I'm currently doing a LOT of homework on the Hensley and Propride and one question I've got is the tongue rating for both. My Jayco sits a 1350# on the tongue already (without LP when weighed). Add the hitch itself and full propane and I'll be a good bit over the 1400# rating. Of course reps from both companies say I'll be fine but I would to hear from 'actual owners' who are towing heavy with these. Something about spending that kind of coin and be over the ratings on day one doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy.

NC, I don't think the weight of the hitch itself factors into it's own rating. The dry hitch weight of your rig is listed as 870 lbs by Jayco...you really added a lot of weight up front. Is there any way to re-distribute weight and pack some some stuff behind the axles of the TT? Maybe store some lighter stuff under the front bed and move some heavier items to the rear?I extended the frame of our TT and added a storage box for the Honda 2000 and some other stuff:The good news is that both of these hitches are indifferent to tongue weight...in other words a heavy tongue is not needed to manage sway, the hitch uses the 4-bar linkage to keep the TT from swaying. The hitch won't allow the TT to sway regardless of how light the tongue is.There have been a few reported issues of a busted Hensley...one was from member carringb who blew his up towing a very heavy toy hauler with his van. When I say blew it up, it broke in half IIRC....here's the thread here on the forum discussing this about a year ago.My HA is only rated for 1200 lbs, they didn't certify it for a higher weight and make 1400 lb bars available till a few years after I got mine (mine is a 2002). Last time I calculated my tongue weight it was about 1200 lbs and I'm running 1200 lb bars on mine.The HA is designed with a bronze bushing in the hitch head where the spring bars insert. This bushing wears over time, and the closer to the limit you run, the faster it wears. I'm on my 3rd one right now. When it wears, the spring bar holes elongate and you have to crank the bars up more to get the same level of weight distribution. The good news is that this sacrificial bushing is easy to change and prevents damage to the hitch itself. I'm not sure if the PP has the same (or maybe a better) design.Off the top of my head I don't think that you would have issues running either hitch at your current tongue weight...but since the heavy tongue is what's causing the ride issues in the truck, I would look for ways to lighten the tongue. As I said, either hitch does not allow the TT to sway regardless of how light the tongue is.On edit, I found the thread on the wear bushings.

CampingN.C. wrote:...snip.... Of course reps from both companies say I'll be fine but I would to hear from 'actual owners' who are towing heavy with these. ....snip........Those "reps" might be related to the ones who told me that a certain trailer was "half ton towable". Anything to make a sale. Why have ratings at all?

snip"The dry hitch weight of your rig is listed as 870 lbs by Jayco...you really added a lot of weight up front. "Funny, that's the same thing Sean at ProPride said too. Jayco isn't even in the ball park with the numbers they have online. The yellow shipping/unloaded sticker is 8200#. That's 1000# over UL weight online. Over on the Jayco forum people have posted seeing published tongue weights around 1100# years ago, and nothing has changed on the floor plan at all over the years. All I have up front is some decking boards, sewer/water gear etc, can't really see changing much. When I hit the scales I was a 8500#, that's only 300 over the shipping weight sticker, very little in camper. It's just that heavy.

I towed my previous RV with a Hensley hitch. I had a platform on the rear similar to what Burbman posted. I arranged my cargo to keep my TW in the 1250-1300# area.I used 1400# bars and never had any issues.After reading CarringB post I was careful to keep my TW in check.In your case your TW is awfully heavy. I would be concerned about the hitch.If you still have the OEM hitch receiver on the truck I would be concerned about it as well.GM trucks of that era had notoriously weak hitches.In the end I would verify the rating on the trucks hitch and if it is the OEM original I would get an aftermarket hitch.I would also keep the Hensley within its 1400# rating. I don't believe the sky will fall if you exceed 1400 pounds just a bit. But I would not ignore the 14000 rating altogether.

Good point from Lantley, I just re read your original post and the 1350 doesnt include propane so you really are close or over the 1400 lb rating.If I understand the issue you are having, heavy tongue weight causes the bad ride in the truck, and offloading tongue weight via the WD hitch then makes the TT want to sway. It sounds like you need to find a way to lighten hthe tongue, then use either the HA or PP to ensure that it doesnt sway. But using the HA or PP requires that you lighten the tongue anyway to stay within the ratings of the hitch. Kind of demonstartes what I said in that other thad about sway control, not every TT is designed with the best interests of weight and balance in mind. Ideally you could install a storage box or something at the rear of the TT to offload the tongue some.

Hensley/Propride over tongue weight ratings. | Good Sam Community

62 Replies

CampingN_C_
Explorer
Jan 04, 2015
JBarca wrote:
CampingN.C. wrote:
White knuckles post
Some of you commented on this thread months ago, it also has all the full scale weights in it.
I don't have all the CAT papers handy but I do know the tongue was 1350 (no LP) and the total was 8500. Tongue at approx 16%. Six links was only transferring 200# to the front axle. I'll try to repost all the full weight list.

John, it just rides rough, very rough, you wouldn't be able to drink from a glass another words. I feel every bump.
One thing, I didn't adjust the hitch height when I went up a link, only reset the cams,would the little bit of raise cause a 'nose high' situation and create the ride issue?

Also the receiver has been replaced with a 1600/16000 B&W

Hi Again,

Sorry I had forgot your screen name, I went back to the other thread and here are your weights on the camper

NC's camper weights

According to those weights you are at 15.3% TW on the camper. OK we can check that box. You have enough TW with 1,320#.

Now to the truck. I also have a buddy with a 2500HD like yours towing his Jayco rear living camper. He has about I think 1,350 to 1,400# TW and he up his 1,200# bars to 1,500# and he changed his receiver too. I will send him a note to check this post as while his 2500HD is a few years older, his and your 2005 are still the same setup. Things started changing in 2007/2008

There is one that that sticks out, check your door sticker. I'm assuming the door sticker declares LT245/75R16 E's. Ktosv picked up on this here

You are running 265's and I know they are down from the 285's the PO had. While the 265's should not make the truck buck, they can make it shift left to right if they are on rims for a 245 tire. The thread and the tire bead do not line up right and allow the tire to wiggle.

Your last post for the other thread was you up'ed the WD and it was more responsive but the rid as rough. Again this is pointing to the truck.

After reviewing the older post and thinking about this, my latest thoughts are:

1. The tires are possibly "part" of this. Need to confrim your door sticker what GM put rim on for. 245 or 265? Sticker for 245's

2. Truck loading and the WD setup. This is also includes the WD bar size

3. The truck Tire pressure experiment may not be over yet.

4. Have confirmed your front end suspension is not worn. Yes, when it was aligned recently

Since changing tires right now is not simple will need to work on the rest and that ends up the last thing.

I'll talk on no. 2 for a bit. I have learned with heavy TW campers they can push the 3/4 ton and even 1 ton truck both left to right and up and down until the suspension is loaded right.

Look at your door sticker on the GAWR-RR, I think it is 6,000# please confrim. In your scale weights of the other post, with WD engaged you where at 4,380# on the rear axle and the truck GVW was 7,760#
GAWR-RR is 6048
GVWR is 9200

Your not complaining about pulling performance but ride and stability. (You are close to your GCWR of 16,000#) And you say the truck rides better when there is less WD, just then sway starts acting up.

Tell us what is in the truck bed when you go camping? The truck can handle more weight in the bed on the rear axle and you not on top of the GVWR either. Is your GVWR 9,200# Yes
Bed empty on last trip minus a couple bike.

If you have rear truck springs sized for 6,000#, (please confrim this) then yes the ride is better the closer the load get to that rating. Your 1,680# light. Do you normally load the truck bed with camping gear? If so this will help. Then when you apply the WD for that heavy TW, the rear is still loaded enough to ride OK.Yes, five links feels like I need more weight in the back. Most trips are light in the bed.

The 1,200# bars on a 1,320# TW is working them. If you add more bed weight they will even more be worked. Do you have the trunnion Reese hitch? you can up them to 1,500# bars. Yes, they are trunnions. One thing I haven't added is that their age is unknown. They came with my last camper and that was five years ago.
The Jayco has an under-slung ball coupler doesn't it? If you are at 5 links under tension on that setup either you have little head tilt or the 1,200# bars are really flexed. Head is tilted roughly half way.

Let me know your axle ratings and the GVWR.

Hope this helps

John
JBarca
Nomad II
Jan 04, 2015
CampingN.C. wrote:
White knuckles post
Some of you commented on this thread months ago, it also has all the full scale weights in it.
I don't have all the CAT papers handy but I do know the tongue was 1350 (no LP) and the total was 8500. Tongue at approx 16%. Six links was only transferring 200# to the front axle. I'll try to repost all the full weight list.

John, it just rides rough, very rough, you wouldn't be able to drink from a glass another words. I feel every bump.
One thing, I didn't adjust the hitch height when I went up a link, only reset the cams,would the little bit of raise cause a 'nose high' situation and create the ride issue?

Also the receiver has been replaced with a 1600/16000 B&W

Hi Again,

Sorry I had forgot your screen name, I went back to the other thread and here are your weights on the camper

NC's camper weights

According to those weights you are at 15.3% TW on the camper. OK we can check that box. You have enough TW with 1,320#.

Now to the truck. I also have a buddy with a 2500HD like yours towing his Jayco rear living camper. He has about I think 1,350 to 1,400# TW and he up his 1,200# bars to 1,500# and he changed his receiver too. I will send him a note to check this post as while his 2500HD is a few years older, his and your 2005 are still the same setup. Things started changing in 2007/2008

There is one that that sticks out, check your door sticker. I'm assuming the door sticker declares LT245/75R16 E's. Ktosv picked up on this here

You are running 265's and I know they are down from the 285's the PO had. While the 265's should not make the truck buck, they can make it shift left to right if they are on rims for a 245 tire. The thread and the tire bead do not line up right and allow the tire to wiggle.

Your last post for the other thread was you up'ed the WD and it was more responsive but the rid as rough. Again this is pointing to the truck.

After reviewing the older post and thinking about this, my latest thoughts are:

1. The tires are possibly "part" of this. Need to confrim your door sticker what GM put rim on for. 245 or 265?

2. Truck loading and the WD setup. This is also includes the WD bar size

3. The truck Tire pressure experiment may not be over yet.

4. Have confirmed your front end suspension is not worn.

Since changing tires right now is not simple will need to work on the rest and that ends up the last thing.

I'll talk on no. 2 for a bit. I have learned with heavy TW campers they can push the 3/4 ton and even 1 ton truck both left to right and up and down until the suspension is loaded right.

Look at your door sticker on the GAWR-RR, I think it is 6,000# please confrim. In your scale weights of the other post, with WD engaged you where at 4,380# on the rear axle and the truck GVW was 7,760#

Your not complaining about pulling performance but ride and stability. (You are close to your GCWR of 16,000#) And you say the truck rides better when there is less WD, just then sway starts acting up.

Tell us what is in the truck bed when you go camping? The truck can handle more weight in the bed on the rear axle and you not on top of the GVWR either. Is your GVWR 9,200#

If you have rear truck springs sized for 6,000#, (please confrim this) then yes the ride is better the closer the load get to that rating. Your 1,680# light. Do you normally load the truck bed with camping gear? If so this will help. Then when you apply the WD for that heavy TW, the rear is still loaded enough to ride OK.

The 1,200# bars on a 1,320# TW is working them. If you add more bed weight they will even more be worked. Do you have the trunnion Reese hitch? you can up them to 1,500# bars.

The Jayco has an under-slung ball coupler doesn't it? If you are at 5 links under tension on that setup either you have little head tilt or the 1,200# bars are really flexed.

Let me know your axle ratings and the GVWR.

Hope this helps

John
CampingN_C_
Explorer
Jan 03, 2015
This was the reply I got from ProPride in regards to the 1400# tongue limit.

"I know I have quite a few hitches on Jaycos so I'm not really worried about it being over the 1400# limit." :h
waynec1957
Explorer
Jan 03, 2015
CampingN.C. wrote:
I'm currently doing a LOT of homework on the Hensley and Propride and one question I've got is the tongue rating for both. My Jayco sits a 1350# on the tongue already (without LP when weighed). Add the hitch itself and full propane and I'll be a good bit over the 1400# rating.
Of course reps from both companies say I'll be fine but I would to hear from 'actual owners' who are towing heavy with these.
Something about spending that kind of coin and be over the ratings on day one doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy.

I've talked to the folks at Hensley and PP both about this issue. From what I can tell TW doesn't/won't affect how either hitch performs because neither works off friction (as far as preventing sway) like other WD hitches.

My concern, and something I can't get a real straight answer to, is would TW over the 1,400 lb limit on either hitch cause problems structurally (not performance wise) for the hitch? By that I mean, would 1,400 lbs plus TW cause the hitch or its components to fail over time?

They can't really say that it won't for liability reasons, but the impression I get is there is some number between the 1,400 lb limit and who knows what where there shouldn't be any structural issues. Whether that's 1,450 lbs or 1,800 lbs is anybody's guess.
Lantley
Nomad
Jan 03, 2015
I'll defer to John on how to properly set up the dual cam. But I'll ask a couple of basic questions. What tires are you using? What is there load rating?
Have your tried to reduce the TW by load stuff behind the axles.
For test purposes try loading heavy items in bunk house area, even if its bags of sand. Not sure if you have a Sherline tongue scale? But a scale would help you get the rig balanced before weight distribution is applied. I used a Sherline scale to keep my TW balanced. Once you find a method that works the scale is less critical.However a scale can be a vital tool when initially trying to load cargo to reduce TW.
As mentioned above you may not be totally satisfied with the dual cam but before you give up I would try all of Jbarca's tips and advice.
Lastly I do believe a premium hitch would resolve your issues,but even with a premium hitch the RV needs to be balanced with a decent TW figure.
CampingN_C_
Explorer
Jan 03, 2015
White knuckles post
Some of you commented on this thread months ago, it also has all the full scale weights in it.
I don't have all the CAT papers handy but I do know the tongue was 1350 (no LP) and the total was 8500. Tongue at approx 16%. Six links was only transferring 200# to the front axle. I'll try to repost all the full weight list.

John, it just rides rough, very rough, you wouldn't be able to drink from a glass another words. I feel every bump.
One thing, I didn't adjust the hitch height when I went up a link, only reset the cams,would the little bit of raise cause a 'nose high' situation and create the ride issue?

Also the receiver has been replaced with a 1600/16000 B&W
BurbMan
Explorer II
Jan 03, 2015
JBarca wrote:
This points to the camper maybe not balanced just right yet, truck tires being an issue and WD not set correct followed by possibly a nose high camper.

While we haven't talked specifically about levelness of the rig, I don't think nose-high is the problem. Reason I say that is because the TT tows better when the OP tightens the DC. At 6 links it tows terrible but tows better at 5 links...taking that extra link raises the nose of the TT which in turn improves towing characteristics, so therefore nose-high shouldn't be what's causing the sway.

I agree that the camper is not balanced just right, but the question is whether it's even possible to get this particular unit balanced so that it tows right. What's amazing to me is how heavy the tongue is even with all that weight of the double slide and outside kitchen behind the axles. How did Joe manage his tongue weight to keep it under 1250?

Nomad297, the OP wrote: It has a B&W 1600/16000 hitch on it, just installed it.
nomad297
Explorer
Jan 03, 2015
I think, regardless to whatever you do for a hitch, is replace your hitch receiver with one designed for the weight you have on it. Your OEM hitch cannot handle that weight.

Bruce
JBarca
Nomad II
Jan 03, 2015
Hi Camping NC,

Your camper model rang a bell. I looked it up. That double slide rear bunk camper has changed a bit over the years. I had a buddy have one, at least that model number, but it was only 34 feet long and did not yet have the outside kitchen. He was towing it with a 2005 Excursion and had to keep him self at 1,250# TW due the Excursion receiver issue. He did start with the DC, and in his case he tried it for a short while and went Hensley. The Excursion while a real good puller, it has it's only suspension needs to be upgraded and tweaked in right.

I'm not going to try and talk you out of the HA or PP, but can maybe help on the DC if that is what you want to do.

You stated your weight was 8,500# but do you have a scaled tongue weight to go with that?

Do you tow with fresh water? That camper is listed out as 86 gallons fresh water system. That is 713# of weight to keep track of where it is.

When you have a 35' 6" long camper at the weights you have, and you towing with a DC, or and Equal-I-zer etc, the entire rig has to be optimized.

Tires can make or break the rig even on a good 3/4 ton truck like you have. What brand and size tire and what air pressure front and rear do you tow with? Also what pressure do you run on the camper?

Camper towing stance, is it level, nose up or nose down and by how much?

Do you have any fender heights, truck loaded unhitched, and then hitched with WD engaged? When it rides good but trailer sways and then when trailer is better but ride bad what are those fender heights?

When I hear this,

NC wrote:
Allowing more tongue weight (6 links) truck rides fine, but trailer sways. Semi's move me a LOT.

Transferring more to the front (5 links) truck rides horrible but trailer seems better.

Truck rides better with the weight.
6 links transferred only 200# at the scale.
It's like the DC needs more WD pressure than the truck does.
One link either way posses different issues. Neither are good.

This points to the camper maybe not balanced just right yet, truck tires being an issue and WD not set correct followed by possibly a nose high camper.

On the DC or Equal-I-zer for that matter, more load on the WD bars creates higher friction. That higher friction helps hold the trailer better but the truck WD needs to be right or the truck rides bad.

If you have them, or can get them, need to know the scaled weights with the truck loaded with camping gear with and without WD engaged and just the truck to help see where you are at.

When the truck rides bad, tell us what bad means? Is the bucking front to back or is the back of the truck rocking left to right?

I'm a DC guy as the HA or the PP are not heavy rated enough for my situation. The pullrite would be my only other option and I would have one if it did not derate the rest of the non WD towing so bad. That said, my TT is just under 10K GVW with a 1,600# TW and my truck tows it well. But I too had to finds it's sweat spot.

If you want to try and optimize what you have first and see if it gets you where you want you be, be glad to help. The DC will not fix all issues in a towing rig. The trailer and the truck have to do their part too.

Hope this helps

John
PacNWChris
Explorer
Jan 03, 2015
I may be wrong (I don't think so), but regardless of what hitch you have, you will always be able to feel air movement if it's strong enough. Now, whether or not that will translate into "sway" is a question of tongue weight, trailer size, tow vehicle, etc.

You can see what we have from the signature, and after having installed the ProPride hitch, have yet to feel any sway. On our last big trip through Utah and Idaho, we were able to feel crosswinds, but not in the sense that we were being "steered" from the bed of the truck.

We have a rear kitchen (which are inherently heavy behind the axle(s) that we try to balance as well as possible, but I'm sure is not as heavy on the tongue as it should be with a standard (non-ProPropride/Hensley) WD hitch. We put our water jugs (I don't like the taste of water from the FW tank) under the bed (well forward of the axles), and haven't had any issues with the ProPride.

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Hensley/Propride over tongue weight ratings.

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