traveling with firearms

CKNSLS wrote:

ripperoo wrote:

CKNSLS wrote:

Tom/Barb wrote:

bigdogger wrote:
Like I have said before, if you are so afraid or RVing and so incapable of making good campground choices that you need a deadly weapon at the ready 24/7/365 maybe you should consider another hobby.

We camp remote a lot, LEOs are hours away, If you can contact one, There are many Illegal Immigrants poaching game in the state forests and tree farms. They do not value your life very much.

I like the camping and do not believe I'll stop because of them.

There are many places to camp where illegals are not and the chances of needing a handgun are slight to non existent.

I think I will stand by my earlier point-in all but a few states harming someone (or worse) and the legal and financial consequences far out weigh carrying a handgun.

Camp in better places-and pay more for that campsite-it will be far cheaper in the long run.

I think it's real easy to say-"I'm going to carry my handgun because it's my right no matter how the laws are written." Yep, shoot or kill someone and you will be asking yourself if it was worth it.

CKNSLS, I would love to live in your delusional world where criminals announce where they are going to be, so you know where not to be. Oh, and your advice of pay more for a better campsite. Brilliant. Because it's a fact that criminals only hit the houses of the poor, not the wealthy.

I don't carry my handgun because it's my right. I carry because I have the right to. Big difference. The world is not as rosy as you seem to think. And guess what, no one has ever been robbed, assaulted or killed.... until that first time. Your logic of "I've never needed a gun before" is flat out illogical.

Yep, I am either delusional, smart, or just plain lucky. You already picked one so I won't ask you to.

I been on this Earth over a half-century. Never robbed, mugged, beaten, or even felt unsafe.

I am not delusional what the effect will be on you should you fire and shoot someone with your weapon. Obviously, the retired LEOs know the score.

Based on my experience, you carry a weapon is an illogical choice.

Well good for you. I will add one, lucky. You see, I've been on this earth for almost a half century. I've been the victim of a stabbing in my own home by someone I did not know. This was many years before I even had a gun. Had I had a gun at that time, and the circumstances being what they were, I do know what the affect would have been, I most likely wouldn't have been stabbed.

I just don't get where you actually believe that because "it never happened to me, it won't" fits into any realm of logic. NO VICTIM WAS EVER A VICTIM UNTIL THE FIRST TIME THEY WERE A VICTIM. Can you dispute that statement, that logic?

I will choose my life or the life of an innocent any day over whatever inconveniences may arise from possibly having to use a weapon in defense. Legal fees may break me, but I'll still be alive.

A gun does not guarantee survival or even a positive outcome. But it sure puts the odds in my favor.

Oh, and I find it very disrespectful of you to speak on behalf of all retired LEOs. I know for every one you quote, I can find one that will disagree. As a matter of fact, most LEOs I've talked to, retired or not, will agree that the public needs to be able to take care of themselves. LEOs are not always able to respond in the time it takes for you to die. Seconds count. If you are not able to or willing to take care of yourself, that's your perogotive. Don't put those constraints on those of us who recognize reality.

A criminal will use whatever tool he has to accomplish his task. An illprepared victim is his greatest asset. I truly pray you can come on here and boast your "never happened to me, so it clearly never will happen" mantra for a long time without ever having to deal with crime. Peace

ripperoo wrote:

CKNSLS wrote:

Tom/Barb wrote:

bigdogger wrote:
Like I have said before, if you are so afraid or RVing and so incapable of making good campground choices that you need a deadly weapon at the ready 24/7/365 maybe you should consider another hobby.

We camp remote a lot, LEOs are hours away, If you can contact one, There are many Illegal Immigrants poaching game in the state forests and tree farms. They do not value your life very much.

I like the camping and do not believe I'll stop because of them.

There are many places to camp where illegals are not and the chances of needing a handgun are slight to non existent.

I think I will stand by my earlier point-in all but a few states harming someone (or worse) and the legal and financial consequences far out weigh carrying a handgun.

Camp in better places-and pay more for that campsite-it will be far cheaper in the long run.

I think it's real easy to say-"I'm going to carry my handgun because it's my right no matter how the laws are written." Yep, shoot or kill someone and you will be asking yourself if it was worth it.

CKNSLS, I would love to live in your delusional world where criminals announce where they are going to be, so you know where not to be. Oh, and your advice of pay more for a better campsite. Brilliant. Because it's a fact that criminals only hit the houses of the poor, not the wealthy.

I don't carry my handgun because it's my right. I carry because I have the right to. Big difference. The world is not as rosy as you seem to think. And guess what, no one has ever been robbed, assaulted or killed.... until that first time. Your logic of "I've never needed a gun before" is flat out illogical.

Yep, I am either delusional, smart, or just plain lucky. You already picked one so I won't ask you to.

I been on this Earth over a half-century. Never robbed, mugged, beaten, or even felt unsafe.

I am not delusional what the effect will be on you should you fire and shoot someone with your weapon. Obviously, the retired LEOs know the score.

Based on my experience, you carry a weapon is an illogical choice.

MrWizard wrote:

bigred1cav wrote:

mlts22 wrote:

MrWizard wrote:
Everyday somewhere in this great nation
Somebody uses a firearm to defend their lives or families life
But it doesn't get reported in the media news like drive by shootings and mass murder
Especially in Cities like Loss Angelos or New York city

+1. You hit the nail on the head there.

Every day in this great nation some dimwit with a gun kills a relative.

that DIMWIT will use a knife or hammer or piece of pipe
IF he intends to kill someone he will find a way

Don't blame the firearm blame the 'person' ,
blame the society, blame upbringing and mental health yada yada

We are a society of blame today, it’s his fault, it’s his upbringing, it’s this and it’s that…


While you are correct it’s not the gun it is the person using it…

But the problem is there are too many guns, that are too easily available, owned by to many that shouldn’t have one, shouldn’t own one, and should never be allowed carry one, and way too many of these people are permitted to carry…

We the people are also responsible for keeping guns out of the hands of those that shouldn’t have them, and we are failing in our responsibility in a big way… mostly by defending the unfettered right to own and bear Arms at any cost…

It is the responsibility of law abiding people to set and enforce rules to keep the peace and security of the state and the country… it is us, we are responsible and it is us that is blinded by greed and profit of the powerful lobbied by the greed and profit of the even more powerful…

There is no good end insight as we fight for the right of excesses instead of the right of reason…


.

rkortes wrote:

MrWizard wrote:


that DIMWIT will use a knife or hammer or piece of pipe
IF he intends to kill someone he will find a way

Don't blame the firearm blame the 'person' ,
blame the society, blame upbringing and mental health yada yada

Statistics and facts on Suicide, homicide, and gun accidents show that this just isn't true. I can show research to support this (and will if you want). Can you support your claim? Maybe you were just being sarcastic.

Here's one of mine.

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronline.pdf

Let's see yours...

Double Post

MrWizard wrote:


that DIMWIT will use a knife or hammer or piece of pipe
IF he intends to kill someone he will find a way

Don't blame the firearm blame the 'person' ,
blame the society, blame upbringing and mental health yada yada

Statistics and facts on Suicide, homicide, and gun accidents show that this just isn't true. I can show research to support this (and will if you want). Can you support your claim? Maybe you were just being sarcastic.

bigred1cav wrote:
CCW laws permit the concealment they do not mandate concealment. I applaud your service, but how is that relevant to CCW? In Vietnam we all carried all the time and that was mandated by our jobs. To carry now is to choose to be armed for some threat perceived, and sold to us to make us afraid and distrust our neighbors. In the backwoods why do you need or want a concealed firearm. I have hunted people and big game and never hide my weapon to keep the animal from knowing I was armed.

I did say what i meant. To carry a gun as part of employment is fulfilling the duties of the job, it is not a choice. As a Police Officer we were subject to a three day suspension to be unarmed in public. The reason was to protect the citizens when at a site of despair. Not to protect us unless one of ingrateful arrestees got out of prison and decided to hunt us down. Do you need to carry a gun to protect you and your family from felons you arrested and put in prison?

down home wrote:

mowermech wrote:
"...he doesn't need to carry a gun,..."
NEED has nothing to do with the fact that he branded ALL those who carry guns as "cowards".
If that is not what he meant, then quite possibly he should have said EXACTLY what he meant.
Sorry, but I still see the implication that back when he carried a gun, he was, in fact, by his own definition, a gun-carrying coward.
In Vietnam, I carried ALL THE TIME! Was I a coward?
When we go into the back country on a camping trip or fishing trip, I may be armed. I am not worried about people, but there are bears, mountain lions, badgers/racoons/skunks, etc., some of which may be rabid. Yes, "bear spray" might work, but a firearm WILL work! Shucks, even ol' Mama Moose can be very dangerous sometimes! As can Bambi!
"Be Prepared" isn't just for Boy Scouts!

When I do have a firearm on me, I feel no need to display it. It is not anyone else's right to say I can't. I keep in in the pocket because these nannies have succeeded in a lot, of people being afraid, of a tool and anyone with one as a threat. The Cop doesn't want to carry one that's fine. Denying the right we enshrined and protected from government and people like this is wrong. It is wrong to creat a privileged class, that can exercise their Right and deny others. Politicians and ex Leo's or even Leos have the "right" but no one else is wrong. It has ceased to be our Right and the Constitution is dead when the Privledged classes are the only ones allowed firearms, or freedom ,of speech and so on.I refuse to observe privledged classes. It is our rights. The course has to be cahnged back to intent and letter, of the Constitution.

"I did say what i meant."

Thank you for clarifying that.
By the way, when I carry in the back country, it is open carry, not concealed. I do not have a CCP, even though Montana is a "Will Issue" state, and my military background gives me the training necessary to get one.
Montana is also an "Open Carry" state (Article 2, Section 12, Montana State Constitution), so I don't need a CCP, and I see no reason to spend the money for one.

bigred1cav wrote:

mlts22 wrote:

MrWizard wrote:
Everyday somewhere in this great nation
Somebody uses a firearm to defend their lives or families life
But it doesn't get reported in the media news like drive by shootings and mass murder
Especially in Cities like Loss Angelos or New York city

+1. You hit the nail on the head there.

Every day in this great nation some dimwit with a gun kills a relative.

that DIMWIT will use a knife or hammer or piece of pipe
IF he intends to kill someone he will find a way

Don't blame the firearm blame the 'person' ,
blame the society, blame upbringing and mental health yada yada

CKNSLS wrote:

bigred1cav wrote:

brooks379 wrote:
There are a lot of car accidents where people die...should we not drive anymore and ban cars ? There are a lot of over weight people in America ....should we ban forks ? I carry concealed and travel with my family and hope I never have to use my weapon but should I ever need to defend my wife and kids I will have the means to do it.

If you proudly carry a firearm why do you conceal it as though you are ashamed?

Where do you travel you need a handgun hidden on your body to protect you from what? You do know an armed assailant will make you dead before you can uncover your hidden gun?

Cars when operated as designed are not designed to kill. Guns are. Overweight people do not enter schools and murder children with the fat on their belly or legs. Cite how many people have been murdered by a fork in past 300 years? It won't reach the number murdered by guns in 2013.

BTW I own and use and am very proficient with firearms. I am just not coward enough to carry one. I have that right as a retired Police Officer.

Good post. As a retired LEO you know all the consequences involved firing your weapon. However, based on the content and tone of posts by others on this forum-many do not have your experiences.

Thank you for your past service keeping the bad guys at bay.

No, ignorant post. One does not conceal a gun out of cowardice. I don't want anyone knowing I'm carrying either on my person or in my vehicle. Why give your hand away? You let a criminal know you're carrying, and you've just given away your advantage. Seems more like strategy than cowardice. A proactive move not a reactive one. Sure, they might steer clear of you if they know, but then again, they might just be better prepared to carry out their attack. That just doesn't make sense. And no, I don't know that "an armed assailant will make me dead before I draw." Do you? Really, do you now see into the future?

I as many choose not to be a victim if at all possible.

CKNSLS wrote:

Tom/Barb wrote:

bigdogger wrote:
Like I have said before, if you are so afraid or RVing and so incapable of making good campground choices that you need a deadly weapon at the ready 24/7/365 maybe you should consider another hobby.

We camp remote a lot, LEOs are hours away, If you can contact one, There are many Illegal Immigrants poaching game in the state forests and tree farms. They do not value your life very much.

I like the camping and do not believe I'll stop because of them.

There are many places to camp where illegals are not and the chances of needing a handgun are slight to non existent.

I think I will stand by my earlier point-in all but a few states harming someone (or worse) and the legal and financial consequences far out weigh carrying a handgun.

Camp in better places-and pay more for that campsite-it will be far cheaper in the long run.

I think it's real easy to say-"I'm going to carry my handgun because it's my right no matter how the laws are written." Yep, shoot or kill someone and you will be asking yourself if it was worth it.

CKNSLS, I would love to live in your delusional world where criminals announce where they are going to be, so you know where not to be. Oh, and your advice of pay more for a better campsite. Brilliant. Because it's a fact that criminals only hit the houses of the poor, not the wealthy.

I don't carry my handgun because it's my right. I carry because I have the right to. Big difference. The world is not as rosy as you seem to think. And guess what, no one has ever been robbed, assaulted or killed.... until that first time. Your logic of "I've never needed a gun before" is flat out illogical.