Tow Vehicle for 22,000 Pounds Plus

tinner12002 wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
I tow a combined weight of 32,500#, 23K of that is the 2016 39TKSB3 MobileSuites. I am within all SAE axle and tow ratings. TV front axle 5,460# rear axle 9,580#.

Truck is rated at 6K front axle, 9,750# rear axle and combined at 37,800#.

NO you don't need a MDT or HDT to tow this size RV. I have towed the whole West Coast with zero issues including high winds.

Truck is a 15 RAM Dually LongHorn with 4,10's and Aisin transmission. I averaged 8.65 from WA to CA with two of those tanks having severe head winds. Without the two bad tanks I would have averaged 9mpg. IMHO that is good mileage for that weight. Some will claim more but that is taking tanks from 7.5 to 10.5 and averaging them all out.

The exhaust brake is AWESOME! Lock the trans in the same gear you would have climbed that grade in and set cruise and enjoy the ride down!

The factory rear air is awesome, the truck rides great loaded and unloaded and also sits the same with 9,580# sitting on the rear or empty.

It has that much GVWR with just 2 #8000 axles??

GVWR is 14,000#..FAWR is 6000#, RAWR is a conservative 9750# ( thats 15,750#), with all 4 rear tires aired to 65 psi...per AAM, you could actually air all 4rear tires to 80 psi , (max sidewall psi and easily take RAWR to 10,000# plus...AAM rates 11.8 axle at 11,500# RAWR. with tires that can cover that weight.

GCWR is different, depending on trannies and gearing, with Aisin/4.10 giving highest TQ and GCWR..2016 Longhorn, crew cab, longed, 4X4, Aisin with 4.10 is 39,100#

You sure do have a purty truck and 5er there Ron:B

Cummins12V98 wrote:
I tow a combined weight of 32,500#, 23K of that is the 2016 39TKSB3 MobileSuites. I am within all SAE axle and tow ratings. TV front axle 5,460# rear axle 9,580#.

Truck is rated at 6K front axle, 9,750# rear axle and combined at 37,800#.

NO you don't need a MDT or HDT to tow this size RV. I have towed the whole West Coast with zero issues including high winds.

Truck is a 15 RAM Dually LongHorn with 4,10's and Aisin transmission. I averaged 8.65 from WA to CA with two of those tanks having severe head winds. Without the two bad tanks I would have averaged 9mpg. IMHO that is good mileage for that weight. Some will claim more but that is taking tanks from 7.5 to 10.5 and averaging them all out.

The exhaust brake is AWESOME! Lock the trans in the same gear you would have climbed that grade in and set cruise and enjoy the ride down!

The factory rear air is awesome, the truck rides great loaded and unloaded and also sits the same with 9,580# sitting on the rear or empty.

It has that much GVWR with just 2 #8000 axles??

topjimmy wrote:
Cummins12V has the truck and your answer and tells you all you need to know END OF STORY

X2

I have the 3.73's in my truck and I do like them but if I was doing it again I would probably get 4.10's. I just find it wants to go a little too fast on the highway when pulling, like 110-115 km/h. Drives nice there, feels great power wise, but it's not great on fuel and a little faster than I would prefer to tow 18000ish pounds.

I. Don't have that heavy a 5er BUT have used my 2012 Chevy to pull my 30ft gooseneck flatbed close to 28000 lbs several times before retireing in Dec. I had no problems that ever made me think was unsafe or undo able for my 3500HD crew cab.
2012 was rated for a 23000 lb 5er & the newer I seem to recall 23300 lbs.
The duallys are all capable so it just boils down to what you want to spend your money on. I had a customer last year that bought a "big rig" Peterbilt and converted it to single axle,custom bed,hitch,& the stove/fridge required here in Texas to register as MH for right at $20k but he has a shop & pretty handy.Its just what you think is "cool".

transamz9 wrote:
First off, I do have an effective 6 speed.

Not if you're locked in 5th when towing, which by your own admission you are.

transamz9 wrote:
As far as what I'm saying about the 3.73. I am just assuming here but I was thinking that the OP is looking at DRW trucks here. When you look on here Ram Bodybuilder Clicky, a Ram DRW Crew Cab with Aisin and 3.73 gear has a GCVWR of 33,800# and a Max trailer weight of 25,010 #. Now I didn't go to all the big name schools but simple math says that truck will have ZERO problems handling a 22,000# camper. Yes the truck with the 4.10 has even more capacity but so does a HDT/MDT.

Yes, it's sufficient per the ratings, but some of us prefer more operating margin when towing as heavy as the OP states. That's what the 4.10s offer.

transamz9 wrote:
I know people say that there ain't much difference in fuel mileage but I'm here to tell you there is. I have test driven brand new trucks set up exactly the same right down to the radios back to back running the exact same routes with the two gear ratios we are talking about and when you figure I personally saw 2 MPG difference (14-16) I'm not going to be easily persuaded to think otherwise.

Fuel consumption when towing is far more complex than being directly proportional to final drive ratio. To predict whether a particular axle ratio would have better or worse fuel economy at a given speed, one would have to have access to a full brake specific fuel consumption (bsfc) map for the engine across its full speed and load spectrum. Optimum bsfc is often lower in the engine's RPM range than the torque peak (also the bmep peak) or horsepower peak.

In theory, pulling the same trailer, your truck locked in 5th gear should get the same steady state fuel economy as a 4.10 truck in 6th gear as the overall effective gear ratios for both trucks are the same as evidenced by the 1750 RPM engine speed @ 65 MPH.

Rusty

transamz9 wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:


I don't think we are talking modified trucks here. 900TQ is not stock for your truck. I can't remember do you have 68RFE or Aisin?

No, don't worry. You have the most torque. My truck is the 850TQ and yes it has the Aisin. I just know that my 20,000# load is no problem for my 850 left with 3.42's so I know that 23,000 is not going to be a problem for 900 lbft with 3.73.

His truck has the 865 TQ, the 2016 has the 900 TQ numbers, if not mistaken.

Cummins12V98 wrote:

transamz9 wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

transamz9 wrote:
If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

If pulling a 23,000# 5er 4.10's are nice to get rolling, and hills.

Like I said before, I pull with 3.42's and yes there is a difference but I have never had an issue " getting going ". I have actually had my traction control kick in a couple times on damp roads taking off at lights that are on hills. Be leave me, 900 lbft of torque has no problem getting 23000 moving or keeping it moving.

I don't think we are talking modified trucks here. 900TQ is not stock for your truck. I can't remember do you have 68RFE or Aisin?

No, don't worry. You have the most torque. My truck is the 850TQ and yes it has the Aisin. I just know that my 20,000# load is no problem for my 850 lbft with 3.42's so I know that 23,000 is not going to be a problem for 900 lbft with 3.73.

RustyJC wrote:

Which is precisely my point. When towing, you effectively don't have a 6 speed transmission. You have a 5 speed transmission with a taller 1st gear as compared to a truck with 4.10s. If you like to operate that way, that's fine - your money and your choice. Is the truck capacity optimized operating that way? No.

There's a reason why Ram GCWR ratings increase so markedly as axle ratios step from 3.42 to 3.73 to 4.10.

Rusty

First off, I do have an effective 6 speed. My truck will not shift into 6th until you hit 65 mph in tow haul mode. When running 68 or so it does lug a little more than I would like. I am not the one here that is asking the question about gears. I know what I have and what they are capable of and I also know the exact reason why I have these gears. I do not want or need a DRW truck so unless I buy another brand of truck I'm stuck with the 3.42's. I will just change the diff, oil more because I know it creates more heat.

As far as what I'm saying about the 3.73. I am just assuming here but I was thinking that the OP is looking at DRW trucks here. When you look on here ( Ram Bodybuilder Clicky ), a Ram DRW Crew Cab with Aisin and 3.73 gear has a GCVWR of 33,800# and a Max trailer weight of 25,010 #. Now I didn't go to all the big name schools but simple math says that truck will have ZERO problems handling a 22,000# camper. Yes the truck with the 4.10 has even more capacity but so does a HDT/MDT.

I know people say that there ain't much difference in fuel mileage but I'm here to tell you there is. I have test driven brand new trucks set up exactly the same right down to the radios back to back running the exact same routes with the two gear ratios we are talking about and when you figure I personally saw 2 MPG difference (14-16) I'm not going to be easily persuaded to think otherwise. I just changed the gears in my F350 from 4.11-3.73 today so I will definitely be able to see what the difference is. I have just over 200,000 miles on the truck with the 4.11's so I am curious to see the difference.

transamz9 wrote:

No sir, I tow at 28,000 combined. I completely understand all the pluses and minuses of the gears. With my set-up I lock it in 5th and have vary few downshifts @ interstate speeds. I'm not telling the OP to get 3.42's I'm saying 3.73's would be fine.

Which is precisely my point. When towing, you effectively don't have a 6 speed transmission. You have a 5 speed transmission with a taller 1st gear as compared to a truck with 4.10s. If you like to operate that way, that's fine - your money and your choice. Is the truck capacity optimized operating that way? No.

Since the 3.73s fall between the 3.42s and 4.10s, here's the problem. If we all agree (as we seem to) that 1750 RPM @ 65 MPH is a sweet spot for towing on the interstate, with 3.73s 5th gear will be too low and 6th gear will be too high.

There's a reason why Ram GCWR ratings increase so markedly as axle ratios step from 3.42 to 3.73 to 4.10.

Rusty