Power Tuner for Gas engines

i don't have any question that tuners make definite power improvements on deisels (speaking from experience).

my greatest interest in the tuner for the small block is the mpg gain that evey tuner manufacturer claims.

at today's fuel prices a 1 mpg improvement on daily driving could pay itself off in as little as 15,000 miles. although that is a long time, i keep my vehicles well over 100k miles. everything staying the same (more likely to go up in $) that is a fuel savings of $1,700 over the life of the vehicle.

very intriguing...

pappcam wrote:
It's all smoke and mirrors and maybe more of a placebo effect on the people that do waste money on these things. Even aftermarket air filters are a waste of money on gassers. If you feel like throwing away money go ahead and do it.

So you've bought and used these things? I'de like to know all about your experiences!

I had the hypertech max energy on my 5.3 liter chevy and it did make some difference. I had a 1/2 ton pulling a superlite 24'FW and I noticed about a MPG improvement in fuel mileage and it did shift firmer. I saw no difference in the ability to climb grades. Now running solo it seemed to have a lot more throttle response and more low end grunt which erased any chance of fuel mileage gains as I could not keep my foot out of the skinny pedal (probable all in my head). Don't expect any earth shattering results on a gas engine. As far as warranty goes I know most dealers frown heavily on them. That being said I experienced a number of factory recalls on my 6.0 PSD that was programed from its first tow and my local dealer never hesitated doing the work but would always tell me that they could see when the program was installed and uninstalled.

beemerphile1 wrote:
Only a dyno knows for sure.

Well, there you go!

See if you can get your truck on a dyno, then install the tuner and put it on the dyno again. It it doesn't help send the tuner back, or sell it to the next guy.

tplife wrote:

M GO BLUE wrote:
Chipping a new vehicle in any way automatically voids any and all warranties you may have from the vehicle manufacturer...

Ignore whoever's telling you that BS! :R
"The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))

This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of the law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle maker's brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:

No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name... (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))..."

It's the responsibility of the vehicle manufacturer (or warrantor) to prove to the satisfaction of the court that your modification caused the part failure. Your vehicle's ecm is tuned for minimal emissions, not performance, not mileage, etc. Tuning optimizes either mileage or performance, just not always both at the same time, by adjusting timing and air/fuel ratios set to provide power, but meet federal mandates to minimize emissions. If your vehicle falls within stock parameters of the tuning device, you can see performance and mileage increases. Modified engines will need a dyno-tune to precisely map their tuning device.

sorry, but MM only applies to what is needed to maintain the warranty through normal maintanance as outlined by the product mfg. E.G. oil filters, fuel filters, oil etc. it does not address modifications to the warranted item.

And BTW the quote is NOT repeat NOT the MM warranty act text. Only the second paragraph is a quote from the act. (which is pages long)

That act was passed in the 60's. This is likely an "interpretation" by a aftermarket supplier company claiming that under MM your warranty can't be voided.

What the quote isn't saying (amongst other things) is that MM clearly states that the mfg can include exclusion and conditions to the warranty that are legally valid. That is exactly what GM and ford are doing today. If you read the exclusion listed on for example the ford label near the radiator on some vehicles it clearly states addition of aftermarket tuners will void the engine and powertrain warranty. GM does similar.

So proceed with caution on tuners, and don't be suprised if at some point your vehicle gets flagged with a voided warranty in the mfg system.

It's all smoke and mirrors and maybe more of a placebo effect on the people that do waste money on these things. Even aftermarket air filters are a waste of money on gassers. If you feel like throwing away money go ahead and do it.

Only a dyno knows for sure.

beemerphile1 wrote:

dodge guy wrote:
On a gas motor a tuner doesn't add enough power to destroy anything in the power train...

Not true. I know the Chevrolet 7.1L and possibly others has a torque management system which prevents a sudden application of full power. If a tuner removes the torque management system it can and will definitely break things if run hard.

Maybe that is what some tuners are doing. Maybe they allow a more sudden application of power which makes the butt feel like there is more power when there really isn't.

I know what your saying on the torque management. But again you will not get full HP or TQ just off idle with a tuner. Once your rolling and put the throttle down you may get more instantaneous power, but again nothing that will break anything. And yes a good tuner does add power, not just make it seem more powerful!

tplife wrote:

M GO BLUE wrote:
Chipping a new vehicle in any way automatically voids any and all warranties you may have from the vehicle manufacturer...

Ignore whoever's telling you that BS! :R
"The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))

This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of the law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle maker's brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:

No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name... (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))..."

It's the responsibility of the vehicle manufacturer (or warrantor) to prove to the satisfaction of the court that your modification caused the part failure. Your vehicle's ecm is tuned for minimal emissions, not performance, not mileage, etc. Tuning optimizes either mileage or performance, just not always both at the same time, by adjusting timing and air/fuel ratios set to provide power, but meet federal mandates to minimize emissions. If your vehicle falls within stock parameters of the tuning device, you can see performance and mileage increases. Modified engines will need a dyno-tune to precisely map their tuning device.

LOL, you're silly. :R

I'm going to put 14 to 1 pistons in my engine right now, because the way "you" read MM it's ok. :R

M GO BLUE wrote:
Chipping a new vehicle in any way automatically voids any and all warranties you may have from the vehicle manufacturer...

Ignore whoever's telling you that BS! :R
"The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))

This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of the law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle maker's brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:

No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name... (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))..."

It's the responsibility of the vehicle manufacturer (or warrantor) to prove to the satisfaction of the court that your modification caused the part failure. Your vehicle's ecm is tuned for minimal emissions, not performance, not mileage, etc. Tuning optimizes either mileage or performance, just not always both at the same time, by adjusting timing and air/fuel ratios set to provide power, but meet federal mandates to minimize emissions. If your vehicle falls within stock parameters of the tuning device, you can see performance and mileage increases. Modified engines will need a dyno-tune to precisely map their tuning device.