Watched the video someone posted about the Tacoma towing and then went to another link/video done by same shop where they tested the new 2016 Ram 3500 dually towing a backhoe. It was said during the video how the engine had 385 HP and 900Ft/TQ. In MY '15 GM had the lowest of the 3 in terms of HP & TQ, Ram had higher HP and highest TQ and Ford had highest HP and smidge under the Ram in TQ. Now, based on the vid, it seems Ram went backwards on HP and upwards in TQ. Did I miss something? Was under the impression that HP would go up if TQ went up.Plus, in video, the price of tested truck was $75K!!!!!!!!!!:E

Torque is generally rated at a much lower RPM, in the case of Cummins that means around 1800 RPM. HP is rated much higher on the RPM scale. Againin the case of Cummins that is around 3500RPM.HP does not move loads torque does.Just look at any class 8 truck. HP way less than 500,torque above 1100 is the norm.

Um, Horsepower is calculated by multiplying torque by engine RPMs, so you can easily up the torque while dropping the horsepower just by decreasing the engine red line. More practically, if you optimize the engine to produce peak torque at lower rpm, you will decrease the horsepower in the process.

2013-2015 were available 385/865 for 16 they bumped tq to 900 they also increased SAE towing capacities.

naturist wrote:Um, Horsepower is calculated by multiplying torque by engine RPMs, so you can easily up the torque while dropping the horsepower just by decreasing the engine red line. More practically, if you optimize the engine to produce peak torque at lower rpm, you will decrease the horsepower in the process.well, the first part is true. HP is related to torque x rpm.However, increasing low end torqued does NOT necessarily mean lower HP. with current engine management, valve lift and duration control etc. many many engines have increased low end torque considerably AND increased HP as well. This started in the early 1990's with variable valve timing and now includes variable lift and duration as well, along with intake runner control and length that varies with RPM.I have two 1997 vehicles (same engine) with an engine introduced in 1990 with variable valve timing. If it had "fixed" timing based on high rpm it would have had a very lumpy idle with very poor low end torque. similar to mid 60's muscle cars. However there is over 30 degrees of timing change between idle and high rpm and low end idle is very good and incredible low end torque with a very flat torque curve.At the time it was introduced (1990) it was one of the few normally aspirated engines giving well over IHP/cu in. Common today but very uncommon then. Now larger diesels with lower rpm limits may not benefit as much, and I'm not aware of any of the Big 3 (cummins, duramax, ford) that do this yet, I'm sure they are playing with fuel and turbo management to maximize torque and HP.Now you can "have your cake and eat it to" to paraphrase.

naturist wrote:Um, Horsepower is calculated by multiplying torque by engine RPMs, so you can easily up the torque while dropping the horsepower just by decreasing the engine red line. More practically, if you optimize the engine to produce peak torque at lower rpm, you will decrease the horsepower in the process.X2Generally speaking a in-line Cummins will never have the HP a V8 diesel engine will put out. Having said that I believe the newer ISX engines put out 600 HP which is just amazing to me. Of course they hold like 55 quarts of oil ( 14 gallons) :w

Did I miss something, 385 HP for 2016 Ram diesel?

Frostbitte
Explorer
Dec 13, 2015
In the "old" days, for diesels, HP was about half of the value of torque. Now, that no longer applies. Yes, it the 6.7 peak torque is an amazing 900 lbs of torque and only 385 HP. However, even with a lower expected amount of HP, it really depends on when that HP is "turned on". With today's computers driving today's engines and transmissions, peak horsepower may not always mean as much. If an engine can apply more horsepower and torque during certain power bands then that may be more effective than just more horsepower or torque overall on paper.

I have a 2011 RAM 3500 RAM and I have had the chance to drive and pull with a 2015 RAM 3500. Mine is a 350/650 6.7 Cummins and the rental had a 370/800 6.7 and I can tell you there was a different feel to both. The rental had the 68RFE transmission with a 3.42 rear axle and mine has a 68RFE with a 4.10 axle and with only 20 HP difference, the newer truck did not feel at all lacking in the HP or torque department. So obviously computer calibrations helped. I'd probably say from a dead stop the truck's would be even in a race and more than just a 20 HP difference to feel. Usually, to me, it take much more than just 20 HP to "feel" a difference.
I'd also like to add that the newer truck used DEF and the unloaded highway mileage was awesome. Pulling our cargo trailer felt great though it did seem to downshift more often from 6th gear to 5th gear as apposed to my 2011 but the mileage and "tuning" from the factory seemed to more than make up for it.
All in all, my long winded point is that despite HP number or torque numbers on paper, there's more to it than that. If you're unsure, no matter which brand, all I can really recommend is take a test drive.
I was thinking in my mind that the 370/800 6.7 Cummins would be a slouch with the only rear axle available for SRW, the 3.42, and it really wasn't. I was pleasantly surprised how RAM tweaked things.

Frost
Cummins12V98
Explorer III
Dec 12, 2015
shepstone wrote:
Cummins12V98 wrote:
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

Truck and RV in pic weighed 28-29K and most of the 65K miles were towing. Truck was 2011 HO Dually 68RFE with 3:42's ZERO problems.

Only issue was taking off from a start on a grade. Same truck with 4:10's would have cured that one problem.

Hey Cummins how does the Aisin shift compared to the older one? Firmer / softer? Same shift points?

It for sure gets the load rolling easier, it's like having a granny first gear. I know the 4:10's make some difference but I have driven my Son's 3500 SRW Aisin with at lease 18K dump trailer in tow and it took off real easy also.

As far as the shifting the Aisin does not stay unlocked near as long when shifting and a lot of the time it feels like it goes locked to locked but is not a slam. The shifts are firm and positive. I honestly did not have a problem with how the 68RFE shifted but I REALLY like how this one does. After owning both I would recommend the Aisin and the extra HP/TQ.

I would also recommend the Aisin/3:42's towing up to 24K combined or so. Any heavier 4:10's and skip the 3:73's because the 3:42's in 5th are the same RPM's as the 4:10's in 6th 1,750 @ 60mph.
1jeep
Explorer II
Dec 11, 2015
all I have been able to find that im interest in is (1)ran 3500 drew dually and a F45. im not really convinced I need the 450 as it has 4:30 gears, the ford I like but hate the color being white the ram is my color black on black leather.

right now both dealers are pushing decent discounts on in stock models, if it weren't for that I would just order what I wanted.

Ok, not entirely true, I can find many chassis cabs or lower equipped models, im looking for one that is loaded,
SteveB
Explorer
Dec 11, 2015
1jeep wrote:
snipped> Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

You are so right! Check out high volume dealers down south and out west. I ended up in North Carolina to find the Ram I wanted, optioned the way I wanted it. They usually have over 250 Rams in stock. We flew down and drove it back to RI. It was a great weekend adventure.
I was willing to go out to Idaho if the deal was right but there were no fifth wheel prep equipped trucks. I thought it was a bit narrow minded but I'm no truck sales expert.

Then there is a guy over at cumminsforum who is a dealer in Indiana. He seems to be getting some pretty good deals form the posts. I have mine so I quit looking though.
shepstone
Explorer
Dec 11, 2015
Cummins12V98 wrote:
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

Truck and RV in pic weighed 28-29K and most of the 65K miles were towing. Truck was 2011 HO Dually 68RFE with 3:42's ZERO problems.

Only issue was taking off from a start on a grade. Same truck with 4:10's would have cured that one problem.

Hey Cummins how does the Aisin shift compared to the older one? Firmer / softer? Same shift points?
Cummins12V98
Explorer III
Dec 11, 2015
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

Truck and RV in pic weighed 28-29K and most of the 65K miles were towing. Truck was 2011 HO Dually 68RFE with 3:42's ZERO problems.

Only issue was taking off from a start on a grade. Same truck with 4:10's would have cured that one problem.
1jeep
Explorer II
Dec 11, 2015
transamz9 wrote:
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

That truck is 370 hp with 800 lbft of torque. It will do all you need.;)

yes im certain it will move my trailer, however im going from 400hp/800tq, so sorry, but in my mind that is a bit of a step back. Besides I owned a 94 5.9 years ago and went through trannys like people change underwear so I am a bit hesitant to return to dodge/ram/fiat. sort of like a former ford 6.0 owner would be hesitant to buy a new 6.7 ford.
Ram4Sam
Explorer
Dec 11, 2015
transamz9 wrote:
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

That truck is 370 hp with 800 lbft of torque. It will do all you need.;)

Ha! What fun is that....:Z Go big!!

Sam
Me_Again
Explorer III
Dec 11, 2015
Cummins12V98 wrote:

"IF" the truck you are looking at is the 385 HP truck then it DOES have the Aisin. Or if you just look under the hood the dipstick for the trans will tell you what it has. Dipstick on right = Aisin on left = 68RFE.

Looking in, not the left or right side of the vehicle. Dip Stick as pictured on Drivers side is the Aisin MD Japanese tranny. Passengers side is 68RFE RAM tranny.

A bit like the old stew/pilot story, stew went back and looked at engines on the wings and returned to incorrectly tell the pilot which one was on fire. Also why boats have port and starboard sides. Chris
transamz9
Explorer
Dec 11, 2015
1jeep wrote:
according to this it is the 68rfe
http://www.chrysler.com/hostd/windowsticker/getWindowStickerPdf.do?vin=3C63RRKL8GG116316

and yes I would expect a medium duty tranny in a dually, I am trying to make a deal on a truck that is in the dealer stock without ordering one. If I do order a truck I might just go back to ford, but I am open to either brand. Stock on the 1 ton dually trucks in new England is very slim!

That truck is 370 hp with 800 lbft of torque. It will do all you need.;)