The title says all - which is cheaper overall in terms of total ownership cost over around 8 years? (which obviously should include the depreciation cost, maintenance/repair costs and the residual value at the end).I'm looking at a low-end Diesel pusher, around 35ft and a new model seems to go for around $200-240k MSRP.

Cheaper? Really? Not when you are talking class A.

Mike Hohnstein wrote:Cheaper? Really? Not when you are talking class A.Obviously, both are not going to be cheap. But I don't want to ignore costs completely either.What I'm asking here, is which is CHEAPER. I fully recognize that going class A is not going to be the best investment for my money.

NO ONE KNOWS>BUY THE ONE YOU LIKE.

Acei wrote:The title says all - which is cheaper overall in terms of total ownership cost over around 8 years? (which obviously should include the depreciation cost, maintenance/repair costs and the residual value at the end).I'm looking at a low-end Diesel pusher, around 35ft and a new model seems to go for around $200-240k MSRP.As long as a unit is nice and well kept, used is always going to be cheaper over the short or long term. One must remember that the highest cost of ownership is in the depreciation per mile and depreciation does decrease with age.

I guess I'm indirectly asking the difference in maintenance cost between a new model and a 3-year old model if kept for 8 years or longer. At what point, does DP start accumulate significant repair cost?As a comparison, if I intend to own a car for 8 years or longer, I would just buy it new, rather than getting a 3-year old used model. Not sure how it compares vs Class A DP...

Which is cheaper - new or 3-year old over 8 years?

49 Replies

Bill_Satellite
Explorer II
Feb 07, 2014
Effy wrote:
WOW!! I think I finally got it. Depreciation does not matter if you never sell the motorhome. And, maintenance cost does not matter if you never drive it. So, if you buy a new motorhome and pay cash for the purchase, it never cost anything because you just traded dollars in the bank for an asset in your driveway. I got it. You just buy it with cash, park it, never sell it and the cost of ownership is zero.

Making an assumption this is a bad attempt at sarcasm.....

Personally, I thought it was an excellent job of sarcasm.
John_Joey
Explorer
Feb 06, 2014
Effy wrote:
...snip...You paid for a depreciating asset and have a return on investment of use. What's it's value?

You got it now, but you have to now factor in how much are you really going to use it. For the past six years we've been on the road six months a year. Over that time I got to see a lot, and met a lot of RV people.

Unless you FT or PT most MH don't get used that much per year. The average distance per year is 4-5,000 miles. I would suspect that the average nights slept in the MH may be 20 nights. Do you really need a high end coach for that, do you really need a new one for that, do you really need full body paint for that, or a DP, etc....

You paid for a depreciating asset and have a return on investment of showmanship. What's it's value?
paulcardoza
Explorer
Feb 06, 2014
For fulltiming, the depreciation issue takes a back seat to build quality, IMO. The entry level rigs that the OP is looking at are LESS suited to fulltiming. For the same cash outlay as a new rig, he could get a more high-end rig that would make him much happier over the long haul.
Effy
Explorer II
Feb 06, 2014
Since all RV depreciation per year model is pretty much the same we'll say the rate is constant. THen 2 factors determine the amount, price paid and length of time owned. If you don't plan on selling them why bother with it. And we all know driving a new RV off the lot puts you at a 20% loss. THey sell a lot of new RV's every year so apparently the doom and gloom on depreciation isn't having the catastophic affect some would have you believe. Again, if you buy an RV as an investment to sell it you are a fool and come talk to me. If you buy an RV for the enjoyment of RV-ing then the number is meaningless. If you buy an RV and find you don't like it, well that's called a mistake. You pay for that one. Big time. But new or used depreciates at about the same rate really. Try buying a 3 yr old MH, using for a year adding miles and getting what you paid. Ain't gonna happen. Again, a used MH will likley offer you a better coach for the same price but it's used. Whoever is selling it takes the depreciation hit - because they sold it. If you take a vacation to an island, Airfare, hotel, car food etc. Technically that depreciates at a rate of 100% when you check out. Did you lose money? No. You got the intagible item called "use". You gained usage in exchange for depreciation. Same with an RV. You get use. Which encapsulates all kinds of things like fun, family, travel, memories which is why we buy rv's in the first place. So unless you made the mistake mentioned above you lose nothing. You paid for a depreciating asset and have a return on investment of use. What's it's value?
Effy
Explorer II
Feb 06, 2014
Effy wrote:
pablo77 wrote:
Daveinet wrote:
Its not uncommon for people to buy an RV and then realize they don't like RVing, or their life style took a sudden change.

Lets assume a brand new coach has a useful life of 20 years. If I buy a brand new coach for 100K, and 1 year later it is worth 60K, my cost of ownership is 40K for the first year. If I start out with a 1 year old coach for 60K, I just saved 40K on my initial purchase, because in real value, a 1 year old coach is not worth that much less in usefulness. So in that perspective, I can buy a coach that will last 20 years for 100K or I can buy a coach that will last for 19 years for 60K. Now invest that left over 40K for 19 years and tell me what the return in that investment is. Trust me, 40K invested over 19 years will buy you another used coach that will last more than that final 20th year.

Your assumption supports your argument but I think it's a false one.
From my research, typically, a 100k brand new coach will be worth between 85k and 90k after one year.If you paid 100k for a brand new coach that is only worth 60k after one year, you got taken big time. I'm talking actual price, not MSRP which skews the numbers big time. If you go with MSRP of 100k then your numbers might work. JMHO

x2, show me a 1 yr old $100k coach I can buy for $60k and I would buy them all day long. (MSRP removed from the equation) And the cost of ownership is not $40k for a year. Man thank goodness this wonderland math does not exist in the real world. Your cost of ownership is what you paid amortized over the length of time you own the coach plus maint and repairs. While depreciation is included in TCO, the depreciation hit is not realized unless you sell. THEN you take the hit. Unless someone is reaching into your pocket for this inflated $40k it did NOT actually cost you that. Were that the case the banks would demand the depreciation offset in year one to further securitize the loan. And that is not how the banking world operates. Been doing it for 25 years. And lets be frank, TCO and depreciation are majorally releveant to corporations which is why they get offset for it. An asset so ill performing as an RV is almost a liability. The entire investment - if you want to call it that is a loss. TCO is price, depreciation, main, repairs etc, amortized over the life of the asset or the length of time you own the asset.
Effy
Explorer II
Feb 06, 2014
pablo77 wrote:
Daveinet wrote:
Its not uncommon for people to buy an RV and then realize they don't like RVing, or their life style took a sudden change.

Lets assume a brand new coach has a useful life of 20 years. If I buy a brand new coach for 100K, and 1 year later it is worth 60K, my cost of ownership is 40K for the first year. If I start out with a 1 year old coach for 60K, I just saved 40K on my initial purchase, because in real value, a 1 year old coach is not worth that much less in usefulness. So in that perspective, I can buy a coach that will last 20 years for 100K or I can buy a coach that will last for 19 years for 60K. Now invest that left over 40K for 19 years and tell me what the return in that investment is. Trust me, 40K invested over 19 years will buy you another used coach that will last more than that final 20th year.

Your assumption supports your argument but I think it's a false one.
From my research, typically, a 100k brand new coach will be worth between 85k and 90k after one year.If you paid 100k for a brand new coach that is only worth 60k after one year, you got taken big time. I'm talking actual price, not MSRP which skews the numbers big time. If you go with MSRP of 100k then your numbers might work. JMHO
pablo77
Explorer
Feb 06, 2014
Daveinet wrote:
Its not uncommon for people to buy an RV and then realize they don't like RVing, or their life style took a sudden change.

Lets assume a brand new coach has a useful life of 20 years. If I buy a brand new coach for 100K, and 1 year later it is worth 60K, my cost of ownership is 40K for the first year. If I start out with a 1 year old coach for 60K, I just saved 40K on my initial purchase, because in real value, a 1 year old coach is not worth that much less in usefulness. So in that perspective, I can buy a coach that will last 20 years for 100K or I can buy a coach that will last for 19 years for 60K. Now invest that left over 40K for 19 years and tell me what the return in that investment is. Trust me, 40K invested over 19 years will buy you another used coach that will last more than that final 20th year.

Your assumption supports your argument but I think it's a false one.
From my research, typically, a 100k brand new coach will be worth between 85k and 90k after one year.If you paid 100k for a brand new coach that is only worth 60k after one year, you got taken big time. I'm talking actual price, not MSRP which skews the numbers big time. If you go with MSRP of 100k then your numbers might work. JMHO
Daveinet
Explorer
Feb 05, 2014
Its not uncommon for people to buy an RV and then realize they don't like RVing, or their life style took a sudden change.

Lets assume a brand new coach has a useful life of 20 years. If I buy a brand new coach for 100K, and 1 year later it is worth 60K, my cost of ownership is 40K for the first year. If I start out with a 1 year old coach for 60K, I just saved 40K on my initial purchase, because in real value, a 1 year old coach is not worth that much less in usefulness. So in that perspective, I can buy a coach that will last 20 years for 100K or I can buy a coach that will last for 19 years for 60K. Now invest that left over 40K for 19 years and tell me what the return in that investment is. Trust me, 40K invested over 19 years will buy you another used coach that will last more than that final 20th year.
Effy
Explorer II
Feb 05, 2014
I always question 1-3 year old MH's. Why were they traded or being sold. Always makes me wonder. I am sure there are more often than not good reasons but I get paranoid with used stuff. That's just me. BTW unless you buy a pretty high end unit, you aren't saving 100k by buying the same thing 3 years old.
PastorCharlie
Explorer
Feb 05, 2014
A 3 year old MH is about equal with a new one as far as usage, unless it has been abused. I would rather have a 3 year old MH and $100,000.00 in my pocket than a new one with zero dollars.

MH for MH they sit on the same chassis and have the same appliances. The only difference is one has been used for 3 years part time. Routine maintenance is the same on a used and new.

Your list of Newmar, Tiffin, etc. MH are good reliable manufacturers, even Prevost and Newells have problems like all the rest....