Li recycling 2% old fashioned lead acid 98%

Most lithium based batteries are not 12V.......or from EVs.

Are you suggesting the imminent demise of bipolar disorder?

jdc1 wrote:
Most lithium based batteries are not 12V.......or from EVs.

how many AAAs does it take to equal one EV battery?
bumpy

Bumpyroad wrote:

jdc1 wrote:
Most lithium based batteries are not 12V.......or from EVs.

how many AAAs does it take to equal one EV battery?
bumpy

My 2007 Prius has its original battery since I bought it new in 07. Most hybrid owners sell there cars to kids before the battery dies. Those kids drive those cars for ANOTHER 100,000 miles....without the hybrid feature. My daughter just did that with her 2009 Prius.
As for the "How many..." question? A lot. But, not as many as rechargeable tools, cameras, computers, Rumba's, ect.

Lithium importance 1%

100,000,000 tons of toxic Chinese chew and spit garbage 98%

jdc1 wrote:

Bumpyroad wrote:

jdc1 wrote:
Most lithium based batteries are not 12V.......or from EVs.

how many AAAs does it take to equal one EV battery?
bumpy

My 2007 Prius has its original battery since I bought it new in 07. Most hybrid owners sell there cars to kids before the battery dies. Those kids drive those cars for ANOTHER 100,000 miles....without the hybrid feature. My daughter just did that with her 2009 Prius.
As for the "How many..." question? A lot. But, not as many as rechargeable tools, cameras, computers, Rumba's, ect.

Good grief.. Get over it that EV is better and much more "earth friendly", it is not.

A single Tesla auto used 7,104 of 18650 "cells" so EACH EV is the equivalent of 7,104 cellphones or Tablets.

The newest Tesla batteries has raise that to an incredible 8,256 cells or 8,256 cellphones or Tablets!

See HERE for more details.

As far as "recycling" Lithium batteries goes, it is not efficient nor cost saving to do so. Takes considerable amount of energy to properly break down these cells back into the individual components used to make them.

See HERE for more recycling information.

Lithium batteries DO contain trace amounts of materials considered toxic or hazardous.

At this time only 50% of the materials in a Lithium cell can be recovered in an efficient way.. Compare that to Lead acid where 98% is recovered and reused.

What happens to that other 50%? Yeah that is going to create a large amount of toxic materials which our children and grandchildren and their offspring will have to deal with..

According to HERE in 2019 there were "In the fourth quarter of 2019, there were some 279.6 million vehicles operating on roads throughout the United States. The number of vehicles in operation on U.S. roads increased by around 1.6 percent between the fourth quarter of 2018 and the fourth quarter of 2019."

So imagine replacing every single gas/diesel vehicle with EV will do for our environment?

Lets go back to how many cells in a Tesla battery shall we?

That would be equivalent to 2308377 MILLION cell phones or Tablets ADDITIONAL waste to deal with and only HALF of that could be recycled!

Yeah folks that is what I call "Earth friendly" :E

Hate to splash more clouds on your sunshine but the entire process of digging up and processing Lithium and other materials like Cobalt causes considerable damage to the Earth in mining, extraction, processing. Uses considerable energy (has to come from somewhere and typically Gas and Diesel is primary sources).

Then once you have said vehicle in operation you have to look at all of the conversion losses from how electric power is generated (Natural gas, Diesel, coal, Nuclear, Solar panels, wind) and all of those systems loss and pollution work into the mix..

Sure EV makes some folks "feel good", but they often do so without the knowledge of just what it really takes to make that battery powered vehicle go and what down the road damage will be.

Some like to think they are saving money because they do not pay road taxes, some get free rides for pluggin into someone else's power.. Nothing is "free", there is always a cost to everything we do.

Gdetrailer wrote:

At this time only 50% of the materials in a Lithium cell can be recovered in an efficient way.. Compare that to Lead acid where 98% is recovered and reused.

this number was bumped to 80% this year due to new technology. its getting closer but still not there. but the life span and usable energy of Li compared to Lead asid make it a exelent option for Rv use.

Steve

StirCrazy wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

At this time only 50% of the materials in a Lithium cell can be recovered in an efficient way.. Compare that to Lead acid where 98% is recovered and reused.

this number was bumped to 80% this year due to new technology. its getting closer but still not there. but the life span and usable energy of Li compared to Lead asid make it a exelent option for Rv use.

Steve

Best you can do?

That STILL leaves a considerable amount of non recyclable material that turns into toxic unusable waste.

Lithium batteries are not always RV friendly, they do not like HEAT nor do they like COLD, they like basically "room temperature".. How many times have you personally camped when the max and min temps were 70-80 F all day and night?

So, to keep Lithium batteries happy you MUST COOL them when they get too hot (waste energy) and when they get too cool you MUST HEAT them (waste energy).. neither is ideal..

At least with Lead acid they CAN be charged and discharged at extreme temps without the needs for temperature controls that monitor and apply heat or cold when needed.

Better buy into the Lithium is best band wagon with your eyes open, charging Lithium batteries in cold temps can destroy them in a second.

Li works fine in my RV even without camping where it's 70-80. I don't think I'm going back to lead because it can be recycled.

So, do we leave our grandchildren toxic waste or an atmosphere choked with CO2?

Gdetrailer wrote:

jdc1 wrote:

Bumpyroad wrote:

jdc1 wrote:
Most lithium based batteries are not 12V.......or from EVs.

how many AAAs does it take to equal one EV battery?
bumpy

My 2007 Prius has its original battery since I bought it new in 07. Most hybrid owners sell there cars to kids before the battery dies. Those kids drive those cars for ANOTHER 100,000 miles....without the hybrid feature. My daughter just did that with her 2009 Prius.
As for the "How many..." question? A lot. But, not as many as rechargeable tools, cameras, computers, Rumba's, ect.

Good grief.. Get over it that EV is better and much more "earth friendly", it is not.

A single Tesla auto used 7,104 of 18650 "cells" so EACH EV is the equivalent of 7,104 cellphones or Tablets.

The newest Tesla batteries has raise that to an incredible 8,256 cells or 8,256 cellphones or Tablets!

See HERE for more details.

As far as "recycling" Lithium batteries goes, it is not efficient nor cost saving to do so. Takes considerable amount of energy to properly break down these cells back into the individual components used to make them.

See HERE for more recycling information.

Lithium batteries DO contain trace amounts of materials considered toxic or hazardous.

At this time only 50% of the materials in a Lithium cell can be recovered in an efficient way.. Compare that to Lead acid where 98% is recovered and reused.

What happens to that other 50%? Yeah that is going to create a large amount of toxic materials which our children and grandchildren and their offspring will have to deal with..

According to HERE in 2019 there were "In the fourth quarter of 2019, there were some 279.6 million vehicles operating on roads throughout the United States. The number of vehicles in operation on U.S. roads increased by around 1.6 percent between the fourth quarter of 2018 and the fourth quarter of 2019."

So imagine replacing every single gas/diesel vehicle with EV will do for our environment?

Lets go back to how many cells in a Tesla battery shall we?

That would be equivalent to 2308377 MILLION cell phones or Tablets ADDITIONAL waste to deal with and only HALF of that could be recycled!

Yeah folks that is what I call "Earth friendly" :E

Hate to splash more clouds on your sunshine but the entire process of digging up and processing Lithium and other materials like Cobalt causes considerable damage to the Earth in mining, extraction, processing. Uses considerable energy (has to come from somewhere and typically Gas and Diesel is primary sources).

Then once you have said vehicle in operation you have to look at all of the conversion losses from how electric power is generated (Natural gas, Diesel, coal, Nuclear, Solar panels, wind) and all of those systems loss and pollution work into the mix..

Sure EV makes some folks "feel good", but they often do so without the knowledge of just what it really takes to make that battery powered vehicle go and what down the road damage will be.

Some like to think they are saving money because they do not pay road taxes, some get free rides for pluggin into someone else's power.. Nothing is "free", there is always a cost to everything we do.

Finally ......... someone (Gdetrailer above) has exposed the BEST KEPT SECRET on EV vehicles!!!! A great post indeed, and exactly what I suspected the situation was and would be.

Regarding general purpose vehicle batteries, I wonder how this relatively new battery technology stacks up from a "green viewpoint": Silicon Dioxide (SiO2) batteries?