Converter Size and Generator Size, Etc

That 5400 series of Parallax converters starts out looking great: PF correction and optional temperature compensation of the output voltage. Then reading further you eventually get to the part that says THE FAN RUNS CONTINUOUSLY! No thanks, Parallax, the fan running overnight is worse than a lousy PF.

The newer line of Parallax converters have PF correction, and many of the inverter/charger chargers have it. As was mentioned, Xantrex Truecharge chargers have it, which some people use as a converter.

road-runner wrote:

MEXICOWANDERER wrote:
Pf for Megawatts, and Meanwells is confirmed .7

I'll confirm the same for PD and WFCO. That makes the math easy: The max power you can put into the battery is about 55-60% of the generator's rated power in watts.

pretty close to the same PF for progressive dynamics and WFCO convertes as well from what I've measured on a few in the past.

only a few powermax converters are PF corrected. I don't know of any other brands PF corrected. FWIW a PD60A unit is pretty much the limit for a honda 2000. around 1500VA max draw IIRC.

Stealing stuff from the other thread on 108 vs 124 and applying it to here about gen/converter matching---

It was suggested earlier that the whole thing is not linear so that you could not just take the VA at 108v and it would be the same at 124v. The current at the VA at 124 is less than at 108, but the VA is not necessarily the same either.

In the above interpretation of the Iota guy's figures, the 55 amper would be pulling 1336 VA at 120v and 1447 at 108v. Salvo's calculations are a little different but same trend. He gets 12amps at 120 while I got 11 using the Iota guy's numbers.

So anyway, if the VA is less by however much at 124 than at 108, then we can return to the burning question--can you run a bigger charger with the Honda (124) than you would think you could if you used the charger's spec (at 108 where they take the "max amps" ) to match the Honda's rated VA?

It looks like you could, but not clear how much bigger without more exact specifications for the chargers

So the converter's spec sheet should give the "max amps" at 108 for the safety issue of whether it needs a 20a circuit or just a 15a, but we should not use that for matching to the Generator's rated output VA.

What we want is the converter's VA requirement at the generator's voltage (not all gens being the same, and some not even being "clean 120" )

Somehow, I doubt we are going to see that in their spec sheets :(

An example of the value of having the proper specs to base decisions on: Recently I decided to get another adjustable voltage charger to run with my 100 amp one instead of using the portable Vector collection and the 100.

I pretty much figured the Honda could run the 100 and the 55 amper (non-PF), but I was tempted by the PF corrected 75 amper.

I just couldn't get enough info I believed to tell if the PF corrected 75 would draw about the same as the 55 so that the Honda could run the 75 and the 100. So I played it safe and got the 55 and can now do 155.

I might have been able to run the 100 and 75 for 175 instead, but if so, I missed out on that by not having enough info.

I've got a life,....I'm camping. Everything....including my PF is working fantastically,.....well, except for the solar, here on the coast, it leaves a little bit to be desired.

The PowerMax figures will be in the revised spec sheet, but meanwhile:

I can report (again :) ) that my Honda 3000 at sea level can do 130 DC amps worth of Vectors ( PF unknown) but at 135 amps it pops its breaker. Substituting the PowerMax 100 amper (PF corrected) for some Vectors, the Honda can now do about 160 amps before popping its breaker, and it has also now run the 100 amper plus the PM3-55 non-PF without popping its breaker doing 156 amps.

I tried to figure out the PF of the Vectors a while back using that information, but I am not claiming any accuracy.

Honda VA limit rated at 2800VA. 130 amps non-PF and 160 amps with 100 PF, 60 non-PF. So the 60 non-PF is the same, but the 100 PF is only 70 when not-PF corrected. So the Vector PF is 0.7 ?

The 2800VA can do 130a of 0.7 PF charger so it ought to be able to run 100/70 x 130 = 186a worth of PF corrected chargers at sea level

If 186a size = 2800VA with PF at 1.0, then a 100a charger should be rated at 100/186 x 2800 = 1505 watts

A 55a charger should be rated at 55/186 x 2800 = 828w, (the PD9260 says 1000w input) then with its 0.7 PF it should require a supply of 100/70 x 828 = 1183VA

Since actual specs for the various brands of converters are a little different, there must be some errors in my approach.
- the actual Honda VA vs that 2800 as rated.
-the 100a PF corrected charger is not at 1.0 but at 0.9x PF

But it is all sort of somewhere in that general amount more or less approximately.

I have been trying to figure out if the Champ can run the Powermax 120 at altitude and between this thread and the high rate thread, I think my head is going to explode. lol

Actually at 1776 watts I know it will and I might even be able to add in the trailers 55a converter up to its voltage limits. The Champ may be big and ugly but it will get the bulk done as fast as possible so the solar can take over. Two 75a would be the best I could do at altitude.

I was under the impression that inductance or capacitance could be used to introduce lead or lag, as needed.

The power converters don't have the current lead/lag of displacement power factor, typical with motors, which can be corrected by passive components. They have distortion power factor where the current waveform isn't a sine wave. It's mostly above my pay grade, but I believe with a power converter, active PFC is what's called for.

Salvo wrote:
All converters have exactly the same front end. That means same PF.

Hmmmm ... so "Power Factor Corrected" converters exist only in the minds of marketing types?

I was under the impression that inductance or capacitance could be used to introduce lead or lag, as needed.