Is this the future for Class A's?

Bumpyroad wrote:
sounds like a lot of hot air from greenies to me. when these turbines/etc. use up the air, what fills the void?
bumpy

LOL, are forests doing the same thing? A lot of times, it is just people fishing for "FREE" money. Do people know what kind of pollution the manufacturing these batteries cause? The same with solar panels. Oh, by the laws of thermal dynamics go something like this; You are not get more than you put in, and you will never break even. Take solar panels for example, you will never get the energy back out of them, that it took to manufacture them.

rgatijnet1 wrote:

Bumpyroad wrote:
sounds like a lot of hot air from greenies to me. when these turbines/etc. use up the air, what fills the void?
bumpy

The void is filled with slower moving air much like a breakwater slows the wave action against the shore.

and this is bad because??? last I saw, the air is constantly changing velocity.
bumpy

Bumpyroad wrote:
sounds like a lot of hot air from greenies to me. when these turbines/etc. use up the air, what fills the void?
bumpy

The void is filled with slower moving air much like a breakwater slows the wave action against the shore.

sounds like a lot of hot air from greenies to me. when these turbines/etc. use up the air, what fills the void?
bumpy

rgatijnet1 wrote:

John & Angela wrote:


Good morning Chainright. Along those lines, we are in Palm SPrings for the winter so we took a really good tour of the windmill operations in the Palm Springs area recently. A huge chunk of land that various companies use for setting up their wind power operations and selling the power into the grid. As we went through the various stages and phases our guide talked about the Spanish companies that owned those units, the German companies that owned those, the french companies that owned those over there, the chinese companies that owned those over yonder and so on and so on. Lots of companies. I asked if there were any American companies that had a stake in the operation and he said yes, GE still had some windmills operating. It seemed that the majority of the players were foreign companies making and selling power to California. Interesting.

Very good tour by the way.

What is interesting to note is that all actions have consequences. Under investigation right now is the effect that the large windmill farms may have on the environment. The windmills use some of the wind moving trough the area which reduces the amount of wind that exits the area. It is being researched as to what the effect on local weather will be if the natural wind currents are disrupted by large wind farms.
Perhaps we need to investigate more thoroughly what the possible future effects may be on any new technology that is touted as being the next great thing for mankind.

True. We saw all/see all the damage caused by Pollution and Gasoline motors/engines/plants have had on our environment, but not many seem to care. Hopefully we don't make the same mistake.

John & Angela wrote:


Good morning Chainright. Along those lines, we are in Palm SPrings for the winter so we took a really good tour of the windmill operations in the Palm Springs area recently. A huge chunk of land that various companies use for setting up their wind power operations and selling the power into the grid. As we went through the various stages and phases our guide talked about the Spanish companies that owned those units, the German companies that owned those, the french companies that owned those over there, the chinese companies that owned those over yonder and so on and so on. Lots of companies. I asked if there were any American companies that had a stake in the operation and he said yes, GE still had some windmills operating. It seemed that the majority of the players were foreign companies making and selling power to California. Interesting.

Very good tour by the way.

What is interesting to note is that all actions have consequences. Under investigation right now is the effect that the large windmill farms may have on the environment. The windmills use some of the wind moving trough the area which reduces the amount of wind that exits the area. It is being researched as to what the effect on local weather will be if the natural wind currents are disrupted by large wind farms.
Perhaps we need to investigate more thoroughly what the possible future effects may be on any new technology that is touted as being the next great thing for mankind.

The Tesla semi-truck will be priced at about $200,000. The battery pack will actually be 4 batteries and provide 1MWh. Tesla is planning that the cost of the battery pack will drop due to mass production. Originally it was thought the battery would cost $100,000.

Chainwright wrote:

Rick Jay wrote:
Chainwright,

As one of those "Baby Boomers", my comments are that I've seen technology come and go, for a variety of reasons. What was it, about 2010 or so, 3D Televisions were becoming all the rage. People started buying them in droves. Well, try to find one now. Seven years later and the technology is officially dead.

And you can say "Yeah, but this is Tesla, they're too big." Well, Sony, Samsung, LG, etc. who all pushed the 3D technology are also pretty big.

I think electric vehicles will continue to have a presence in the market. I just don't think it's going to happen as quickly as many think. The electric vehicles need COMMON charging technology and FAST charging, measured on the order of how long it takes to fill a tank with gasoline. Proprietary charging technologies will do nothing to advance the cause. The EV manufacturers need to form a consortium such as was done for USB & MIDI computer interfaces. Get everybody onboard with a standard. If Ford's only worked with Sunoco gasoline and Honda's with Texaco gasoline, can you imagine how that would lessen the appeal of the automobile?

There's a gas station almost on every corner, and even out in the boonies, you can usually get to one within reason. And even if you can't get the vehicle to a gas station, you can bring 5 gallons of gas to the vehicle pretty easily, which will get you moving again. EV charging stations will have to reach that level of market penetration before many feel comfortable purchasing one. They just don't meet the requirements many people need or want in a vehicle.

I'm not saying it won't happen, I just don't see it happening as fast. And, since I'm on the soap box, I think autonomous vehicles will see similar delays.

Yup, I'm a boomer...and I still remember paying over $3,000 for my first IBM PC compatible with DUAL 5 1/4" floppy drives and no Hard drive. The dot matrix printer was another $1000. Ouch. And those were 1985 dollars!!! (On Edit: I just used an inflation calculator and $4000 in 1985 dollars is equivalent to more $9000 in 2016 dollars. Double OUCH!!!!)

So, yeah, some of us "old timers" have played the "bleeding edge technology" game several times over our lives, and we'd rather put our money into things which have a better chance of long-term viability. Gasoline will be around for a long time. But I'm not 100% confident that a battery made for an EV available now will have a replacement available in 10 years. That's important for me as we tend to keep our vehicles 15-20 years, at least.

As an electrical engineer, I enjoy reading about the advancements in this technology, I just don't see it being adopted as quickly as others.

~Rick

I hear ya Rick. I'm a gen X. Fortunately or unfortunately (point of view) I have traveled a LOT since I was 3. I lived abroad in various countries 1/2+ of my life. I saw Alternate forms of Energy powering machines 40 yrs ago. All the while over here, we're still "stuck" on, Mainly, 1 Form of Energy. Technology Advances at a far too fast rate for us to still, after sooo many yrs, be stuck on Gasoline. Ok, let's throw out the Hybrids, let's through out the EV's, You mean After over 100 yrs on gasoline, this is the best we can do? WE used to be the Innovators of the world. Advanced technological discoveries used to be OUR middle name. And now, every time something that could benefit society is invented, something that is money saving, It's Produced in Japan or Korea, Or Sweden. A few other countries are about to make Gas a thing of the past in the next 10 to 15 yrs. Why aren't we among those? what's holding us back?

Good morning Chainright. Along those lines, we are in Palm SPrings for the winter so we took a really good tour of the windmill operations in the Palm Springs area recently. A huge chunk of land that various companies use for setting up their wind power operations and selling the power into the grid. As we went through the various stages and phases our guide talked about the Spanish companies that owned those units, the German companies that owned those, the french companies that owned those over there, the chinese companies that owned those over yonder and so on and so on. Lots of companies. I asked if there were any American companies that had a stake in the operation and he said yes, GE still had some windmills operating. It seemed that the majority of the players were foreign companies making and selling power to California. Interesting.

Very good tour by the way.

Rick Jay wrote:
Chainwright,

As one of those "Baby Boomers", my comments are that I've seen technology come and go, for a variety of reasons. What was it, about 2010 or so, 3D Televisions were becoming all the rage. People started buying them in droves. Well, try to find one now. Seven years later and the technology is officially dead.

And you can say "Yeah, but this is Tesla, they're too big." Well, Sony, Samsung, LG, etc. who all pushed the 3D technology are also pretty big.

I think electric vehicles will continue to have a presence in the market. I just don't think it's going to happen as quickly as many think. The electric vehicles need COMMON charging technology and FAST charging, measured on the order of how long it takes to fill a tank with gasoline. Proprietary charging technologies will do nothing to advance the cause. The EV manufacturers need to form a consortium such as was done for USB & MIDI computer interfaces. Get everybody onboard with a standard. If Ford's only worked with Sunoco gasoline and Honda's with Texaco gasoline, can you imagine how that would lessen the appeal of the automobile?

There's a gas station almost on every corner, and even out in the boonies, you can usually get to one within reason. And even if you can't get the vehicle to a gas station, you can bring 5 gallons of gas to the vehicle pretty easily, which will get you moving again. EV charging stations will have to reach that level of market penetration before many feel comfortable purchasing one. They just don't meet the requirements many people need or want in a vehicle.

I'm not saying it won't happen, I just don't see it happening as fast. And, since I'm on the soap box, I think autonomous vehicles will see similar delays.

Yup, I'm a boomer...and I still remember paying over $3,000 for my first IBM PC compatible with DUAL 5 1/4" floppy drives and no Hard drive. The dot matrix printer was another $1000. Ouch. And those were 1985 dollars!!! (On Edit: I just used an inflation calculator and $4000 in 1985 dollars is equivalent to more $9000 in 2016 dollars. Double OUCH!!!!)

So, yeah, some of us "old timers" have played the "bleeding edge technology" game several times over our lives, and we'd rather put our money into things which have a better chance of long-term viability. Gasoline will be around for a long time. But I'm not 100% confident that a battery made for an EV available now will have a replacement available in 10 years. That's important for me as we tend to keep our vehicles 15-20 years, at least.

As an electrical engineer, I enjoy reading about the advancements in this technology, I just don't see it being adopted as quickly as others.

~Rick

I hear ya Rick. I'm a gen X. Fortunately or unfortunately (point of view) I have traveled a LOT since I was 3. I lived abroad in various countries 1/2+ of my life. I saw Alternate forms of Energy powering machines 40 yrs ago. All the while over here, we're still "stuck" on, Mainly, 1 Form of Energy. Technology Advances at a far too fast rate for us to still, after sooo many yrs, be stuck on Gasoline. Ok, let's throw out the Hybrids, let's through out the EV's, You mean After over 100 yrs on gasoline, this is the best we can do? WE used to be the Innovators of the world. Advanced technological discoveries used to be OUR middle name. And now, every time something that could benefit society is invented, something that is money saving, It's Produced in Japan or Korea, Or Sweden. A few other countries are about to make Gas a thing of the past in the next 10 to 15 yrs. Why aren't we among those? what's holding us back?

As a Millennial, I really chuckled at the Tesla when I saw them for sale in the shopping mall of all places, yet today I can't believe how many I commute with daily in Denver. Far more than I ever thought possible in such a short time.

At the same time, I see autonomous technology in my face continuously and you just can't ignore it anymore - Not just the beer truck that made driverless deliveries of beer in Denver, but little pieces of it, passenger cars that park themselves, cruise control that not only paces itself to the car in front of you, it can stop by itself without your input. These are cars I would go out and buy today!

It's coming, and the oil industry isn't going to stop it.