Forum Discussion
rossjsnider
Jun 08, 2014Explorer
Thanks for your replies, I had not seen them because I hadn't noticed there was a second page. I spent some time on it yesterday, and still don't think I have found anything that should cause it to dump this much fuel. I did find the fuel pump relay, it is under the dog house on the left side. near the ac-pump. This is only important because I did not want power needlessly going to a dead pump. I have not yet checked the cat, or the actual values of the CTS (thanks for those). It does seem to respond to changes there at least. I finally got it to start throwing codes. It threw a code 45 (rich exhaust). This tells us that at least it tried feebly to run in closed loop and it probably does comunicate with the O2 sensor. Below, is something I posted on "just answers" As of now I have not gotten a new response to it.
"Please note this is a GM TBI system.
1) New parts include: MAP sensor, Coolant sensor, AC-delco injectors, AC-delco fuel pump and strainer, fuel pressure regulator diaphragm. AC-delco spark plugs. cap and rotor and coil apear new as well but I did not replace them.
2) In your answer you had stated that it could be the fuel pump giving internal faults causing the ECM to try to compensate. TBI systems call for 9-13 psi. The reg holds a steady 11 psi. I hooked an inline regulator into the system because the engine will not start when fuel pressures are in the 9-13 psi range. I adjusted pressure higher (15 plus) and lower. It will start when pressure is dropped to 5 psi. It runs better at 2-3 psi than 5.
3) There is only 1 Oxygen sensor and it is a single wire non heated type. The ECM ignores it until operating temperature has been reached. When it finally did reach operating temperature it threw a code 45. This is Rich Exhaust/ high O2 voltage.
4) The TPS and MAP sensor put out values that are within spec. When I unplugged the TPS it threw a Code 22 (Low TPS signal voltage)
5) when I went to set base timing by disconnecting the ignition control wire it threw a code 42. (open/short component failure)
when I plugged the control wire back in, I saw no change in timing. This seems suspicious to me.
I am aware that the ECM will hold the injectors open longer if it "thinks" the spark is weak because of low battery voltage. The charging system runs at 13.7 V at idle. This measurement was at accessories not at the battery posts or at the ECM."
To my last point on the above "just-answers" quote; does anyone know how to check if the system is compensating for weak spark?
I have not put a tach on it so am not sure what rpm it is idling. Sounds high if I run it at 11 psi but pull vacuum on the map. Sounds normal if I leave the map alone and run the fuel pressure down to 3 psi. I took the numbers off the ECM. It has the single prom chip as apposed to the two chips. I don't have those numbers with me. I will try to get my hands on a known good one. I took resistance values from the coil and some other things. I will post them when I get my notebook back. Pretty sure the firing order is good. I have done retarder things though, so I will double check. It doesn't run like any wires are switched. I did note that the spark, according to my timing light at least does perhaps start to cut out a little when I put it in gear and try to move it. It does sound like it starts to miss badly when put in gear and will not move more than a little bit, I can keep it running with the throttle. I tried giving more fuel pressure while opening the throttle in gear to see if it switched to being too lean at open throttle. More fuel pressure kills it.
Thanks again everyone,
-Ross
"Please note this is a GM TBI system.
1) New parts include: MAP sensor, Coolant sensor, AC-delco injectors, AC-delco fuel pump and strainer, fuel pressure regulator diaphragm. AC-delco spark plugs. cap and rotor and coil apear new as well but I did not replace them.
2) In your answer you had stated that it could be the fuel pump giving internal faults causing the ECM to try to compensate. TBI systems call for 9-13 psi. The reg holds a steady 11 psi. I hooked an inline regulator into the system because the engine will not start when fuel pressures are in the 9-13 psi range. I adjusted pressure higher (15 plus) and lower. It will start when pressure is dropped to 5 psi. It runs better at 2-3 psi than 5.
3) There is only 1 Oxygen sensor and it is a single wire non heated type. The ECM ignores it until operating temperature has been reached. When it finally did reach operating temperature it threw a code 45. This is Rich Exhaust/ high O2 voltage.
4) The TPS and MAP sensor put out values that are within spec. When I unplugged the TPS it threw a Code 22 (Low TPS signal voltage)
5) when I went to set base timing by disconnecting the ignition control wire it threw a code 42. (open/short component failure)
when I plugged the control wire back in, I saw no change in timing. This seems suspicious to me.
I am aware that the ECM will hold the injectors open longer if it "thinks" the spark is weak because of low battery voltage. The charging system runs at 13.7 V at idle. This measurement was at accessories not at the battery posts or at the ECM."
To my last point on the above "just-answers" quote; does anyone know how to check if the system is compensating for weak spark?
I have not put a tach on it so am not sure what rpm it is idling. Sounds high if I run it at 11 psi but pull vacuum on the map. Sounds normal if I leave the map alone and run the fuel pressure down to 3 psi. I took the numbers off the ECM. It has the single prom chip as apposed to the two chips. I don't have those numbers with me. I will try to get my hands on a known good one. I took resistance values from the coil and some other things. I will post them when I get my notebook back. Pretty sure the firing order is good. I have done retarder things though, so I will double check. It doesn't run like any wires are switched. I did note that the spark, according to my timing light at least does perhaps start to cut out a little when I put it in gear and try to move it. It does sound like it starts to miss badly when put in gear and will not move more than a little bit, I can keep it running with the throttle. I tried giving more fuel pressure while opening the throttle in gear to see if it switched to being too lean at open throttle. More fuel pressure kills it.
Thanks again everyone,
-Ross
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