So what is the consensus best order of suspension improvements on a E450 motorhome?My guess:Proper tire pressureFront end alignmentRear SwayFront SwayShocksSteering StabilizerRear Track BarAm i close?

From personal experience, I'd venture you're pretty close. Without the first two, you're shooting in the dark with the rest.Weight and Loading figure into this, early in the game. If Front Axle isn't at least 1/3 of total weight, even better at 3/4 of rated capacity, the steering will be vague.Rear Sway always first on a Class C, Front Sway will always help, but probably more dramatically on the E-Series from 1992-2007, the years Ford used that sorry bushings-in-the-axle arrangement instead of the end links they went back to in 2008 and newer.Good Shocks always help, so I'm comfortable with their position in the lineup. The last two? A rear track bar has made a huge difference to some E450 owners, my experience was less of a dramatic change. In my case, I learned that towing my midsize pickup de-stabilizes the RV's tracking a little, and that little is a little more than our Corolla does that. Track Bar helped that slightly. Another OP just claimed a significant improvement in the handling of another E450......which is why there's a degree of mystery in all this. Of several very similar rigs, one may seem to drive as well with little to no "improvements" as another with many upgrades. One miserable one may improve dramatically and another not much. I think some of this is just random, and that some of it stems from different operating conditions AND the expectations of the Owners...

The first two are undoubtedly correct. Tire pressure also has the advantage of costing nothing (or close enough to nothing) to do.Replacing shocks may fall under general maintenance if they're worn, in which case I'd bump that up the list pretty high. The same for replacing the steering damper (but not necessarily substituting a steering stabilizer system with centering springs). Of course, on a 2018 I would not expect either to be worn yet in most cases!Helper springs, or stiffer springs for the front, be they pneumatic (such as Ride-Rite air bags) or steel possibly should be on the list if you're riding low. I don't know if it's still the case (I think it is), but at least for several years the rear leaf springs on the E-450 by design are more or less flat, which makes them look like they're sagging even when unloaded. It's also worth noting that the ride height in the front affects the alignment to some degree; the camber changes, due to the suspension design, and the angle of the chassis as a whole front to back does affect the (effective) caster angle a little.Before doing anything heroic, I would drive for a bit, at least sufficient to determine if anything is really needed. I've never felt my class C handled poorly, though I didn't expect or get subcompact car like handling. It's a big, sometimes cumbersome vehicle, and behaves as such...but it does behave.

S1njin wrote:So what is the consensus best order of suspension improvements on a E450 motorhome?My guess:Proper tire pressureFront end alignmentRear SwayFront SwayShocksSteering StabilizerRear Track BarAm i close?I would add to the Front end alignment, make that an all wheel alignment. The next thing I would do is a track/panhard bar. This helps cut down on the movement of rear of the coach. You have a lot of overhang behind the rear wheels and it will move the whole coach in wind or big trucks passing.Look for the cheap handling fix on google.Look at changing out the rubber bushings in the sway bars with polypropylene, it will stiffen up the ride.Shocks, it depends on age/condition. Yes stiffer shocks will help.I am not a big fan of the stabilizers but if nothing else makes you happy with it go ahead and try one.:DBill

You need to keep in mind that a Class C is a 1 ton cutaway van. It is never going to handle like your family car. :S IMHO: Any Class C that does not drive and handle well with the proper tire pressure and a decent alignment is the WRONG coach. There should be no need to add aftermarket garbage to get your coach to drive decently.If it did not dirve well on the thorough test drive {you did do a thorough test drive, right?} adding thousands of dollars of aftermarket equipment is a waste of your time and money. Will quality after market gear improve the ride and handling? Perhaps, but it is only money needlessly/foolishly spent due to buying the wrong coach in the first place.Quality coaches {like Coachhouse, Born Free, Phoenix Cruiser and yes, my Nexus et al} need nothing more than proper psi and alignment to give smooth, stable ride and handling. Some manufacturers actually recommend getting your brand new $100K+ coach aligned and the suspensiopn modified right off the showroom floor. Would you buy a $100k SUV that came with the same recommendation? :hAs always... opinions and YMMV.:C

I don't know about the newer E450 chassis, but my chassis year 2005 E450 under our Winnebago Itasca came new with these items - which on our small (24 ft) Class C are completely adequate as is:Rear Sway (a torsion bar)Front Sway (a torsion bar)Steering Stabilizer (a horizontal shock absorber)However, maybe a larger Class C coach would require different after-market versions of the above, or maybe new E450 chassis come stock from Ford with different designs of what mine has on it.In addition, due to our situation of a small Class C on the heavier duty E450 instead of the normally adequate E350, I had to use somewhat uncommon shocks on the rear to help reduce the stiff ride back there from the light weight coach.

Suspension Improvements - Best Order | Good Sam Community

Harvard
Explorer
May 10, 2018
S1njin wrote:
Well I went to get my rig and ended up leaving it there another night. 3.5 caster? No thanks, at least 5 or bust !

Post by 2kGeorgieBoy

Re Wandering at highway speeds
Reply #36 on: March 14, 2018, 09:07:02 PM

START QUOTE:
Jeff..Although we have a 2000 Georgie Boy 31' Maverick "C" on a Ford E450 chassis, I can fully agree on the caster effects, at least for us. When we got the unit in Jan 2014, the dealer had us take into a truck shop for an alignment. It turned out OK....A trip to Moab shortly there after brought out the problems. I then started reading the threads and comments here about the caster settings....esp., from Harvard. I checked the data from the first alignment and found that it was set at about 3 1/2 degrees positive...about in the middle of Ford's recommended range. Shortly before a cross country trip to Maryland in fall of 2016, I returned to the shop where the first alignment was done. I talked to the service manager and he knew of the problems with the E450's and was happy to increase the caster as I asked. The alignment tech was also familiar with it and ended up with settings close to 5.5 degrees positive. WHAT A DIFFERENCE! The unit tracked straight down the road, passing semis no longer caused a white knuckle hold on the wheel, and overall it was just a lot more enjoyable. It did however increase steering effort a little but not anything to worry about. But, be sure that the shop you go to is willing to "think outside of the box". Our first alignment was "plain vanilla", right in the middle like it was always done. Second time out, they were very willing to increase settings beyond what normally would be done, and still stay with in Ford's guidelines (0-7 degrees, I believe). I realize that our E450 chassis is an entirely different animal than yours, but I was trying to add support to the caster increase thinking and how it helped us......if you go down that road.
END QUOTE:
S1njin
Explorer
May 10, 2018
Well I went to get my rig and ended up leaving it there another night. 3.5 caster? No thanks, at least 5 or bust !
txnese
Explorer
May 09, 2018
I installed Bilstein 24-174534 5100 Series Steering Damper, Bilstein 33-187570 B6 Series HD Shock Absorber (Front), and Bilstein 33-176857 B6 Series HD Shock Absorber (Rear). Also changed out the Sway Bars with Helwig HEL-7008 (Front) and HEL-7180 (Rear). What a difference in ride quality and stability. No Regrets here. Took me about 2-3 hours total.
Solo
Explorer
May 08, 2018
S1njin wrote:
So what is the consensus best order of suspension improvements on a E450 motorhome?

My guess:
Proper tire pressure
Front end alignment
Rear Sway
Front Sway
Shocks
Steering Stabilizer
Rear Track Bar

Am i close?

On our formerly owned E450, I did all of those myself (and a few more) in a systematic procedure one-by-one and then tested to see the differences. So many variables here (road conditions, wind, towing or not, loads, driver preference, etc) that it is impossible to use my experiences as "this is how it should be done" but, our motorhomes were very similar in size so here goes for whatever it is worth in the order that I did them (doing it again, I would do the alignment in #2 spot):

1. Tire PSI-got accurate load data from a certified scale and used the Michelin data to adjust. Result: smoother ride, less lane drifting.
2. Shocks-Replaced 2 year old factory shocks with Bilstein. Result: Less "jarring" on expansion joints, less rocking side-to-side, nice improvement.
3. Roadmaster Reflex Steering Stabalizer-Result, centering on crowned road surfaces was appreciated.
4. Alignment: I had way too much + camber, not enough + toe and not nearly enough + caster. Result: Much less wandering at highway speed, drastically improved tire wear (from decreasing + camber).
5. Front and rear sway bars. Replaced the factory Ford front and rear with Helwigs. Result: Reduced side-to-side sway and minimized being pushed around-good improvement.
6. Rear panhard bar (track bar). Result: No noticeable difference.
7. Rear air bags (the original motorhome had none). Result-less "pounding" on expansion joints from the rear, smoothed the ride, nice improvement.

In the end, a predictable chassis to drive in most situations. Wind was still our enemy and living in the Great Plains, we know wind.

Yes, you are close. Good luck with your challenge.
j-d
Explorer II
May 07, 2018
Ron IS an engineer with the disciplined mindset that comes with it.
Me? Experience, much gained the hard way... mistake. So, put BORG custom valves from CW or duallyvalve.com so you can check quickly and often.
You will find the tires have not lost air like they did with OEM or rubber valves, extensions and such.
If pressure is down, something is wrong. Start looking for that roofing nail, drywall screw etc.
I can check six tires and two airbags in a minute or two. That's ALL not Each. And with any gauge.
Airing up is 3 months or so.
Don't forget the SPARE.
S1njin
Explorer
May 07, 2018
I've got 2 of those digital ones you posted about. They are within .5 psi of each other, so I've been using those as my accurate gauges. The gauge I use w/ the double chuck tire filler is off by 4psi on the stingy side. So I know I need to add 4 to whatever that gauge tells me.
ron_dittmer
Explorer II
May 07, 2018
Yes, 5 psi makes a difference. That is why having an accurate tire gauge is critical. Click Here to read a post I wrote on my experience evalating all my tire gauges. What I thought was my best tire gauge, was my worst, off by whopping 9 psi.
j-d
Explorer II
May 07, 2018
S1njin wrote:
..It’s amazing what 5 pounds in the front will diií

Thank you for saying that!
Proper pressure is always a factor.
Ford E-Series with RV on its back, it is essential.
Take pressure from Michelin Chart based on actual truck scale weight. Loaded for camping, people and all.
Add a few PSI..3+4..if tires are warm.
Don't play Outguess The Engineer.
Cash in on the Hard Earned Experience of others.
Harvard
Explorer
May 07, 2018
Not just +5 Caster, take all you can get.
S1njin
Explorer
May 07, 2018
So I put about 250 miles on her this weekend. The ride out with 75 in the fronts wasn’t bad. The ride back with 70 was a whole lot better. It’s amazing what 5 pounds in the front will do. I didn’t weigh myself yet, but my Greyhawk was 5 feet longer and 800 pounds heavier from the factory and I could have put 70s in the fronts after weighing on the way to Disney for 10 days. I didn’t see myself at risk in my more modestly proportioned camper.

So tomorrow is alignment day at the truck shop. I’ll ask for plus 5 caster when I drop it off.

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