VW Traton has made a bid for Navistar

Freightliner sells more trucks because fleets buy them for the low price. The poor driver suffers a cheaply built truck, but who cares. I know, I drove one of the cheap things for a year before I retired.

ACZL wrote:

Ford's 6.0 PSD got a lousy rap, but look at how many they sold as well.

The 6.0L PSD and 6.2L diesel, bothe designed and manufactured by Navistar, got the reputation they deserved ! Ford bought back THOUSANDS of F250 and F350 in those years and then spent millions giving dealers unlimited funds to "make them right" (short of replacing the block and heads). Once they were running right, they were pretty good.

Head gasket or EGR cooler replacement was/is $,$$$ partially because you have to pull the cab but removing everything off the top of the engine is time consuming.

ACZL wrote:
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In regards to Daimler/Freightliner, I cannot say they are building the cheapest trucks as all the big semi companies are suffering from the same thing as the big 3 pick-up companies......DEF systems. Have spoken to many and that's the biggest gripe. Reason you may hear/see more Freightliners w/ problems is cuz you see the most of them on the road. Many years ago. International was #1 in pretty much all markets. Freightliner came along with a goal to knock IH off it's #1 perch in same categories. Ford's 6.0 PSD got a lousy rap, but look at how many they sold as well. So while you may see more in way of Freightliner's broke down, they like the RV industry, get/use same vendors for products. and most if not all breakdowns are DEF related.

Most breakdowns are not DEF/SCR related in the class 7-8 truck industry. Most are sensor(NOx, O2, and so on) related which in turn may cause the overuse of the DEF/SCR system. EGR system failures are also high on the list.

However, in terms of being a cheap truck. The reason why Freightliner's are cheap trucks and have very low resale value is because everything around the engine and drivetrain will generally fall apart due to its lower quality materials and poor design in order the keep costs low. You are also limited on how you can spec them because most German manufacturers believe that they make the best product possible and there is no need to improve on what they offer you so you are limited in customization that you can get with other trucks like Peterbilt's and Kenworth's. And I am saying this based on my experience in dealing and negotiating with many German companies such as Bosch, VW, and Continental.

We've had 2 VW's in past 7 years. 1st one was a a Passat diesel and 2nd is another Passat 4 cyl turbo. Loved the diesel and too bad it was part of VW's scandal, but I really tip my hat to whoever developed the software to allow it to confuse emissions tests. That being said, was it right, no, but still have to hand it to someone. That car got great MPG's, torquey and no problems. That was until 3 months before VW bought it back. It developed a water leak and I never bothered to get it fixed knowing VW was buying it. Now have their 4 cal turbo and while not as torquey as the diesel, does get good MPG's and roomy.

In regards to Daimler/Freightliner, I cannot say they are building the cheapest trucks as all the big semi companies are suffering from the same thing as the big 3 pick-up companies......DEF systems. Have spoken to many and that's the biggest gripe. Reason you may hear/see more Freightliners w/ problems is cuz you see the most of them on the road. Many years ago. International was #1 in pretty much all markets. Freightliner came along with a goal to knock IH off it's #1 perch in same categories. Ford's 6.0 PSD got a lousy rap, but look at how many they sold as well. So while you may see more in way of Freightliner's broke down, they like the RV industry, get/use same vendors for products. and most if not all breakdowns are DEF related.

Yes IH has had a lousy past 10-15 years or so, partly their fault, partly others. It's the others that took advantage and ran w/ it and don't see how they can be to blame. Personally, I wouldn't rush to buy/drive a IH truck, but if that's what my company chooses to buy, then that's what I have to drive. How many of us have said we wouldn't but a Ram, Ford or GM cuz of either current problems or past history? Yet others continue to do so. Luck of the draw. Harley-Davidson, tho a US bike, are they better than bikes from across the pond? Paying for a name./ Same can be said w/ John Deere. Pick your poison.

Ductape wrote:
Interesting. I don’t know that will be welcome news considering Volkswagen’s reputation for unreliability in the US.

Of course Diamler is no better, yet Freightliner has taken the lion’s share of the market, so what do I know? Price sells more than any other consideration I suppose.

Yeah, my company have been dealing with VW's people at Navistar for a few years now since they purchased 16% of the company. VW's lack of quality in order to attain the cheapest product possible is becoming apparent just as Daimler/Freightliner has been doing for years. It has worked for them because they have had the strongest market share yet the lowest resale values of any truck by far because those who buy them only look at up front costs and not long term value. It is just a basic cheap truck for the masses just like VW cars. Goes to show that just because you sell more of something does not mean it is the best.

My inside guys at Navistar said this was suppose to happen years from now, but with Navistar loosing a several lawsuits resulting in hundreds of millions of dollars in loses in the past few months, their value dipped low enough for it to happen now.

Interesting. I don’t know that will be welcome news considering Volkswagen’s reputation for unreliability in the US.

Of course Diamler is no better, yet Freightliner has taken the lion’s share of the market, so what do I know? Price sells more than any other consideration I suppose.