Best Spyware, Malware Recommendation

burlmart wrote:

I am confused. How does a daily updated AV scanner (MSE, AVG, BitDefender) not get zero day malware before a manual once-a-week scan w/ Malwarebytes?

Because anti-virus programs so not look for malware. One would think since malware can be very annoying, that they might.

Malware is for the most part trying to get in your face to sell you something or to track your Internet use to sell your information to someone that wants to sell you something.

Viruses try to do devious things like taking over your system to be used for their purposes or to corrupt your system so it will not run.

That is my understanding and experience. I have removed many of both types from friend's and client's systems.

SCR wrote:

Wayne Dohnal wrote:
In 2 years of running no antivirus software and not running in Administrator mode, I've had zero viruses as measured by occasional running of Malwarebytes.

Prior to that, running in Administrator mode with antivirus software I had a virus get past it about every 2 months.

You are aware that Malwarebytes is not Anti-Virus Software. It was never designed to scan for a virus.

Malwarebytes Anti-Malware is not meant to be a replacement for antivirus software. Malwarebytes Anti-Malware is a complementary but essential program which detects and removes zero-day malware and "Malware in the Wild".....

Source: Malwarebytes Support

I am confused. How does a daily updated AV scanner (MSE, AVG, BitDefender) not get zero day malware before a manual once-a-week scan w/ Malwarebytes?

Wayne Dohnal wrote:
In 2 years of running no antivirus software and not running in Administrator mode, I've had zero viruses as measured by occasional running of Malwarebytes.

Prior to that, running in Administrator mode with antivirus software I had a virus get past it about every 2 months.

You are aware that Malwarebytes is not Anti-Virus Software. It was never designed to scan for a virus.

Malwarebytes Anti-Malware is not meant to be a replacement for antivirus software. Malwarebytes Anti-Malware is a complementary but essential program which detects and removes zero-day malware and "Malware in the Wild".....

Source: Malwarebytes Support

In 2 years of running no antivirus software and not running in Administrator mode, I've had zero viruses as measured by occasional running of Malwarebytes.

Prior to that, running in Administrator mode with antivirus software I had a virus get past it about every 2 months.

1492 wrote:
@SCR, have you "personally" tested your security methods for effectiveness? I have, and just don't go by reviews though consider them an effective starting point.

Yes, I have and do test my system security. I use a layered protection scheme as well. There no single software or hardware that is 100% as you and I previously stated.

Net security is a dynamic situation. What was a top rated AV a few years back can do an about face and end up at the bottom today. Largely due to development not keeping current. Case in point MSE? Was considered top in its class when first introduced, now just a baseline for other AV packages.

Depending on which testing methodology is used, MSE/Defender still garners around 85-90% detection rates. That's still notable, but what about the 10-15% that goes undetected which other FREE AV packages flag, that could end up causing damage to the user personally?

The fact is, hackers are too sophisticated these days. On par with the developers of the OS and apps they are trying to exploit. And their methods are dangerous, such as employing encryption to block access to files. Though the FBI just recently shut down the infamous Crypto Locker servers, but admit that this may just be temporary solution. Or the too common keylogger capture trojan/rootkits, which have been responsible for virtually all the recent account breaches including Target.

@SCR, have you "personally" tested your security methods for effectiveness? I have, and just don't go by reviews though consider them an effective starting point.

Some disturbing results include keylogger trojans/rootkits, which I personally believe to be the most dangerous threat to most users. Good luck finding almost any AV package that is effective in locating these. I couldn't. Though specialized Free tools from Malwarebytes tend to be the most successful. If you can't detect these, you can't always stop them?

For example, how safe are password managers against common keyloggers? I was able to capture my Master password, and every login password from my manager app. Either using copy-n-paste or via keyboard. So disturbing, that as a result, I changed my Master password to use only Windows Secured desktop.

How about using a soft keyboard to input passwords? Useless! Was able to capture every login password keystroke, despite the common belief that this is a safe method to do so.

How safe are net based password managers against keyloggers? Only as good as the method used to secure or edit passwords online. Though I was not able to capture individual passwords, I was able to capture the login/pass for the online account itself. So had access to the web account.

What about browser built-in password databases? I actually was not able to capture any passwords from these using common keyloggers, such as from Firefox. In fact, now use Firefox password database, separately hardened with Truecrypt which is recommended by Mozilla, as primary password storage except for financial sites. Of course, this is only as good as no exploits to the browser password manager is discovered.

How about using a separate FREE anti-keylogger encryption app? Very effective with a caveat! Prevented keylogging/capture of every password using either copy-n-paste or via keyboard, so long as the app loads first! If the keylogger loads first, it can control the clipboard and render it useless.

But just one security app I use as part of a layered approach. Gone are the days of relying on a single method for securing your personal data. With much depending on how many holes you plug in each layer.

Seems to me it just doesn't make sense to consciously allow security holes to exist, when another solution is available that does not and available at the same price? In this case, FREE.

SCR
While I agree that the reputable testing organizations provide a useful service not all testing organizations are reputable. I don't think the average user will take the time to sort the good from the bad. Most will ask the doctor on the street what they are using for their security measures.

Burl
If I was expecyed to know the deliberations of standards testers for all the things I use...I won't just ask doctors, but anybody. Opinions are data.


SCR
It amazes me that people are always looking for the free or cheapest means to protect the information contained in their devices. On the other hand they will pay hundreds of dollars for the device and put the most sensitive details of their lives on it and risk it all on the Internet using free security software that they know nothing about or none at all.

Burl
That downward fall towards free everywhere once free somewhere is hard to avoid. Possibly its that they are already paying for internet access and needed hardware to do so, so maybe they say "you internet providers need to fix this AV/AM problem from your coffers." But really, mostly just penny-pinching covers it well!


SCR
Occasionally I will visit the testing sites but find that the AV that's number one today may be number five in a matter of weeks or less. The security software I use, paid for, will tell you up front that there is no magic software that will protect you 100%. I have spent considerable time setting up my computer and understanding the needed security measures to protect my data. Most people will not take the time to do so. While I am far from a professional I don't consider myself an average user.

Burl
I have observed the same yearly trends. Not just in AV/AM rankings, but in most branches of tech and business (autos, insurance, cell phone...). There is one constancy I have noted in AV/AM that has survived several years now...the advice that I hear most often is just run MSE or Win Defender and follow-up w/ an occasional Malwarebytes full-scan. It has been good for me, I think.

SCR
I follow several security forums and have come to realize that most of the issues are self induced. They would not have occurred had the user paid more attention to what they are doing or if they had educated themselves a bit.

Burl
And as you mention as online virtue, being careful has saved me from lots of grief, I am positive.


SCR
@burlmart:
I use several of the items that you referred to and very strict AV/Firewall/HIPS rules and find that my Internet experience to be just fine. Occasionally I will find a website that my security measures don't like but that's the point of having it.

There are always other websites that I will not have issues with that contain the same information. This is not to say that our use of the Internet is similar or even remotely the same, it's just my experience.

Burl
My lite powered laptop bogged a bit w/ some of the AV/AM I have tried (RV.net posters recommendations) like Avast and Comodo. i went back to MSE. In Firefox, I now only run Adblock Plus for ads and trackers. It often has to be disabled as it cuts off stuff I might want to see. But it is pretty good at getting lousy ads blocked. NoScript was way too invasive, as was no flash.

1492 wrote:

burlmart wrote:
1492

You appear to be the goto guy for security in your workplace, where people get sloppy and tighter controls are warranted. But at home with their own PC, typical users will maybe take some precautions and not have to worry over malware/virus stuff very much - they want simplicity, and I think MS's new Defender for W8 and beyond is meant for us avg users.

In the vid below, a guy tests W8 Defender and gives a positive showing.

Demo of W8.1 Windows Defender built-in AV program

Certainly not bottom-line proof of anything. But notice the point he makes about trying to stop all possibilities of unwanted internet. At the browser level, I could turn on one or more extensions/add-ons to do ad block, flash block, script block, etc. What results is a degraded browsing experience (almost no websites will show properly). And similar effects are seen on overall computer performance/experience when running stricter AV apps.

I don't work in net security, and everything I comment about I currently use or have used on my personal systems. Are you saying you don't know how to install a program? That's all it takes to upgrade to a more secure AV package.

The question I have about your logic can be equated to someone with a medical condition that randomly goes to someone off the street for treatment. Ultimately more for a placebo effect than anything in reality, because that is what they want to hear? Instead of going to a medical doctor or specialist who is at minimum acknowledged as having expertise in the field.

The fact is, you can find anything on the internet that claims a point of view you want to believe?

In any case, every company is going to claim they have the best product, as it's in their best interest to do so. And the reason that independent testing by organizations acknowledged for having expertise in the field is so valuable to the end user. Which is the reason I link to those groups that even the AV manufacturers refer to for feedback on the effectiveness of their products. Otherwise, the end user's info is based largely on marketing claims or opinions, which in most cases, tends to have little to do with reality?

While I agree that the reputable testing organizations provide a useful service not all testing organizations are reputable. I don't think the average user will take the time to sort the good from the bad. Most will ask the doctor on the street what they are using for their security measures.

It amazes me that people are always looking for the free or cheapest means to protect the information contained in their devices. On the other hand they will pay hundreds of dollars for the device and put the most sensitive details of their lives on it and risk it all on the Internet using free security software that they know nothing about or none at all.

Occasionally I will visit the testing sites but find that the AV that's number one today may be number five in a matter of weeks or less. The security software I use, paid for, will tell you up front that there is no magic software that will protect you 100%. I have spent considerable time setting up my computer and understanding the needed security measures to protect my data. Most people will not take the time to do so. While I am far from a professional I don't consider myself an average user.

I follow several security forums and have come to realize that most of the issues are self induced. They would not have occurred had the user paid more attention to what they are doing or if they had educated themselves a bit.

@burlmart:
I use several of the items that you referred to and very strict AV/Firewall/HIPS rules and find that my Internet experience to be just fine. Occasionally I will find a website that my security measures don't like but that's the point of having it.

There are always other websites that I will not have issues with that contain the same information. This is not to say that our use of the Internet is similar or even remotely the same, it's just my experience.

burlmart wrote:
1492

You appear to be the goto guy for security in your workplace, where people get sloppy and tighter controls are warranted. But at home with their own PC, typical users will maybe take some precautions and not have to worry over malware/virus stuff very much - they want simplicity, and I think MS's new Defender for W8 and beyond is meant for us avg users.

In the vid below, a guy tests W8 Defender and gives a positive showing.

Demo of W8.1 Windows Defender built-in AV program

Certainly not bottom-line proof of anything. But notice the point he makes about trying to stop all possibilities of unwanted internet. At the browser level, I could turn on one or more extensions/add-ons to do ad block, flash block, script block, etc. What results is a degraded browsing experience (almost no websites will show properly). And similar effects are seen on overall computer performance/experience when running stricter AV apps.

I don't work in net security, and everything I comment about I currently use or have used on my personal systems. Are you saying you don't know how to install a program? That's all it takes to upgrade to a more secure AV package.

The question I have about your logic can be equated to someone with a medical condition that randomly goes to someone off the street for treatment. Ultimately more for a placebo effect than anything in reality, because that is what they want to hear? Instead of going to a medical doctor or specialist who is at minimum acknowledged as having expertise in the field.

The fact is, you can find anything on the internet that claims a point of view you want to believe?

In any case, every company is going to claim they have the best product, as it's in their best interest to do so. And the reason that independent testing by organizations acknowledged for having expertise in the field is so valuable to the end user. Which is the reason I link to those groups that even the AV manufacturers refer to for feedback on the effectiveness of their products. Otherwise, the end user's info is based largely on marketing claims or opinions, which in most cases, tends to have little to do with reality?

Thanks to everyone for all of the replies! The variety of comments have certainly given me "food for thought".