Friction anti-sway device use in rain or wet roads

cdevidal wrote:
From earlier in the thread. BurbMan seems to be implying that cam action has some sort of inherent property that works even in slippery conditions.

BurbMan wrote:
Say you're driving on a slippery road and want to turn right. As you turn the truck, the tires need sufficient grip to overcome the resistance of the sway bar to begin to angle the trailer around the corner. It's possible for the tires to lose grip if too much resistance is presented by the sway bar. When that happens, the truck will be pushed into an understeer condition and begin to slide straight ahead. Kind of like being on ice, except you now have the weight of the trailer pushing the truck, so regaining control is difficult if not impossible. Obviously if this happens at highway speeds you'll be in the ditch before you can say "Holy Shift!".

(..)

One of the reasons I migrated to the Hensley in 2002...I was never sure if the sway bar was tightened the right amount. I recall a few times making it extra snug because it was a windy day, only to have it start raining with no where to pull over and loosen it. Your only choice is to slow down and hope you don't get surprised by understeer at the wrong time. I worry a lot less about the weather with the Hensley.

You are confusing Burbmans statement about his Hensley hitch vs a "cam action" hitch. I don't see anywhere in his post that he even mentions one. He was talking about a standard friction sway control. The Hensley is not one of those style hitches. It does not depend on any friction at all to do its job.
Barney

jerem0621 wrote:
My concern is for people to start with the right TV, balanced Trailer, properly adjusted hitch, then add friction sway control after that other stuff is dialed in.

Friction sway control augment a good set up. They do not cover up a bad set up. I hope that makes sense.

Sage advice.

I never really fiddled much with my sway bars. I just bottomed out the on off bar and rolled with it. I did give the tension bolts a 1/4 turn like the instructions say. I did take the slider bars out to clean them like the instructions say too. I will not take them off in the rain again but would in snow and or on a gravel or off road situation.

I don't think I communicated well last night. Sway control does give you an additional level of safety and control. They resist or dampen sudden movements, wind, passing vehicles and what not.

My concern is for people to start with the right TV, balanced Trailer, properly adjusted hitch, then add friction sway control after that other stuff is dialed in.

Friction sway control augment a good set up. They do not cover up a bad set up. I hope that makes sense.

Thanks,

Jeremiah

And then I found this, which confirms what Bedlam stated, "Cam style devices have the same issue as friction." And it answers my question.

However, if during a panic stop, the trailer 'pushes' the tow vehicle too hard, it actually IS possible, for a jackknife to occur with a Hensley. During a panic stop, if the brake controller is not set aggressive enough, and the trailer 'pushes' the tow vehicle hard enough, the Hensley will let the trailer shift off to one side, resulting in a push slightly off to one side. This 'push' affect of the Hensley has been discussed, and is well known among Hensley owners. It just means that with a Hensley (like any other combination/hitch), you must have your brake controller adjusted right, to prevent too much trailer 'push' from occuring during a panic stop.

I will tell you, I once did not have our brake controller set right, and felt this 'push'. I was braking REALLY hard when it happened, and the push was not anything to worry about. Only way I can see it would cause a problem, is if it was a case of a VERY light/small tow vehicle towing a huge trailer, that it should not be towing in the first place, Hensley or not (like some of the combinations CanAm RV puts together..LOL).

Kind of goes back to what you said, Claude - even though the Hensley is such a perfect design, it should not be used as a 'cure-all' for a bad setup. You still need to set everything else up correctly, especially your brake controller. And, you still need to match the tow vehicle to the trailer appropriately.

Source: http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/15531727/gotomsg/15537732.cfm#15537732


So I'll go with friction pads and see how it runs, then if I don't like it I can sell those and upgrade. For rain/slippery conditions will follow manufacturer recommendations for disabling/loosening it, go 55mph, take it real easy, make sure my tires are right, distribute the load, etc. etc. In other words, I'll not depend upon sway control to be a 'cure-all' for a bad setup :-)

Thanks everyone! Good forum.

From earlier in the thread. BurbMan seems to be implying that cam action has some sort of inherent property that works even in slippery conditions.

BurbMan wrote:
Say you're driving on a slippery road and want to turn right. As you turn the truck, the tires need sufficient grip to overcome the resistance of the sway bar to begin to angle the trailer around the corner. It's possible for the tires to lose grip if too much resistance is presented by the sway bar. When that happens, the truck will be pushed into an understeer condition and begin to slide straight ahead. Kind of like being on ice, except you now have the weight of the trailer pushing the truck, so regaining control is difficult if not impossible. Obviously if this happens at highway speeds you'll be in the ditch before you can say "Holy Shift!".

(..)

One of the reasons I migrated to the Hensley in 2002...I was never sure if the sway bar was tightened the right amount. I recall a few times making it extra snug because it was a windy day, only to have it start raining with no where to pull over and loosen it. Your only choice is to slow down and hope you don't get surprised by understeer at the wrong time. I worry a lot less about the weather with the Hensley.

I would not and do not disable anti-sway devices in rain. I live in an area that sees 300 days of precipitation yearly and yet camp twice a month year round. Use your device (if already installed) unless you are in a low traction area or you are making maneuvers to position your trailer that exceed the range of your device's motion.

I don't believe I'm over-thinking it, but probably I'm not being clear. Is or is not cam action safe in the rain? Looks like you're saying it's not safe (for the same reasons friction is not safe) but cannot be disabled.

You are way over thinking this. Your quotes are correct - sway control adds a safety factor and provides a level of control. No one is disagreeing with that. Use sway control when appropriate (which is the vast majority of the time), get used to towing your trailer, and you will be fine.

Then you will come back here in the future and give your own opinions on sway control to new owners...

I don't understand. Are you saying using sway control is going overboard? Even you said you use it.

Did I accurately asses the list of safety buffers above?

And my other question: Is this consensus or is there lots of controversy?


"Cam style devices have the same issue as friction."

So if I understand you, for best safety in rain cam action should be disabled, but because they can't be disabled, it is not recommended?

You can get overboard with devices that make something safer. Can you argue that a fire suppression system, fire retardant clothing, full face helmet and 5-point harness would make your vehicle safer for the driver and each occupant? Why are you not installing and wearing these items every time you drive?

I'm just sayin' some people wear a belt and suspenders to keep their pants up while some droop them past their cheeks...

BTW: Cam style devices have the same issue as friction. However, to disable a cam device requires disabling your weight distribution. This may cause more of a safety issue leaving anti-sway engaged.