2wd vs 4wd

Lessmore wrote:
...experience and an 'educated' foot...

Here's the thing...regardless of what vehicle you're in, 2wd, fwd, part-time 4x4, awd, the experience and 'educated foot' is by far the most important piece of being able to safely drive on adverse road conditions.

Lessmore wrote:

ford truck guy wrote:
I stand -- somewhat corrected -- Yes , I have not been around as long as some of you - OLD FOLK - :B .. so I guess my experience is truly based on technology.. which we can all agree has improved most the vehicles of today... I guess I was comparing the 4x4's that I drove and the 4x2's that I drove ( I still vote for the 4x4) and not the old school vehicles.. Either way , you will not catch me towing my 5er down the beach ! :B

My kids...all adults...call me the 'ancient mariner' when they see me in my fishing boat...an elderly, Old Town freighter canoe.
:B

Les

Very Nice !! If it floats , it's good to go fishing in ...

ford truck guy wrote:
I stand -- somewhat corrected -- Yes , I have not been around as long as some of you - OLD FOLK - :B .. so I guess my experience is truly based on technology.. which we can all agree has improved most the vehicles of today... I guess I was comparing the 4x4's that I drove and the 4x2's that I drove ( I still vote for the 4x4) and not the old school vehicles.. Either way , you will not catch me towing my 5er down the beach ! :B

My kids...all adults...call me the 'ancient mariner' when they see me in my fishing boat...an elderly, Old Town freighter canoe.
:B

Les

I stand -- somewhat corrected -- Yes , I have not been around as long as some of you - OLD FOLK - :B .. so I guess my experience is truly based on technology.. which we can all agree has improved most the vehicles of today... I guess I was comparing the 4x4's that I drove and the 4x2's that I drove ( I still vote for the 4x4) and not the old school vehicles.. Either way , you will not catch me towing my 5er down the beach ! :B

ford truck guy wrote:
quote - -
Good thing your "circle" never lived 30 or 20 years ago when 4x4 was pretty rare..

BTW... been driving STUFF for over 35 years... I believe that falls in the 20-30 category... driven 2 wheel drive trucks... 4x4 trucks.. big one stack macks... freight shakers.. Nobody will convince me that a 2 wheel drive truck will go the same places as a 4x4...

I agree with GdeTrailer.

But them I'm an old geezer, who has been driving for 50 + years.

I'm guessing you're too young to understand what it was like driving back in the 1960's and earlier, as you indicated you've been driving for 35 years. Not being negative...just a case of me and other old guys have been driving ....some of us for 50-60 years or more. Things, vehicles were different back then. Maybe not as good as newer vehicles, but that's what was available. :)

Driving for 35 years take you only back to 1979/80.

Back in the '60's< I was driving 2WD farm trucks and pickups in heavy country snow, down farm roads and in the farm fields.

Back then, I also drove commercial trucks in heavy ice and snow, Western Canadian winters. Similar conditions to what some Northern states like Montana and North Dakota experience.

Where I live we get winters that go to around 5/12 months long and the snow doesn't melt. It comes late October, early November and it's still here early April, sometimes late March.

Very few 4WD vehicles available back then (1960's and before) in either the USA or Canada. Mostly 2WD and you had to learn how to drive in traction limited terrain, with what was available.

In fact, in 1963, the only 4WD I recall seeing in my area was an older Dodge Power Wagon, which was used by a gas station. Other gas station trucks then were things like older '50's Fargo (Canadian Dodge), '50's Chevy/ Fords one ton pickups, with shop built wrecker units in them. Except for the Power Wagon, all 2WD,

In difficult snowy terrain, would I rather be in a 4wd with a Limited slip or locker on the rear drive axle ?

Sure.

But if it's really dicey, then give me a tracked vehicle.;)

But 2WD, with extra weight over the drive axle, good ground clearance, with the right tires, locker or limited slip on the drive axle, lot's of experience and an 'educated' foot ....you'd be surprised how well 2WD will do.

Up here, we have many ice roads that are used for transportation of goods to isolated communities. All the trucks are class 8 tractors. Some have rear tandem drive axles. Some just have tandem axles with drive to only one rear axle. They make it through difficult traction conditions.

Most of the time 4wd will take me where I may have also made it with 2wd, but with more effort. I may have to lock the hubs and shift into 4wd instead of having to lay traction material down, shovel out a path and install chains on a 2wd. The outcome is same but the time and energy is not.

Then there are other times when conditions worsen and I need to put more effort forth while using 4wd. This is a reserve capacity I would not have with 2wd.

RedRocket204 wrote:

MPond wrote:
But at low tide it flows out to sea, the level is much lower, and has no (or minimal) salt.

You may be correct that the fresh water flowing out, when at low tide, has less salt in it but keep in mind, you have now drenched the bottom of your vehicles and the beach sand gets kicked up into every nook and cranny and that is still loaded with salt. Just a FYI to make sure and always run your truck into some sort of under carriage spray to get as much of it off as possible. Then hose off any other areas you can get to. It may not remove everything but it should help.

When I ran my truck around on the beach, I went ahead and got one of those soaker hoses and attached it to a 2x4, turned it on and slowly ran my truck over it. The soaker hose seemed to do a decent job at spraying water up and all over the place. I did this as it was easier to rinse the under carriage of my truck as I was on the sand frequently surfing the north OR coast. However, I never ran my truck in the sea water, no other water crossings either, but would see people driving out into sea water all the time.

Definitely! I always go to the quarter car wash and use the pressure washer to hose down the underside of the truck and trailer. And I've been able to keep the rust at bay.

But I've seen the rust of some guys who drive their trucks in the salt water along the shore - 100X worse...

MPond wrote:
But at low tide it flows out to sea, the level is much lower, and has no (or minimal) salt.

You may be correct that the fresh water flowing out, when at low tide, has less salt in it but keep in mind, you have now drenched the bottom of your vehicles and the beach sand gets kicked up into every nook and cranny and that is still loaded with salt. Just a FYI to make sure and always run your truck into some sort of under carriage spray to get as much of it off as possible. Then hose off any other areas you can get to. It may not remove everything but it should help.

When I ran my truck around on the beach, I went ahead and got one of those soaker hoses and attached it to a 2x4, turned it on and slowly ran my truck over it. The soaker hose seemed to do a decent job at spraying water up and all over the place. I did this as it was easier to rinse the under carriage of my truck as I was on the sand frequently surfing the north OR coast. However, I never ran my truck in the sea water, no other water crossings either, but would see people driving out into sea water all the time.

Gdetrailer wrote:
...

Yep, folks now days think 4x4 is the only way to do things..

...

That's the problem with this topic - there is more than 1 way to skin a cat. People always ask if 4wd is "needed", and for most scenarios, it is a matter of opinion. I "need" it to get my 5-er out in the sand, whereas you aren't interested in going out in the sand. Neither answer is wrong, just different wants and "needs".

Gdetrailer wrote:
...
By the way, 4x4 on ice, doesn't stop you any faster.. Every year I see many 4x4s sliding off icy roads planting their vehicles in such ways you really wonder just how they did it..

4x4 often gives folks overconfidence and they find themselves in far more trouble far quicker than one would expect

...

4wd does improve braking on ice, but it also gives some people overconfidence. Those two are not mutually exclusive. Having the others 3 wheels locked to the 4th wheel with less traction will keep it from locking up, and will do a better job that ABS.

Gdetrailer wrote:
...
Resale.. by the time I am ready to give up on a vehicle it is done, totally worn out with high mileage.. I have a 2003 F250 with 5.4 right now that has 200,000 miles on the clock, with that mileage resale on 4x2 is around $5K, 4x4 would be $6.5K, a difference of $1.5K which is less than half of what 4x4 option would have cost back then

...

Similarly - the financial aspect is subjective as well. People keep their tow vehicles different lengths of time, some buy new, others buy used. Some people pay for high-dollar dealer service whereas others do it themselves. Some people place a significant value on the extra insurance 4wd provides, others have no use for it.

My opinion is that I need 4wd because it takes me places that I want to go, and couldn't otherwise go with a 2wd. Others have different opinions.

BenK wrote:
Always shake my head watching folks out at Pismo in the ocean water,
which has salt. One of the worst things you can do to your vehicles
electrical system...

That's why I wait for low-tide and cross in the fresh-water stream when I got to Pismo. At high-tide, the stream is full of deep salt water. But at low tide it flows out to sea, the level is much lower, and has no (or minimal) salt.

BenK wrote:
...Airing down below 15PSI is too low...you can loose a bead...

To be clear - when aired down this low with a heavy rig, it's best to go slow - creep through the sand. The tires will flex well and stay on the bead. And they stay on top of the sand, rather than digging in.

BenK wrote:
Nylon tow straps are DANGEROUS if you don't know HOW2 use them...

Yep, you should never do the slingshot maneuver, and should always go slow when using a recovery strap. We use D-rings to secure the loop to a proper recovery point securely attached to the frame.