughts?

If you had it to do over, would you buy the trailer you have?

We have the BH 3055RL and live in it for months at a time...my earlier post is in reference to our weights in that exact trailer. My work requires that I haul some heavier equipment in my lower bays...tools and such add to my weight...I still have 500 pounds of capacity before I am at fiver GVW...

With that said, there is still plenty of space in the cabinets above the back window and along the curb side...I am not nearly at volume capacity with "living" stuff...Deb and I have often looked at the space we have remaining and ponder what else we might need to bring along to fill these empty cabinets...

Sometimes I start to think a bigger fiver might be nice...and then Deb asks some simple questions...What would you do different with a bigger fiver? How would you change the living room arrangement to suit you better? When I look at these questions, the answer is obvious...not much I would change...

I will comment on one thing I am not as happy with as I would like to be...and you might take a long look at this before closing a deal on a 3055RL...The tall kitchen cabinets that hang above the kitchen sink preclude watching the TV while working in the kitchen...it is a complaint I have heard from other 3055RL owners...when I return home from work at night and am fixing dinner, or cleaning up afterwards, I enjoy watching the news while working...the cabinets make it into "listening to the news"...small issue but really my only complaint...

Good Luck in your search

Regards

The dry weight on my fiver (sticker) is 10,500. My scaled weight loaded for camping was 12,280. I don't full time but thought this would give a perspective of cargo weight. This weight includes 4 bikes, clothing, food, tools, grill, pots, pans, you name it for a family of four (I tend to carry a lot).

MTPockets1 wrote:
We full time and after weighing with the stuff we feel we need, including food & clothing, we're carrying about 2500 lbs. in the trailer. That includes full propane tanks and about 25 gallons of water. I carry more in the truck in bed tool box. Knowing we were going full time when we ordered the 5vr we upgraded axles and tires for a load cushion. 2 1/2 years and lots of travel we've had no issues.

Thanks. We're looking hard at the 2012ish BH 3055RLs or a new BH 3010 RE. We prefer a 40 length, but are concerned about access to state and national parks. Deciding on length is still undecided. We don't like RV Parks per se, which look like parking lots to us. We like mountains, trees and water. We know that we're asking for our cake and to eat it too, but we're thinking 35 is the shortest FW we could live full time in. Thoughts?

If you had it to do over, would you buy the trailer you have?

Deb and Ed M wrote:
I was astonished to find that our 28' 5er, weighing 7600 lbs empty, actually weighed 10,000 lbs with full propane tanks, maybe 10 gallons of freshwater, plus our "stuff" for 2 weeks of traveling.

I hate to cook, so my kitchen carries a "basic" amount of gear and food. Most of the overhead cabinets in the slideout were empty. There were 2 bikes on the back; and I had my 40-lb inflatable kayak along. Carried probably 4 gallons of antifreeze. 2 camp chairs and a rug. No grill. I would never have guessed that my "minimalistic camping lifestyle" could have weighed that much.

None of this presents a problem - our capacities are way above what we tow. But it was certainly eye-opening, and will steer us away from some models with lower CCCs when we go to buy a new trailer.

Thanks. Yes, this is our concern (inadequate current or future carrying capacity) as we consider what to buy, and we intend to full time. I don't get much useful information on capacity constraints from RV salespeople.

laknox wrote:

outwestbound wrote:
Hi. I'm considering a number of 35-40 foot 5ers for full timing. I just read a comparison guide by Randall Eaton that I bought from JR Consumer Resources. In this, the author reports that payloads (GVWR minus "dry weight")for most travel trailers and 5ers run about 18% to 25% and that the optimal range is 25% to 35%. If payload is below 18% of the GVWR, the author suggests this could be problematic as it may lead to overload.

For example, Heartland's 2014 Big Country 5er BC 3070 RE's GVWR is 14,000 and dry weight 11,298, yielding a carry capacity of 2,702 or 19.30%; just making the cut according to the author.

I'm a newbie and clueless what all my "stuff" will weigh, but my wife and I will be full timers and this ratio concerns me. I would like very much to believe that I could NOT approach the GVWR, thereby allowing a good cushion.

Could folks chime in one what "stuff" weighs. I define stuff as everything (e.g., batts, LP, fluids, all personal and household)loaded onto the 5er.

Is maxing out carrying capacity wise?
Do you agree with this author's ratios?

I really appreciate it as I don't want to buy an in adequate 5er and then be unsatisfied when we load it up.

PS: TV is not an issue. I'm getting a 1 tone DWR.

First off, how much boondocking are you planning on doing? If little to none, then there's no reason for you to travel with more than minimal fluids in your tanks, so there's hundreds of lbs you don't need to worry about. If you =do= want to boondock or dry camp, then, YES, you will need to take this into account. Full propane tanks? It's only 60 lbs, net; not a major concern, IMO. Do you want you want a washer/dryer? Then that's not a light piece of equipment, as well as the water storage for it (fresh and grey), which takes away from other payload. Generator? Most are mounted right in the front, and also take a good portion of your payload. If you never plan to dry camp, then you don't need a generator, saving 300-400 lbs on a built-in and, if you plan on doing laundry at the CG facilities, then you don't need a washer/dryer. Leaves more room for "stuff", if you need it.

CCC is almost a made-up number, much as "dry wt" is, IMO. My '04 Komfort has a 4,000 lb CCC, but I have no idea where they get that number. The only way I can figure it is that the published "dry" weight didn't include most of the interior. Even if all my 3 45 gallon tanks were full, that's only just over 1,000 lbs and I =know= I can't carry 3,000 lbs of "stuff".

Lyle

Good info Lyle.
Boondocking and dry camping: yes, maybe 25% of the time.
Washer/Dryer: yes
Generator: yes, a couple Honda 2000s

Folks posting their FWs actual weight figures so I can see GVWR, unloaded and loaded figures is extremely helpful.

Based on posts here and elsewhere and your comments Lyle, I put a few figures together:

2 Honda 2000s (100 lbs)
gas & container(35)
LP (2)30lb tanks: (60)
washer/dryer combo (170)
12 gals in water heater (96)
2 deep cycle batteries (120)
On water, I'm not sure, but assume worst case is leaving a dry camp/ boondock: gray and black at 90% full and fresh water tank at 90% empty assuming I had transferred water from the truck into the trailer.
Net water (leaving dry camp) (910)

Total (rounded): 1,500 This is an eye opener!

Wife and I are backpackers and bikers, so we understand weights and have higher end gear; aluminum, carbon, etc. As full timers, it seems reasonable to assume we could loan no more than 1,200 to 1,400 lbs of our own "stuff". Our 1 ton truck should be able to take some heavy items, since it will have excess payload capacity.

I can sure see why, for example, a 2014 Big Horn 3010 RE with only 2,035 carrying capacity (per web site) and 6,000lb axels won't work.

I'm struggling with FW length due to liking state and national parks, does anyone have a ball park on what it would cost to upgrade a 5 year old 35' long Big Horn FW from 6,000 to 7,000 lb axles, including going up from 16" to 17.5" wheels?

I was astonished to find that our 28' 5er, weighing 7600 lbs empty, actually weighed 10,000 lbs with full propane tanks, maybe 10 gallons of freshwater, plus our "stuff" for 2 weeks of traveling.

I hate to cook, so my kitchen carries a "basic" amount of gear and food. Most of the overhead cabinets in the slideout were empty. There were 2 bikes on the back; and I had my 40-lb inflatable kayak along. Carried probably 4 gallons of antifreeze. 2 camp chairs and a rug. No grill. I would never have guessed that my "minimalistic camping lifestyle" could have weighed that much.

None of this presents a problem - our capacities are way above what we tow. But it was certainly eye-opening, and will steer us away from some models with lower CCCs when we go to buy a new trailer.

donn0128 wrote:
A 35 foot fiver with a GVWR of 16K is definitely going to have more load carrying capacity than a similar length fiver with a GVWR of 14K. Plane simple logic. Terms like "dry" or "shipping" are pretty much useless for most people. As a good way to make a best guess, pick trailers in that size range with at least 7000 pound 8 lug axles and as minimum 16 inch wheels.

Thanks. I researched axles and tires, so now I get it.

I have a question about lining up a pin with a new truck's FW hitch.

I'm looking to order a new RAM 3500 4 x 4 DRW. I've seen some forum posts by folks having problems matching up the heights of new trucks to the pins on older FWs - say 6 years old. I don't know how much play or adjustability is in the hitching assembly and evidently, newer trucks are higher than older trucks (I guess).

If there is a mismatch issue new trucks vs. older FWs, should I consider this if I moved up to 7,000lb axels by also moving up from 16" to say 17.5" tires? I don't know if moving up a trailer tire size gets you much height increase.

For me, I don't own either truck or trailer yet.