Gas Choice

Might as well be a thread about tires.

I don't use stabilizers or fuel system cleaners. I put non-ethanol gas in my small engines. Don't have any of the problems that all the ethanol or "ethanol mixed with stabilizer" people have.

Local station goes between $0.50 to $0.60 higher per gallon for 90 octane non-ethanol vs. regular 87 octane. For typical small engines around the hosue, I probably don't use more than about 30 gallons a year. That's roughly $15 difference per year by not only using non-ethanol but also higher octane. If this is even worth debating at that rate, then I'm going to bow out.

Always use non-ethanol in my boat motor. Another point not worth arguing.

SeaFoam, Stabil, DieselKleen, or whatever other fuel junk that you pour into your tank or gas can is snake oil. They'll have an entire shelf of it at the auto parts store...how do you pick which one is best? The prettiest bottle with the fanciest words? Use the advice of the minimum wage store clerk..."well we sell more seafoam than anything else..."?? LOL

Simple rules:
Don't buy more gas than you need.
Don't buy more gas than you plan to use in the near future.
Don't buy "peace of mind" fuel additives.
Don't buy gas to keep in storage.
Don't pour 5 gallons of gas in your generator unless you plan on using most of it.

Gas doesn't store well...never has.

Sam Spade wrote:

westend wrote:
Seafoam seems to have more and higher aromatic solvents than Stabil.

Seafoam is a decent stabilizer; that's what it was designed for. It is a barely adequate fuel system cleaner though.

I guess I should cut and paste the Material Safety Data sheets for future reference.......since SeaFoam's marketing hype seems to have worked pretty good.

SeaFoam contains 3 basic ingredients: Naptha (white gas), isopropyl alcohol and "petroleum distillates" (mineral spirits ?). I don't think any of those qualifies as "aromatic solvents".

Berrymans B12 Chemtool and original Gumout each contain about 6 real solvents, some of which are really nasty in pure form. I think Benzine is included. Anyone who really cares about getting a good fuel system CLEANER (for carbs mostly) can look up the details.

The CAN that SeaFoam comes in probably costs them more than what is inside.......yet the price is about twice what B12 is. Pure marketing hype; aka shake oil.

Agreed on the Berrymans being > than Seafoam. My statement was more of a quantitative comparison between Seafoam and Stabil. The Naptha and Petroleum distillates are aromatic but we're splitting hairs.

I'm guessing you feel about Seafoam the same way I feel about WD40. They are both products that folks perceive to "do it all". I don't buy either of them on a regular basis.

FWIW, I have some carburetor cleaner in a one gallon can with a basket and handle. When I first opened the can, the stuff reeked so bad I couldn't leave it in the shop. Over the years it's toned down some but you definitely don't want to spill any on yourself. It's labeled Berryman Chem Dip. Really a great carb cleaner.

westend wrote:
Seafoam seems to have more and higher aromatic solvents than Stabil.

Seafoam is a decent stabilizer; that's what it was designed for. It is a barely adequate fuel system cleaner though.

I guess I should cut and paste the Material Safety Data sheets for future reference.......since SeaFoam's marketing hype seems to have worked pretty good.

SeaFoam contains 3 basic ingredients: Naptha (white gas), isopropyl alcohol and "petroleum distillates" (mineral spirits ?). I don't think any of those qualifies as "aromatic solvents".

Berrymans B12 Chemtool and original Gumout each contain about 6 real solvents, some of which are really nasty in pure form. I think Benzine is included. Anyone who really cares about getting a good fuel system CLEANER (for carbs mostly) can look up the details.

The CAN that SeaFoam comes in probably costs them more than what is inside.......yet the price is about twice what B12 is. Pure marketing hype; aka shake oil.

Bumpyroad wrote:
some place I had a link to places that sold "pure" unadulterated gas, can't find it now.
bumpy

pure-gas.org

some place I had a link to places that sold "pure" unadulterated gas, can't find it now.
bumpy

Sam Spade wrote:

WTP-GC wrote:
But of course, you can eliminate the need for stabilizers if you just use non-ethanol gas.

Like most blanket statements, not universally true. Stabilizers existed prior to ethanol blended gas.

It depends on the storage period, the age of the gas when it went IN and the design of the engine (carb).

The cost of stabilizer is negligible.....IF you only use it during storage periods. I agree that Seafoam is mostly snake oil.

Agreed, storage is dependent on a few things. As I posted earlier, there appears to be regional differences in gas blends and that does make sense.

FWIW, at one time I was the guy on the barge owned by Koch fuels pumping ADM's shipment of ethanol into Koch's fuel distribution facility. Also delivered everything from pure gas oil and, years ago, MTBE. I could have blended my own gasoline, lol.

The stabilizers help to keep stored gas, whether in a can or in an equipment tank from oxidizing and breaking down. Every rubber fuel line from 1990 (or so) and to present is made to withstand 10% ethanol added gas. Personally, I use Stabil but Seafoam is on the shelf for those situations that I want to dissolve any perceived elements in a fuel system. Seafoam seems to have more and higher aromatic solvents than Stabil.

For Honda owners, Seafoam seems the best stabilizer or fuel additive to use. I'm understanding that by what I read and the few times I've had Honda engines in hand. I don't own any Honda gear so take it for what it's worth. I've also read that draining all fuel from the fuel system in Honda generators is a prefered process and there is little to argue about that situation for storage.

Lots of ways to skin the storage cat but I don't have a problem with E10 in my area. I would actually have to travel a few miles to get non-oxygenated gas.

SoundGuy wrote:

Sam Spade wrote:
I agree that Seafoam is mostly snake oil.

That "snake oil" got the rough running engines in two different EU2000i gensets I owned running smoothly again. :B

Cleaned out the carb in my 2000 ETQ generator as well.

Sam Spade wrote:
I agree that Seafoam is mostly snake oil.

That "snake oil" got the rough running engines in two different EU2000i gensets I owned running smoothly again. :B

WTP-GC wrote:
But of course, you can eliminate the need for stabilizers if you just use non-ethanol gas.

Like most blanket statements, not universally true. Stabilizers existed prior to ethanol blended gas.

It depends on the storage period, the age of the gas when it went IN and the design of the engine (carb).

The cost of stabilizer is negligible.....IF you only use it during storage periods. I agree that Seafoam is mostly snake oil.

Non-ethanol 90 octane is very plentiful in our area.

Fuel hoses and other rubbers and plastics on older engines (small engines) weren't designed for use with alcohol, so when phase separation occurs and the fuel "sits" in those materials, it causes deterioration. From a general use standpoint, if you use it fast enough, there are no detrimental effects of ethanol-mixed fuel.

That being said, all non-motor vehicle engines we own gets non-ethanol fuel. Stabilizers don't work, and Seafoam as a stabilizer is about as useless. Lots of stabilizers have alcohol in them, which is a head-scratcher when you consider that you're trying to mitigate the effect of alcohol. But of course, you can eliminate the need for stabilizers if you just use non-ethanol gas.

Some would say that they don't want to spend the extra money on non-ethanol fuel, but will just get the 10% ethanol stuff and use stabilizer. Well, stabilizers ain't free. In all cases, the cost of using 10% ethanol plus stabilizer is more than just buying non-ethanol fuel.

I used to run non-ethanol in my Z71. It consistently got 10% better fuel mileage. The fuel was about 15% more costly at the time.