Pulling more than 50 amps ?

Gdetrailer wrote:

You however cannot "combine or connect" L1 and L2 together because they are out of phase (one positive and one negative going). Adding two voltages out of phase CANCELS the voltage and in this case creates a huge short and the result would be zero volts.

Though you are correct. 100% and that was a good post I will comment on this paragrapy.
Wrong point of view
When we talk about "Combining" we mean one leg is fed to the OUTLET so there is L-1 and L-1 not L-1 and L-2
You were looking at it from the other side. You are correct that if you try to hook L-1 to L-2 smoke fire and sparks (or tripped breakers) will ensue.

But some "Cheater Parks" only run one leg to the box or so I'm told.

There really isn't a simple comparison. Because learning wrong will confuse someone as to why there is a big problem when neutral is lost.

Or how can a neutral be sized with the same gauge as L1 and L2? "AC FOR DUMMIES ?"

Do people have an aversion to learning? Maybe it's like me and computers not understanding idiotic sounding jargon.

Finding the easiest to learn book about AC power basics ?

Bobbo wrote:

DrewE wrote:
is a semi truck with dual trailers, traveling at 50 mph, really a 100 mph truck because there are two trailers of 50 mph each?)

Incorrect analogy. The correct analogy is "is a semi truck with dual 50,000 pound trailers a 50,000 pound load or a 100,000 pound load?"

Trailer "L1" has 50,000 pounds, trailer "L2" has 50,000 pounds. The receiving destination (the RV) gets 100,000 pounds delivered.

Pounds of load moved in the trailers would be more nearly to watts, I believe, rather than amperes. A 240V 50A circuit (split phase or not) certainly delivers twice the power as a 120V 50A circuit, but it does not deliver twice the current. In both cases, you're getting your 50 Coulombs per second. Similarly, the dual trailer truck is doing twice the work per unit time as a single trailer truck, and so delivering twice the power to moving the load; but, of course, it is not going twice as fast.

Reisender wrote:


Wow. I actually understood that...and that’s sayin something. :). Thanks dude.

:)

Glad that explanation was helpful to you..

Looks like the thread however has gone off the rail and destroyed a few trucks along the way on the last couple of posts.. :E

I see two trucks approaching each other at 50 miles per hour to meet at the depot exactly between them. Depot manager says the load is closing in at 100 miles per hour yet each truck is just going 50. Is he right?

DrewE wrote:
is a semi truck with dual trailers, traveling at 50 mph, really a 100 mph truck because there are two trailers of 50 mph each?)

Incorrect analogy. The correct analogy is "is a semi truck with dual 50,000 pound trailers a 50,000 pound load or a 100,000 pound load?"

Trailer "L1" has 50,000 pounds, trailer "L2" has 50,000 pounds. The receiving destination (the RV) gets 100,000 pounds delivered.

time2roll wrote:

Reisender wrote:
Side note. For Our Tesla you can dial it right back to 8 amps with 120 or 240 volts. Kinda handy in power sharing situations. Not the case with our leaf that runs flat out at 27 amps all the time.

Yes the LEAF maximum rate is controlled by the charging cord it is connected to. LEAF will most certainly charge at slower rates down to the 6 amp minimum of the charging standard.

Ah yes. Poor explanation on my point. We have a Juicebox that can be wifi controlled down to 8 ish amps. Good catch. On the leaf it’s done on the EVSE (cord). On the Tesla it’s done on the car.

Reisender wrote:
Side note. For Our Tesla you can dial it right back to 8 amps with 120 or 240 volts. Kinda handy in power sharing situations. Not the case with our leaf that runs flat out at 27 amps all the time.

Yes the LEAF maximum rate is controlled by the charging cord it is connected to. LEAF will most certainly charge at slower rates down to the 6 amp minimum of the charging standard.

Gdetrailer wrote:

Reisender wrote:
In practical terms on a 50 amp pedestal you can draw 40 amps st 240 volts continually. We have an electric car and we sometimes do that.

Real world experience. Visiting a friend with a Newell with three AC’s, all running as well as a bunch of other things. Our Electric vehicle hooked up to his pedastal via a Y connector off the box pulling16 amps at 240. No problem.

Yes, 40A at 240V is correct and possible, that is 9600W draw.

50A at 240 is 12,000W.

However, what most folks seem to miss is a RV "50A" connection IS actually a COMBINATION connection, it is a 120V/240V connection, it has a NEUTRAL which allows for not only 240V appliances but 120V appliances also.

This means you can use a combination of 120V AND 240V appliances on this connection.

Pure 240V ONLY devices do not need and are not wired for the Neutral.

Home water heaters, deep well water pumps, heavy duty air compressors, high BTU home A/C units typically fall into the category of 240V ONLY.

Your high amperage car charger is is using BOTH the hot legs (L1 and L2) and not the neutral so it is subject to BOTH of those breakers limits which is 50A or 12,000W and would fall into the pure 240V only category.

Now, for 120V loads, you use only ONE of the Lines coming in (L1 OR L2) PLUS THE NEUTRAL and you can draw a max of 6,000W at 120V (50A).

With 50A 120/240 service you actually have the same as TWO 50A at 120V (6,000W) power feeds. In reality you could say that for 120V appliances you actually you have up to 100A of capacity (12,000W).

You however cannot "combine or connect" L1 and L2 together because they are out of phase (one positive and one negative going). Adding two voltages out of phase CANCELS the voltage and in this case creates a huge short and the result would be zero volts.

Typical RV 50A 120/240 will put MOST of the loads on the L1 "leg" and very few loads on the L2 leg. L2 on the RV is often reserved for the second or third AC unit.

It is done this way to allow a 50A RV to hook up to a 120V ONLY 15A-30A pedestal and have MOST of the RV get power although at very limited amperage of course.

Wow. I actually understood that...and that’s sayin something. :). Thanks dude.

Side note. For Our Tesla you can dial it right back to 8 amps with 120 or 240 volts. Kinda handy in power sharing situations. Not the case with our leaf that runs flat out at 27 amps all the time.

Reisender wrote:
In practical terms on a 50 amp pedestal you can draw 40 amps st 240 volts continually. We have an electric car and we sometimes do that.

Real world experience. Visiting a friend with a Newell with three AC’s, all running as well as a bunch of other things. Our Electric vehicle hooked up to his pedastal via a Y connector off the box pulling16 amps at 240. No problem.

Yes, 40A at 240V is correct and possible, that is 9600W draw.

50A at 240 is 12,000W.

However, what most folks seem to miss is a RV "50A" connection IS actually a COMBINATION connection, it is a 120V/240V connection, it has a NEUTRAL which allows for not only 240V appliances but 120V appliances also.

This means you can use a combination of 120V AND 240V appliances on this connection.

Pure 240V ONLY devices do not need and are not wired for the Neutral.

Home water heaters, deep well water pumps, heavy duty air compressors, high BTU home A/C units typically fall into the category of 240V ONLY.

Your high amperage car charger is is using BOTH the hot legs (L1 and L2) and not the neutral so it is subject to BOTH of those breakers limits which is 50A or 12,000W and would fall into the pure 240V only category.

Now, for 120V loads, you use only ONE of the Lines coming in (L1 OR L2) PLUS THE NEUTRAL and you can draw a max of 6,000W at 120V (50A).

With 50A 120/240 service you actually have the same as TWO 50A at 120V (6,000W) power feeds. In reality you could say that for 120V appliances you actually you have up to 100A of capacity (12,000W).

You however cannot "combine or connect" L1 and L2 together because they are out of phase (one positive and one negative going). Adding two voltages out of phase CANCELS the voltage and in this case creates a huge short and the result would be zero volts.

Typical RV 50A 120/240 will put MOST of the loads on the L1 "leg" and very few loads on the L2 leg. L2 on the RV is often reserved for the second or third AC unit.

It is done this way to allow a 50A RV to hook up to a 120V ONLY 15A-30A pedestal and have MOST of the RV get power although at very limited amperage of course.