To "delete" or not to "delete"

srt20 wrote:


I am only looking to learn something here.

I thought that the in cylinder egr (3rd injection event) actually raised in cylinder temps due to more fuel being burned. This is why EGTs on 04.5-07 is higher than engines without the 3rd injection event.

Is this incorrect?
Thanks

P.s. I am only referring to Cummins engines.

Higher temperatures actually contribute to NOx formation, along with areas that can act as a heat island within the combustion chamber. Lots of science goes into NOx formation, that's why combustion chamber geometries (the piston bowl itself and ring land sizes and location, etc) are continually tweaked with each iteration.

And just for reference, here's how diesel emissions regulation evolved over the years. A very dramatic decrease since 1994. This is why even if you're deleted and getting 5 mpg better (which you won't against a 2010+ DEF equipped truck), you are still emitting at minimum 12.5x more NOx or worse depending on your tune (and I'm assuming that you're only as bad off as 2004 emissions at this point, but I bet most tuners are around the 1998 or 1994 emissions levels). So in order to match the NOx output of a truck with emissions, you would need to achieve a fuel burn rate equivalent to being 12.5 times better than the emissions truck. Not going to happen. You would need 10 time better mpg than the emissions equipped truck to spew out the same particulate matter. The only thing you improve when you delete is your carbon footprint because you are burning less fuel.

ShinerBock wrote:

DirtyOil wrote:


looks like you knew well enough, that a Catalytic converter on a "pre" DEF diesel engine was pretty much useless at reducing N0x.

The "catalytic converter" on a diesel that you are referring to is the "two way" or DOC(Diesel Oxidation Catalyst). The DOC is not and does not do the same function as the SCR(Selective Catalytic Reduction) system that requires DEF or the NAC(NOx Adsorption Catalyst) that removes NOx. The DOC's job is to reduce carbon monoxide and hydrocarbon emissions and are still being utilised on diesels today. So yes, the "catalyst" on the pre DEF engine was useless at reducing NOx since that was not it's job. It is the EGR (which you removed your in cylinder EGR) that has the job of reducing NOx by lowering combustion temps.

You are starting to sound like 6.6 Oilburner in making assumptions of how you think these systems operate.

I am only looking to learn something here.

I thought that the in cylinder egr (3rd injection event) actually raised in cylinder temps due to more fuel being burned. This is why EGTs on 04.5-07 is higher than engines without the 3rd injection event.

Is this incorrect?
Thanks

P.s. I am only referring to Cummins engines.

My gas mower doesn't put out any smog.

But it does emit a lot of stuff that contributes to smog formation...

DirtyOil wrote:

I got a thousand bucks that say's my BMW will put out less smog than your lawn mower. Anybody want to try and take my money?

I'll put up $10,000 that my mower will put out less then your Beamer...

Lemme guess. Hand or electric mower?

DirtyOil wrote:


looks like you knew well enough, that a Catalytic converter on a "pre" DEF diesel engine was pretty much useless at reducing N0x.

The "catalytic converter" on a diesel that you are referring to is the "two way" or DOC(Diesel Oxidation Catalyst). The DOC is not and does not do the same function as the SCR(Selective Catalytic Reduction) system that requires DEF or the NAC(NOx Adsorption Catalyst) that removes NOx. The DOC's job is to reduce carbon monoxide and hydrocarbon emissions and are still being utilised on diesels today. So yes, the "catalyst" on the pre DEF engine was useless at reducing NOx since that was not it's job. It is the EGR (which you removed your in cylinder EGR) that has the job of reducing NOx by lowering combustion temps.

You are starting to sound like 6.6 Oilburner in making assumptions of how you think these systems operate.

I got a thousand bucks that say's my BMW will put out less smog than your lawn mower. Anybody want to try and take my money?

I'll put up $10,000 that my mower will put out less then your Beamer...

What if everyone cut off their catalytic converter and deleted their EGR on their gas engine?

looks like you knew well enough, that a Catalytic converter on a "pre" DEF diesel engine was pretty much useless at reducing N0x.

So, how does burning less fuel create more smog?

Oh sweet Gesus. I will try one more time.

Lets take a 1969 Benz diesel and a 2015 Ram with a Cummins in it.

The Benz will get around 30 to 35 MPG.
The Ram will get around 18 to 20 MPG.

Put both on a smog machine and see who is going to win the emissions contest. It won't even be close.

When I put my BMW on the smog machine it put out 0 HC's!!!! ZERO!!! Yes, I said 000.0000000000 hydrocarbons!!

A great fact for those that want to learn. Don't believe it? Bring your lawn mower to my house and I will bring my 2006 BMW to a friend of mines smog shop. I got a thousand bucks that say's my BMW will put out less smog than your lawn mower. Anybody want to try and take my money? :B

DirtyOil wrote:

So, how does burning less fuel create more smog?:R

If you look at it in terms of NOX emissions per mile instead of miles per gallon you'd understand.

DirtyOil wrote:



I should have used the American gallon.. which is about 17% smaller so my mileage "hand calculated" was 22.47 miles per US gal... not bad for a 2005 3500 CC CTD with 6" lift Road armor bumpers front and back and 10 X 20" wheels with 35" tires...

Yeah, and I believe that like I believed Clinton didn't have sex with Lewinski. Funny that we couldn't even replicate that and Cummins along with anyone else in the Cumins forums that admit to deleting their trucks.

DirtyOil wrote:
So, how does burning less fuel create more smog?:R

Like Turtle N peeps and myself said multiple times before. Please go back and read.

DirtyOil wrote:
blt2ski.... need to close this topic... its gotten stupid enough. :B

Then quit posting in it. Simple enough.