Forum Discussion
103 Replies
spoon059 wrote:
NYCgrrl wrote:
Mass transit IS essential to any community that is not simply thinking of the currently able bodied.
Children, certain physically challenged people, the poor, senior citizens, come to mind off the top of my head and least this way it isn't regulated solely to them.
A high speed transit between cities is not "mass transit" of a city. The state of New York doesn't extend a high speed subway to Albany so that "disabled people" or children can easily get to Manhattan. You are comparing 2 VASTLY different things here.
My above quote started as a response to downhome who said the following:California is not Europe. Most people cannot avail themselves of the single line they have now.
Many dive fifty even one hundred miles each day to and from work.
There is not enough room or available housing on top of where they work.
And unlike Europe they don't get six weeks or ore vacation which take a load off transit.
Talk of mass transit is essentially nosnes for most people. Some will get to use but everyone pays for it.
The essntial problem is they are trying to engineer a vehicle less society, and in socialist system where those that work, who will and are outnumbered by those that aren't working in California get the same level of income. Those engineering and managing this scheme live above it and crack the whip.
Moonbeam Brown's utopia or socialist paradise where everyone smokes dope, wears hair shirts, and lives in huts, and rides bikes and spend their hours at corner coffee houses being enlightened, by readings of Marks etc is the height of delusion and foolishness. They think they can mange our lives for our benefit better than we can. What they mean is they can run the train around the track and build the railroad to suit them and we are forced to pay and abide.
The convo then evolved into your comment here:spoon wrote:
The difference is that those roads are used to transport freight, police and fire fighters... services that the car-less citizens still use. Those are essential services that benefit everyone in society and are part of the core goals of the federal government.
High speed transit that costs an exorbitant amount of money and benefits very few people is not a core goal of government. I'm not opposed to high speed transit options to give options for domestic air travel, but these are excessive costs for a relatively small stretch of rail.
I'm not opposed to higher fuel taxes, you have to pay to play. The issue that I have is politicians (in either party) that jack the tax of particular item and then use those funds to support projects unrelated to those taxes. Use fuel taxes to fix the roads, bridges and public safety associated with roads.
I really only responded to the section of your post that dealt with the overall necessity of mass transit but I can add a comment about high speed transit as it relates to NE option; not up to date in other parts of the country:).
The Amtrak NE corridor's revenue and usage, surpasses and supports the ENTIRETY of the system. The portion of the ride going from Boston to DC pretty much requires advance reservation for NE Regional and Acela due to popularity which in part is due to it's speed. It could go even faster if new track was laid in parts of the run and gosh the way I hear most RV.net posters comment faster is generally better:B.
How this country got so far behind the rest of the world in developing and maintaining a long distance rail system is a bit perplexing and anti progressive to me yet we are certainly a good half a century behind from what I can see.lanerd wrote:
Ivylog wrote:
Diesel is $2.09 in Greenville SC and the roads are pretty darn good. Glad last summer was the last time I'll have to go to California, not that I'll be missed.
I'm sorry but your statement doesn't hold water. There is a HUGE difference between the physical size and population of California compared to S. Carolina. There's no way you can compare the two.:S
And you're correct...I'm sure that California will not miss having you visit.:(
As for the tax increase.....
If, and that's a big if.... the increase in gas tax is used ONLY for highway infrastructure...that will be great and I'm more than willing to pay the increase.:C
Ron
Brown and the California legislature are notorious for raiding funds to help pay for pet projects. Wouldn't surprise me if most of this revenue goes to the sanctuary cities that President Trump threatens to withhold Federal funds.2oldman wrote:
I don't care.
And THAT is the "crux" of the problem.. Entirely TOO MANY people who don't care just how much of their hard earned money is vacuumed out of their pockets!
Each time the cost of something goes up (like taxes) and the income stays the same you lose...
You lose BUYING POWER, your money buys LESS, you get less VALUE out of your time and time IS MONEY.
You cannot "redistribute" wealth via taxes from those who have jobs or income to those WITHOUT jobs or income without the entire house of cards eventually collapsing when the cost of living goes up faster than the income..
In short ALL BECOME "POOR" with the exception of those who WROTE THE LAWS OF THE TAXES!- I don't care.
RVMike wrote:
The money will not go to the roads, they have done this 3 other times and the roads are still ****. The Governor has the power to declare any program in financial need and can take the funds from any program. California is always broke but finds funds to help illegals.
^^^
what he said ...NYCgrrl wrote:
Mass transit IS essential to any community that is not simply thinking of the currently able bodied.
Children, certain physically challenged people, the poor, senior citizens, come to mind off the top of my head and least this way it isn't regulated solely to them.
A high speed transit between cities is not "mass transit" of a city. The state of New York doesn't extend a high speed subway to Albany so that "disabled people" or children can easily get to Manhattan. You are comparing 2 VASTLY different things here.D.E.Bishop wrote:
Nothing will ever top the high speed rail boondoggle between LA and San Francisco. It has already gone billions over budget and the three biggest hurdles haven't been addressed. Some rocket scientist decided the best place to start construction was at the middle, somewhere near Bakersfield. Unfortunately, after you complete that flat part of the tracks, they have to bore the largest tunnel ever conceived thru the Sierra Nevada mountains. Nobody is even sure if it can be done, much less how much it is going to cost and they are already out of money, so it really doesn't matter. Apparent solution? The money fairy will swoop in and save the day and the construction fairy then waive it's magic wand and viola, a hole will appear in the mountains.
Okay, I have hopefully a short reply, in the seventies we elected a governor that appointed Rose Bird to the CSC, she felt 7 years was okay for a sentence for 1st Degree Murder, he also appointed Adriana Giantturkey(pun) as Director of the DOT. MS Bird was dumped by the public and her Dictatorship left our jails with a major reduction in funding, The Giantturkey cancelled all highway improvements and repairs and donated all the money to the general fund. Additionally we passed Prop 13 that restricted the increases in property taxes and required some very strict laws on new taxes.
The result of these three things was that the State was stuck paying more for everyday living expenses for some and increasing as Liberals do, their social welfare programs by reducing money sent to schools, highways, etc, and sending it to the General Fund for more social welfare programs.
Thanks to Gov. Moonbeam all those things happened, now he is Gov. Brown and a down to earth realistic Gov. Another pun but not intended.
Supposedly he has grown up and now realizes how expensive infrastructure is and is willy nilly raising taxes, but by law 80 percent of the new tax must go to highway works and only 20 percent can go to his legacy. Another new law that takes effect I believe in 2018 prohibits spending any tax money for any purpose other than contained in the definition of the bill. It was part of his trade off and buying of the votes he needed for his Legacy Bill or Gas Tax increases. To which those of us on the right say, "Good Luck with that".
This is just what has and is happening here and I guess it is what we have to put up with to live here.
Then there is the minor problem of the fact they haven't bought the land needed at either end of the rail line. The LA land and the San Francisco land still needs to be obtained. Again, no one knows how much this will cost, how long it will take, or if it can even be accomplished. Apparent solution? A second visit from the money fairy and after dumping truckloads of money into the arms of the landowners a rail line will link LA and San Francisco.
And the best news? The current estimates are the trip will take longer and be more expensive than flying. But hey, it's a high speed train, and if you don't want a train, you apparently need a brain. Got to love it.bob213 wrote:
Unfortunately California already has one of the highest fuel tax in the nation. It seems that the fund has been diverted to the High Speed Rail that is so far over budget I can't find an accurate number. I have never seen our roads in the disrepair that they are in now, but everywhere you look the state is re-aligning the hiway to make room for the Bullet Train. From what we read in our newspapers the gov. has depleted every fund they can to get additional funding for the train. I'm sure they will siphon off this new tax as well.
Actually, PA took that shameful "honor" Jan 1, 2017..
Read Article Here
The text from above link..
"GASOLINE TAXES ON THE RISE
On Jan. 1, Pennsylvania’s wholesale tax on gasoline increased by 8 cents a gallon, to 58.3 cents a gallon, assuming wholesalers pass through the full cost.
The tax increase is the third under Act 89, a bipartisan 2013 law that boosted annual contracts for bridge and road work by about $1 billion a year, according to PennDOT.
Under Act 89, the gas tax increased by 9 cents in 2014 and 10 cents in 2015. There was no increase in 2016, so the cumulative increase — including the January hike — is 27 cents per gallon over four years.
Combined with federal gas tax of 18.4 cents, Pennsylvanians will be paying 76.7 cents per gallon in taxes — the highest in the nation."
The tax money doesn't go to the roads as it should be, instead it is redirected and goes to keep Philly "mass transportation" a float.. Something losing this much money just needs put out of it's misery.. the entire state suffers to keep artificially low fares in PAs largest inner city :M
Glad CA has taken back the hall of shame..
Hopefully the politicians in Harrisburg don't get ideas to top CA again..- Okay, I have hopefully a short reply, in the seventies we elected a governor that appointed Rose Bird to the CSC, she felt 7 years was okay for a sentence for 1st Degree Murder, he also appointed Adriana Giantturkey(pun) as Director of the DOT. MS Bird was dumped by the public and her Dictatorship left our jails with a major reduction in funding, The Giantturkey cancelled all highway improvements and repairs and donated all the money to the general fund. Additionally we passed Prop 13 that restricted the increases in property taxes and required some very strict laws on new taxes.
The result of these three things was that the State was stuck paying more for everyday living expenses for some and increasing as Liberals do, their social welfare programs by reducing money sent to schools, highways, etc, and sending it to the General Fund for more social welfare programs.
Thanks to Gov. Moonbeam all those things happened, now he is Gov. Brown and a down to earth realistic Gov. Another pun but not intended.
Supposedly he has grown up and now realizes how expensive infrastructure is and is willy nilly raising taxes, but by law 80 percent of the new tax must go to highway works and only 20 percent can go to his legacy. Another new law that takes effect I believe in 2018 prohibits spending any tax money for any purpose other than contained in the definition of the bill. It was part of his trade off and buying of the votes he needed for his Legacy Bill or Gas Tax increases. To which those of us on the right say, "Good Luck with that".
This is just what has and is happening here and I guess it is what we have to put up with to live here. WTP-GC wrote:
You left out things like: "we have the ditch dug, but we cannot work on it until the OSHA inspector approves. Lean on your shovels and rack up some overtime"
Some of the money of the fuel taxes will go to actual road repair efforts...SOME.
Like all other sates, cities, counties, etc. that pass similar ordinances, the moey collected goes in many different directions.
So you have this pot of money for road projects. Now where to spend it...??
(We're going to assume for this example that all work is done by government road crews)
First you have to evaluate what roads need to be fixed, so you hire a consultant (cha-ching).
Then you have to pay the salary of those government workers who manage the consultants.
You have to pay for studies, public notices, permits, etc.
Great, now we know what road(s) we're going to work on, so dispatch the road crews.
But wait, you have to pay the salaries, benefits, and expenses of such crews.
And they can't have an old work truck, only new trucks will suffice.
New tools and logos for the trucks too.
And they have to have new equipment, with state of the art maintanance facilities.
You can't "learn" how to operate such equipment. Instead you have to be "trained" (cha-ching).
Now let's get to work. Send all 12 of the road crew guys out there to do a 6 man job.
They'll start at the shop at 8 AM, make plans, hit the road by 9. Arrive onsite around 9:30, setup some signs, make more plans, take a break for lunch, get started for the first time, then leave at 3 so they can get back to the shop by 4.
Dang, Juan broke his pinky finger. Suck it up, right? Nope, 6 weeks of PTO. (I'll break mine too)
Hold on, now there's a group of environmental protestors. Stop the show.
On and on it goes until almost none of the money goes directly to any actual road repair efforts. And of course, they're not going to fix "your" road. That road, well, it's waaaaayyyyy down the list...if we have any money left over.
"The excavator's air filter clogged, we have another one and Bob can easily change it, but union rules require we call out the mechanic and he can't make it till tomorrow. it's already 9AM nearly 1 hour into the workday, so go home everyone will get their full 8 hours of pay"
"The road work has advanced 200 feet and now construction work is more than the legally allowed distance from the porta-potty, can't work until the septic company comes and relocates it. Take the rest of the week off, with pay"
"Found an old chicken bone while we were digging up the old road. This could be a sacred archaeological site. We need to stop all work and consider rerouting the entire road while the historians and archaeologists take few years researching. Don't worry about your pay, we will get an emergency appropriation and then make additional millions preserving the bone forever"
"Cease and desist all work forever. It rained last night and a mud puddle is now in the way. This makes the entire area a wetland and it is now protected from all development. Jackpot, the reroute of the road adds 20 miles and 500 million to the costs. Who needs the lottery, we have government".
