Wow! Amazing sort of coincidence..... I knew there was a reason why I had committed so much time over the years to this forum. The knowledge and helpfulness around here is amazing. I should be careful not to steal the thread or I might get the moderators and OP upset. Wait a minute... ;)
I'm glad to hear the good comments about Clemson4x4. They were recommended to me by the local company that is helping us determine a fix as a potential place to get the expertise for the....let's say "root" of the problem. The fix to the "break" is our first focus.
Ummm, do you still have the assembly or did you already use it to fund your project? Knowing your thoroughness I expect it is signed sealed delivered to some other enthusiast...
OK, here's the story:
As some of you know, we ended up buying Don Curley's old Jeep from his wife last fall. We are honored to own it; it's like having a piece of Don to remember him by and I swear he talks to me once in awhile through "Frankenwrangler" as my local mechanic dubbed it when he saw just how modified and unique the thing is. But, we are Jeep newbies and are still learning about it, very slowly (we've put more miles on it towing it than anything else I think.) I have a fair amount of experience with Scouts from back in the day and still have enough parts at home to put together to build a running Scout (I think anyway) including a few Dana 44 housings that are more or less complete back in Colorado.
The main and seemingly benign issue that I know Don was working on was an idle surge. It causes a P0171 (right bank engine lean condition) code that was a constant thing but ONLY at idle. With any throttle at all it goes away. I guess what happens is the PCM keeps adjusting the mixture....+5, +10, +20 and finally it throws the code. The rich mixture causes the idle surge. I had it thoroughly checked out by a very good mechanic in Denver after we bought it and he is convinced it is a PCM/Computer programming issue between the Dodge Magnum 5.9L engine and the program used to flash it to adapt it to usage in the Jeep. But he is not an aftermarket guy or programmer and suggested I needed to get with someone with that expertise. Short story is Don planned on using a PCM from a Dodge Dakota R/T 2WD (sort of the hot rod Durango that had the V8) but it expects to have the Central Timing circuits tied into all the anti-theft stuff which the Jeep doesn't have. Apparently rather than use that they ended up using one from a plain Jane pickup that had that engine but none of the extra stuff and programmed it from there. Why tell you about this first? Read on.
To explain the situation I guess I'll go through the story with the issue from the beginning. First off, I can't remember the R&P gearing in it, but indeed the axle is built-to-the-hilt. It was the super-sized brake kit, on a manual hub 5 on 5.5 conversion, with Curry axle shafts, ARB lockers, new heavy duty perches, Rubicon Express shocks etc. So much I'd have to go back to my old Canyonlands TR where Don listed everything on the Jeep.
It IS a high-pinion Dana 30 from an old XJ; I was a little surprised Don hadn't gone with a Dana 44 as I remember that being a standard swap for Jeepers; In fact, I sold one of my D44's from a Scout to a Jeeper at one point. Glad to hear you (Brad) had one for so long and it wasn't a bad choice Don made.
Last winter, in testing out the systems and air lockers and to see how it would do in deep snow (though I had dinky studded snow tires on that we used that winter for emissions purposes and for 4 months worth of commuting.) I had giant snowboots on while I was doing it, and had both axles locked in....I was backing up and suddenly was going faster than I wanted and headed for a tree. I stood on the brakes....and heard the engine rev, but the brakes were clamped....pop! Clunk clunk clunk....... I had busted the R&P. I believed I had accidentally hit both the brake and the gas with my giant boots. My mechanic told me the R&P was already worn and not to beat myself up; he thought it was pretty worn and was ready to go anyway. So we replaced it; the big challenge he had was not only are they reverse cut gears and the company that made the originals was out of business, but the oversized axles had a different diameter and for an already rare axle, he couldn't find seals that fit and reused the originals.
We are at that point spending money on a Jeep with didn't financially plan for (there were a few other issues as well) but the short story is we blew off the PCM issue because it was only a nuisance and literally only occurred during idle. Leave it for later when I have the time to research, right....
Now fast forward to the Overland Expo. My wife has taken it with the trainers on the course in Flagstaff, and now here in Asheville. It is technically her Jeep and she has no 4WD experience. "Get outfitted, Get Trained, Get going" right? So she is on the course here, with a Land Rover Camel Trophy trainer getting ready to climb over a log. He gets her angled and one wheel over the log, and is climbing back in, when the Jeep suddenly surges forward.....she's standing on the brake yet it is lurching forward and much to her credit, she stayed calm, and threw it into park. Running over a trainer on the course would be bad. He rightfully gave her credit for remaining calm (though it hit her after the fact a bit like a car wreck) and did about her only option which was to throw it in park. So what gave THIS time with a new fresh R&P in it? It broke the spot weld and rotated the axle tube in the housing. They didn't realize it had broken, and it was a real challenge to drive it back to the campsite (no surprise there, it rotated a long ways, maybe 30 degrees? Maybe more.
So if you haven't figured out what the root cause is by now.....it is clearly the idle surge, combined with super duper low gearing (Rubicon 4:1 T-case, big gears, HUGE engine, beefy driveline, and giant strong brakes...something has to give. This time it was the tube.
At least breaking like this at the Overland Expo is like breaking your arm at a hospital.....no better place to do it. 20 feet away from the Lance vendor site where I was camped, was a 4x4 Van conversion company, with a shop less than 3 miles away. Nothing but good comments about this local company, called U-Joint Offroad. They are not Jeep experts, but very very capable. I got a U-Haul dolly on Monday and towed it to their shop, and the owner Chris began doing some research. The main difficulty for them, is they are not equipped to align the castor between the two sides before welding. They send that out to the only guy in the area they trust to do that, but he is out a few weeks after back surgery and can't do it anytime soon, but possibly a bit later.
Here's the three options I see doing.
1) We have U-joint remove EVERYTHING from the axle, and we send it to their guy, and leave it for....a long time and we get it back a few months from now when we are (sort of) in the area on our way to Florida. It looks like the housing dude will be willing to take it on if time is not an issue. All of our parts are reused (unless the shock, shock spring, or tie rod were damaged and maybe seals etc.) but tons of labor.
2) Buy a used/junkyard/etc high pinion Dana 30 (prices are high...first glance in the area we are talking $1000-$1500, extract all my parts and reuse them, weld new perches, drill the pumpkin for the ARB etc. etc. Tons of labor, but also a jump in parts prices and additional labor.
3) Do a D44 conversion, and end up using a more or less stock pile of parts plus likely a new R&P depending on gear ratios, new driveshaft, condition of the D44 etc.) Again tons of labor, (more probably considering perches, etc. etc.) and probably a lot of cost in the conversion, and no longer having the ARB either. This is likely the biggest cost option, but might be the better long-term upgrade.
Keep in mind we are not hard-core 4x4'ers and don't expect to really need this incredible Jeep for what we plan to do with it, didn't really have the money to buy it, and don't really have the financial reserves to just spend the money and move on. We could recoup some cost by parting out or selling the D30 we have.
I expect we'll go route one. It seems the cheapest, gets us back to where we were, and we have the ability to leave it here and come back later for pickup. By having that leeway of time, we can hopefully get the other two sides of that old triangle of "get it done well, get it done quickly, get it done cheaply.....chose any two of the three." This still depends on U-joint taking their part on, and their frame/rack/align guy being willing to take it on as well. We'll likely find that out today.
Hence my, "Hey Brad, you don't happen to have a HP D30 laying around and can you bring it to Asheville?" comment. Did you sell it yet?
My question about Clemson 4x4 was both due to a possibility that if this falls through I need to go somewhere else as well as solve the actual ROOT of the problem, the programming between the PCM and the big V8 engine. If we go for option 1, I still have to drop money and get expertise to solve the programming issue. Clemson is the place that U-Joint mentioned as a possibility for solving that. They also know a writer for JP magazine and other hard-core Jeeping mags that has or had at least one or more Dodge Magnum v-8's in older TJs, so that is another source of info though not actual "work" on the issue.
Thanks for any thoughts you guys have on my options. Definitely not a part of our plans, but things happen. I really hope to get it all worked out and keep this Jeep a long long time.....but we are on a very tight budget. I intend on writing a thread regarding our recents changes and the implementation of our long long term goals we set for ourselves many years ago, but, I have Frankenwrangler to get back to life right now so this post is more important.
Best to everyone, and thanks guys. I guess we need to do some BRP sightseeing and I'm also grateful for some of the ideas shown above on things to see and do. There is clearly a ton here. If our big truck breaks down, we'll be down to bicycles and/or our feet!
BT
