CFL bulbs

A little help. A "Y" transformer has FOUR connections. One on each of the three tips of the Y and the fourth connection is the spot where all the legs of the Y join together.

To prevent big problems with voltage the electric company pins that center of the Y connection to EARTH GROUND. But that transformer connection is not called ground. It is called NEUTRAL. The issue of how and where in the service drop neutral connects to the earth is important
All kinds of rules, regulations, and codes demand neutral and earth be bonded.

Small generators have no Y connection and therefore do not have a neutral. There is no need forca neutral.

road-runner wrote:
Anyone who doesn't know the answers to the above questions, as a previous post "politely" stated:

"You are out of your league here".

Hints: They are not tied together (which would be a NEC violation), and GFIs do not need a ground to work.

Sure be an ass; that really contributes positively to the discussion.

I readily admit little to no experience or knowledge with generator systems that are not a part of the power grid and am asking for information.

IF.....the white and ground wires are not connected together at a central distribution box, then where IS the "ground" wire connected ....and to what ??

And yes I know that a GFI really detects a current flow in the third "ground" wire.....where there should be none but for that to happen it has to be connected to something somewhere. Maybe it would more properly called a "neutral fault" detector. But then, how would it detect a fault in the "neutral" if there IS NO neutral in a balanced AC feed ??

I may not know everything about generator systems but I have a REALLY good grasp of the basics and my BS detector is still going off.

Well where's the remote?

Time to change the channel. Never did like reality shows...

Vulcan Rider wrote:
where are the white and ground wires connect in the distribution box in a trailer ???

Are they NOT tied together ? If not, then is the "ground" wire just floating ?? If that is the case, how would a GFI work when the generator was the power source ?

The title of this thread should be something like "Electrical myths from the twilight zone". Anyone who doesn't know the answers to the above questions, as a previous post "politely" stated:

"You are out of your league here".

Hints: They are not tied together (which would be a NEC violation), and GFIs do not need a ground to work.

NinerBikes wrote:
A CFL has an anode, and a cathode and usually a starter choke ballast.

How they work

Porcelain lamp fixture for a lightbulb, be it CFL or argon gas and tungsten white hot heated element.

There is no green wire "ground" for the fixture, hence no ground for the light bulb.



End of debate. Also agreed, a Honda generator, or any other generator has no "Ground" or "earth" Connection, unless you want to pound a Ufer ground rod into the ground and tie it in to the ground wire, although it is perfectly unnecessary.

It is necessary when you are tied into the electrical grid, as the source of electricity, usually a huge generator, is then tied into ground also to provide a short circuit path.

That link has very outdated information concerning not only CFLs but most all MODERN DAY fluorescents.

Early CFLs did indeed use a iron core "ballast", I had a few of those..

Modern day CFLs actually use an ELECTRONIC "Ballast" which is a fancy term for switching power supply!

Simply put, modern day CFLS have a built in switching powersupply which is very simular to say your PC power supply but instead of 3, 5, 12V DC they have several HUNDRED VOLTS..

Modern day CFLs actually can be run on DC provided you have 50-70V DC!

Modern day fluorescent fixtures no longer use the old iron ballasts either, instead once again they now use switching power power supplies which deliver several hundred volts..

If you don't believe me, go to home depot and take a good look at replacement ballasts.. You will find only electronic versions due to efficiency regulations..

Vulcan Rider wrote:

And then a question: (I honestly don't know)
Given that a generator actually would produce a "balanced" AC voltage, which could potentially give you a bit of a shock from either side.......where are the white and ground wires connect in the distribution box in a trailer ???

For clarification- balanced ac power is 60 volts ac on both the hot and neutral, 180 degrees out of phase. I'm like you- I don't know if any gensets produce balanced power. The only place I have run in to it is in pro audio- high end studios.

ChopperBill wrote:
Have three of them in front of the outside of my house on a hard wired timer. Been there for a couple of years. Today I noticed that when they were off two of them were flickering a little. One more than the other. They never get real bright and flicker pretty fast. Hard to believe if it was a timer problem as one doesn't do it at all. Any ideas?

This discussion is about a HOUSE.
No mention of a generator.

Like I said, reading comprehension problem.

And just for clarification:
A CFL is a glass tube filled with gas and a fluorescent coating on the inside.
An LED is a solid state diode.

And then a question: (I honestly don't know)
Given that a generator actually would produce a "balanced" AC voltage, which could potentially give you a bit of a shock from either side.......where are the white and ground wires connect in the distribution box in a trailer ???

Are they NOT tied together ? If not, then is the "ground" wire just floating ?? If that is the case, how would a GFI work when the generator was the power source ?

If they ARE tied together, then appliances and lamps with the shell connected to the ground wire would be connected to one side of the balanced, floating AC supply.

A CFL has an anode, and a cathode and usually a starter choke ballast.

How they work

Porcelain lamp fixture for a lightbulb, be it CFL or argon gas and tungsten white hot heated element.

There is no green wire "ground" for the fixture, hence no ground for the light bulb.



End of debate. Also agreed, a Honda generator, or any other generator has no "Ground" or "earth" Connection, unless you want to pound a Ufer ground rod into the ground and tie it in to the ground wire, although it is perfectly unnecessary.

It is necessary when you are tied into the electrical grid, as the source of electricity, usually a huge generator, is then tied into ground also to provide a short circuit path.

SVCJeff, with the slinging of credentials in play, you can use some support: Any 2-wire device connected to AC doesn't care which supply wire is hooked to which input of the device, which one is grounded, or connected to anything else for that matter. There could be an exception if the voltage was in the multi-digit thousands, which is not the case here.

Lets try this another way and maybe this will get whatever thought thats distorting your logic out of your head.

The OP's flickering CFL is in a socket with standard 2 wire lamp cord, plugged into a Honda generator. That generator is completely isolated from "ground", and in fact the ground pin is completely floating from "neutral" on the plug. The output of that generator is a 100% balanced AC output, TOTALLY isolated from any ground reference whatsoever. It has no "hot", it has no "return". Its balanced, but yet the OP's CFL is still flickering. Where is this ground he is supposed to check?