"Upgrading" from popup to TT and need info on TT culture.
Hi All,
I have some questions about the travel trailer scene, but also recommendations on 21' to 23' TT or possibly Toy hauler models. I apologize in advance, this is a tad long...
A bit of history. I was raised in Jackson Wyoming, been camping , fishing, etc. all my life. I currently have a 2000 Jayco Popup with an auto loading rack for my 12' aluminum boat. I have not really been a campground guy, and historically have always dry camped in remote areas. My popup is setup with Solar, so I am only limited really by propane, though I only use my stove, furnace, fridge and lights. Anyway, I have slept on the ground more than enough to warrant a camper, so this coupled with off road capability was the reason for my popup over a TT. When I purchased it, I had a lift put on it and put on larger tires for better clearance, but also flotation in sand, mud, and a bit tougher for the rocks I get in my current state of AZ.
Fast forward 17 years, and I am now in my late 40's with a bad shoulder and looking to simplify a bit. I also have two children just starting to break into the teenage years. As time goes on, the popup becomes more of a chore, actually reducing my time in the field per the time it takes to set it up since I won't do overnighters anymore. Ever since I designed the autoloader for my boat, it has been better, but still takes 2-3 hours to set up including moving/packing all the necessities. Either way, I am considering "upgrading" to a TT. I say "upgrade" loosely as while I do recognize it is a leap in comfort and simplicity, it will also detract from my ability to hit the remote campsites of the past, and limit me to campgrounds, or modestly maintained roadways where again, I really was never satisfied with traffic close by. Putting something this large on not only blocks the ability to hit primitive roads, it also is less navigable, meaning my agility with the ability to get to tight areas on said primitive roads, including off canter terrain, trees, mud, etc.
I have casually looked a bit and know I do not want anything longer than a 23 model (27'), but potentially would like to be in the 21 range. I am looking for a decent queen bed for me and the wife. I am not looking for canvas, and part of the "comfort" for me, is that I don't want to break apart a dinette for the kids to sleep; which is why I like the "bunk" style configuration that will also afford a little real world storage. Additionally, I am ready for water allowing both shower and other needs including black water if ya know what I'm saying... While there would be times I hit full hookups, mainly for traveling on vacation, most of my usage would still be dry camping. In that regard, I already have 200w solar panels, and will immediately upgrade the batteries to get me more AMP hours onsite. In short, I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by limiting myself to formal campgrounds with asphalt, I do enjoy the prospect of the aided comforts. Rain also tends to get in the way, causing extra work especially when closing it up since you have to take it home and open it back up to dry it out.
So, I will be testing this a bit in renting a Jayco Jay Flight 23MBH which I believe would be my limit in terms of length at just over 27'. I will be taking a trip to Yellowstone and Jackson, which has already presented some issues. For Yellowstone, I want to stay in the park and treat this as a "hotel" so doing the full hookup thing. I searching campgrounds however, I find much is booked over 6 months in advance and $50-$75 a night. Perusing reviews of many campgrounds, I find the MANY RV'rs complain about the site being off level, rutted roads "in the campground", which to me, even in remote campgrounds in AZ, I wouldn't expect too many issues for a modest size TT. Maybe an RV. That said, I find it interesting that the culture of many appears to use these in a very formal setting, which I am just not into camping on top of others. I know doing this will limit me as to my true outback type camping, but with my kids getting older in a hurry, I need less excuses to get out without forcing me to take time off. In other words, weekends. There is much forest service land here, so I do have options. I also have a ski boat, so I have considered putting said boat in storage at the lake, and making quick trips while eliminating the hotel...
I have a Tundra with 9500lb towing, so that is not a concern for me in terms of the trailers I am looking at, though lighter is always better. As for the trailer, a 21-23 model is the most I would want to do, and if I get a TT, I don't see getting below an 18 model as it seems for just a few feet, you get much more without re configuring it all the time. Again, that comfort thing I seek of just pulling it up, and enjoying...
Anyway, with my points above, and more directly the complaints I see about many RV'rs, or shall I say the ones who write reviews on the campgrounds, I am wondering if the standard with these things is to really just use them mostly in campgrounds and or park them along well maintained dirt roads? Again, I want the option to go full hookup, but will mostly do dry camping and at some point based on how well my solar works, may get a generator as well. I just don't want to make the mistake of limiting myself to pulling off the side of a busy road, or using a formal campground. I have to be able to get in the middle of nowhere, otherwise this won't be for me. As indicated, I will be testing this with a rented TT, so that should give me a good feel of what I can and can't do...
Finally, a couple models I was looking at was the Jayco Jay Flight 23MBH and the Jayco Jay Feather 23BHM. Floor plans look almost identical and I love the Murphy bed concept and the large slide out really seems to give you incredible space for a smaller footprint. The bench style dinette in my popup is limiting and I do tire of the smaller size and do like the U shape. Does anyone know the difference in these two models? Another concern is I have my 12' aluminum to deal with, so may consider a Toy hauler especially given the added structure/strength, but I have not really seen anything I like as much as these TT's. Maybe an autoloader on my Tundra is in the future... For this reason I hate to give up my popup as the boat loader is just slick there. Either way, any recommendations or info on my concerns would be great.
Sorry again for the length, but I thank you all for any wisdom you may be able to impart.
I have some questions about the travel trailer scene, but also recommendations on 21' to 23' TT or possibly Toy hauler models. I apologize in advance, this is a tad long...
A bit of history. I was raised in Jackson Wyoming, been camping , fishing, etc. all my life. I currently have a 2000 Jayco Popup with an auto loading rack for my 12' aluminum boat. I have not really been a campground guy, and historically have always dry camped in remote areas. My popup is setup with Solar, so I am only limited really by propane, though I only use my stove, furnace, fridge and lights. Anyway, I have slept on the ground more than enough to warrant a camper, so this coupled with off road capability was the reason for my popup over a TT. When I purchased it, I had a lift put on it and put on larger tires for better clearance, but also flotation in sand, mud, and a bit tougher for the rocks I get in my current state of AZ.
Fast forward 17 years, and I am now in my late 40's with a bad shoulder and looking to simplify a bit. I also have two children just starting to break into the teenage years. As time goes on, the popup becomes more of a chore, actually reducing my time in the field per the time it takes to set it up since I won't do overnighters anymore. Ever since I designed the autoloader for my boat, it has been better, but still takes 2-3 hours to set up including moving/packing all the necessities. Either way, I am considering "upgrading" to a TT. I say "upgrade" loosely as while I do recognize it is a leap in comfort and simplicity, it will also detract from my ability to hit the remote campsites of the past, and limit me to campgrounds, or modestly maintained roadways where again, I really was never satisfied with traffic close by. Putting something this large on not only blocks the ability to hit primitive roads, it also is less navigable, meaning my agility with the ability to get to tight areas on said primitive roads, including off canter terrain, trees, mud, etc.
I have casually looked a bit and know I do not want anything longer than a 23 model (27'), but potentially would like to be in the 21 range. I am looking for a decent queen bed for me and the wife. I am not looking for canvas, and part of the "comfort" for me, is that I don't want to break apart a dinette for the kids to sleep; which is why I like the "bunk" style configuration that will also afford a little real world storage. Additionally, I am ready for water allowing both shower and other needs including black water if ya know what I'm saying... While there would be times I hit full hookups, mainly for traveling on vacation, most of my usage would still be dry camping. In that regard, I already have 200w solar panels, and will immediately upgrade the batteries to get me more AMP hours onsite. In short, I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by limiting myself to formal campgrounds with asphalt, I do enjoy the prospect of the aided comforts. Rain also tends to get in the way, causing extra work especially when closing it up since you have to take it home and open it back up to dry it out.
So, I will be testing this a bit in renting a Jayco Jay Flight 23MBH which I believe would be my limit in terms of length at just over 27'. I will be taking a trip to Yellowstone and Jackson, which has already presented some issues. For Yellowstone, I want to stay in the park and treat this as a "hotel" so doing the full hookup thing. I searching campgrounds however, I find much is booked over 6 months in advance and $50-$75 a night. Perusing reviews of many campgrounds, I find the MANY RV'rs complain about the site being off level, rutted roads "in the campground", which to me, even in remote campgrounds in AZ, I wouldn't expect too many issues for a modest size TT. Maybe an RV. That said, I find it interesting that the culture of many appears to use these in a very formal setting, which I am just not into camping on top of others. I know doing this will limit me as to my true outback type camping, but with my kids getting older in a hurry, I need less excuses to get out without forcing me to take time off. In other words, weekends. There is much forest service land here, so I do have options. I also have a ski boat, so I have considered putting said boat in storage at the lake, and making quick trips while eliminating the hotel...
I have a Tundra with 9500lb towing, so that is not a concern for me in terms of the trailers I am looking at, though lighter is always better. As for the trailer, a 21-23 model is the most I would want to do, and if I get a TT, I don't see getting below an 18 model as it seems for just a few feet, you get much more without re configuring it all the time. Again, that comfort thing I seek of just pulling it up, and enjoying...
Anyway, with my points above, and more directly the complaints I see about many RV'rs, or shall I say the ones who write reviews on the campgrounds, I am wondering if the standard with these things is to really just use them mostly in campgrounds and or park them along well maintained dirt roads? Again, I want the option to go full hookup, but will mostly do dry camping and at some point based on how well my solar works, may get a generator as well. I just don't want to make the mistake of limiting myself to pulling off the side of a busy road, or using a formal campground. I have to be able to get in the middle of nowhere, otherwise this won't be for me. As indicated, I will be testing this with a rented TT, so that should give me a good feel of what I can and can't do...
Finally, a couple models I was looking at was the Jayco Jay Flight 23MBH and the Jayco Jay Feather 23BHM. Floor plans look almost identical and I love the Murphy bed concept and the large slide out really seems to give you incredible space for a smaller footprint. The bench style dinette in my popup is limiting and I do tire of the smaller size and do like the U shape. Does anyone know the difference in these two models? Another concern is I have my 12' aluminum to deal with, so may consider a Toy hauler especially given the added structure/strength, but I have not really seen anything I like as much as these TT's. Maybe an autoloader on my Tundra is in the future... For this reason I hate to give up my popup as the boat loader is just slick there. Either way, any recommendations or info on my concerns would be great.
Sorry again for the length, but I thank you all for any wisdom you may be able to impart.
