Forum Discussion

Reddog1's avatar
Reddog1
Explorer II
Aug 24, 2015

Door decal and Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR)

This subject comes up quite often It is frequently argued (discussed) as to what the door decals (Vehicle Certification Label) means, and how the GVWR is determined.

The purpose of this post is to provide what I see as official information on the Vehicle Certification Label. This is not intended to discuss what is or is not an overloaded truck.

This information is from the 2004 Dodge Ram Service Manual. The photos are from this manual. I will follow with additional photos to further emphasize what inks in this photo.




Note the Vehicle Certification Label (decal) clearly states the GVWR is based on the tires and wheels. This Vehicle Certification Label is not on a truck, but only the data would change if it were for a truck.




Again a clear reference to the tires and rims determining the GVWR.




We can read into this to ignore what it tells us, but I think it is very clear. If you have knowledge of anything that contradicts this 2004 Ram Service Manual, please post.

Wayne
Truck Campers
  • mkirsch's avatar
    mkirsch
    Nomad II
    Aug 24, 2015
    GVWR is always less than the combined axle ratings.

    GFAWR is always less than the combined tire/wheel ratings.

    GRAWR is only equal to the tire/wheel ratings on 2500 or 3500 SRW pickups. In all other cases it is LESS than the combined tire/wheel ratings.

    So even if the statement were "clear," it does not make sense because the numbers do not add up.

    No vehicle manufacturer has ever sat down and documented WHY the numbers do not add up. They leave it to us to pontificate and conjecture about. They don't want to stick their noses in lest they open themselves up for liability.

    You're never going to settle the argument. People want to hear the answers they want to hear, and will interpret facts and numbers to make things fit their desires.
  • Reddog1's avatar
    Reddog1
    Explorer II
    Aug 24, 2015
    Kayteg1 wrote:
    ... For example Ford makes chassis capable of 35,000 lb GVWR, but such vehicle would require CDL (unless registered as RV) so Ford derated the chassis to 26,000 lb with possible lighter tires.
    That doesn't mean the chassis can't handle 35k
    Typical sample - 1 ton pickups hauling goseneck with 5 cars on it.
    I do not find that hard to believe at all. Do you have a link to some documentation to support that? I think it is valuable to know.

    Wayne
  • Reddog1's avatar
    Reddog1
    Explorer II
    Aug 24, 2015
    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    Well........ don't see where it is stated GVWR is based on "a clear reference to the tires and rims determining the GVWR."
    Perhaps you should reread the Vehicle Certification Label. I thought it was pretty clear. The only thing that is not clear to me is why the combined axle GVWRs and single GVWR stated are not the same.

    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    It does state......"The Gross Front and Rear Axle Ratings (GAWRs)are based on a minimum rim size and a maximum cold tire pressure.
    I agree.

    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    In your example.....

    FAWR....2850
    RAWR....2700
    Total...5500

    YET GVWR is only 5000
    This is not my example, it is directly from the 2004 Ram Service Manual.

    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    So.......NO doesn't seem that a clear reference to the tires and rims determining the GVWR has been made. Does make a clear reference to the GAWRs which are much lower then 'axle mfg. 'ratings'
    For me it is clear, the others will have to come to their own conclusions.

    Old-Biscuit wrote:
    Debate goes on
    It could if someone refuses to accept the Service manuals Vehicle Certification Label information.



    lc0338 - I have no idea what the Cab and chassis vehicles do or do not have. Perhaps a Service Manual would provide the info?


    Super_Dave - Thanks
  • Kayteg1's avatar
    Kayteg1
    Explorer II
    Aug 24, 2015
    lc0338 wrote:
    Cab and chassis vehicles do not have this data on door panel or should I say my dodge ram 3500 in year model 2001 did not.


    I think this was your Dodge.
    My F350 was utility body, so was originally sold as cab and chassis and does have the sticker.
    I just want to point (again) that GVWR is most of the time determinate by taxes and that is why when you add axle ratings, you will come much higher.
    For example Ford makes chassis capable of 35,000 lb GVWR, but such vehicle would require CDL (unless registered as RV) so Ford derated the chassis to 26,000 lb with possible lighter tires.
    That doesn't mean the chassis can't handle 35k
    Typical sample - 1 ton pickups hauling goseneck with 5 cars on it.
  • towpro's avatar
    towpro
    Explorer
    Aug 24, 2015
    your TOTAL GVWR is 5000 lbs. I believe your GVWR takes other things into account like Brakes.

    you can load weight all the way up to GVWR axle rating in front OR rear, as long as you don't exceed total GVWR of 5000 lbs.

    Here is my 2015 (3500 dually) numbers.

    GVWR 14000 lbs.
    Front GVWR 6000 lbs
    Rear GVWR 9750 lbs

    My Total GVWR is 14,000 lbs, not 15,750 lbs.
  • lc0338's avatar
    lc0338
    Explorer
    Aug 24, 2015
    Cab and chassis vehicles do not have this data on door panel or should I say my dodge ram 3500 in year model 2001 did not.
  • Old-Biscuit's avatar
    Old-Biscuit
    Explorer III
    Aug 24, 2015
    Well........ don't see where it is stated GVWR is based on "a clear reference to the tires and rims determining the GVWR."

    It does state......"The Gross Front and Rear Axle Ratings (GAWRs)are based on a minimum rim size and a maximum cold tire pressure.

    In your example.....

    FAWR....2850
    RAWR....2700
    Total...5500

    YET GVWR is only 5000

    So.......NO doesn't seem that a clear reference to the tires and rims determining the GVWR has been made. Does make a clear reference to the GAWRs which are much lower then 'axle mfg. 'ratings'


    Debate goes on
  • Reddog1's avatar
    Reddog1
    Explorer II
    Aug 24, 2015
    I do not have an answer for that Super_Dave. I do feel comfortable in saying there probably is. The problem I see is that while people make statements on this subject, the seldom, if ever, provide and official documentation or source reference. Without that info, it is just gossip, and may or may not be true.

    I am curious, is your truck a short or long bed?

    Wayne
  • Super_Dave's avatar
    Super_Dave
    Explorer
    Aug 24, 2015
    I've read in past threads where the discussion is between the axle rating versus the tire & wheel rating. Is there an axle rating regardless of the tire & wheel being used?

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