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Viperpoker's avatar
Viperpoker
Explorer
Mar 16, 2018

What is the weak link for Chevy max tow ratings?

The max tow ratings for a F350 Ford are about 32,000. For a Ram 3500 they are about 31,000. For a Silverado 3500,they are about 23,000. That is 4.5 tons less than a Ford and 4 tons less than a Ram. What is causing such a low rating? Is it engine, transmission, differential, frame, brakes, suspension? Or a combination of some of those? I have a 42 foot fifth wheel, thinking about a 44 foot toy hauler that would be heavily loaded, and looking to get a new truck, and Chevy is not even an option. Just trying to understand what is causing them to be so far behind. Have no brand loyalty, have owned all three in the past, just looking for most capability at best price.
Tow Vehicles

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  • ShinerBock's avatar
    ShinerBock
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    troubledwaters wrote:
    The other side of the coin is I'm never going to tow up the Davis Dam grade in 100° heat. So if it can do that at 35 mph, it should be just fine at 65 mph anywhere I'm going.


    Not necessarily. The J2807 test at Davis Dam peaks out at just 3,500 ft above elevation at the very end. If you are towing above 5,000 ft, then you have lost a lot more engine power especially if your truck is naturally aspirated which looses about 3% engine power per 1,000 ft versus 1.5% for forced induction engines. The Ike Gauntlet for example starts at 8,000 ft and ends at 11,000 ft so you would probably be going a lot slower than 35 mph on the Ike if all you can do at Davis Dam is 35 mph towing the same amount.

    However, why is having such a high tow rating (and only doing 35 mph to get that rating) so important? What would you rather be able to say, my truck can tow its rated 20k at a minimum of 55 mph or my truck can tow its rated 30k at a minimum of 35 mph? Why is lowering the standards just so you can post a higher tow rating number so important? That is like making a test easier just so you can get a better score like they do with many kids these days.
  • 4x4ord's avatar
    4x4ord
    Explorer III
    Mar 16, 2018
    ShinerBock wrote:
    Because GM is not in a "best in class" pissing match like Ram and Ford are and I commend them for it. Just because your truck can tow 30k at the minimum 35 mph using J2807 doesn't mean that is what you have to rate your truck for. Using a higher minimum speed limit like 55 mph will make your tow rating lower than the J2807 standard, but it is a more reasonable speed at which most would prefer to tow and many will respect that. It is only the fan boys that are concerned with "best in class" and care about the highest tow ratings possible even though they themselves would never tow that much. This is coming from a Ram owner who also prefers a Ford over GM.


    When you consider Class 8 trucks with under 600 HP haul 140,000 lbs through mountain passes all day long year after year, the 40,000 lbs GCWR for a 1 ton dually doesn't seem out of line to me. I think GM recognizes that the small market that exists for trucks that are used for tough work is not worth going after. Even towing the heaviest RVs down the highway is a walk in the park compared to a pick up used for off road work.
  • Viperpoker's avatar
    Viperpoker
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    ShinerBock wrote:
    Because GM is not in a "best in class" pissing match like Ram and Ford are and I commend them for it. Just because your truck can tow 30k at the minimum 35 mph using J2807 doesn't mean that is what you have to rate your truck for. Using a higher minimum speed limit like 55 mph will make your tow rating lower than the J2807 standard, but it is a more reasonable speed at which most would prefer to tow and many will respect that. It is only the fan boys that are concerned with "best in class" and care about the highest tow ratings possible even though they themselves would never tow that much. This is coming from a Ram owner who also prefers a Ford over GM.



    GM uses the highest tie ratings for all of their other ratings. their gas trucks, 1500’s, 2500’s and srw 3500’s are all right there with ford and ram. doesn’t make sense that they would only choose to under rate their heaviest package, or that they have higher standards. i have owned 5 chevy trucks, one ford and one ram. not trying to start a pissing match, just trying to figure out why they are rated so much lower. they used to be as high as the other two.

    iI would rather be using 70% of my trucks ability than 95%. if two silverados were side by side snd were the same price, and one was rated to tow 9,000 lbs more than the other i would choose the more capable truck.

    i have been looking at some of these comparison tests, and they are sort of rigged. they are towing a lad of about 22,000. haven’t seen a test towing 31,000 lbs because only two of th trucks could compete. by that logic have a test towing 5000 lbs. most half tons trucks would win a drag race against a dually, and ride better. that doesn’t make them a better towing machine.

    i am really just trying to determine what is the limiting factor on the silverado. not saying one is better than the other, don’t care.
  • Groover's avatar
    Groover
    Explorer II
    Mar 16, 2018
    I have never seen a pickup builder discuss what the week link is but the last time I checked Allison does only rate the transmission for 300hp and 30,000lbs. I know that is the week link on my motorhome. I like to think that Allison is very conservative but then again I can't convince myself to test that theory. I hate that I have a rig built on a Freightliner chassis with commercial truck underpinnings hamstrung by an underrated transmission.
  • nevadanick's avatar
    nevadanick
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    My guess would be the transmission. I had a DP motorhome with an Allison 2500 which is basically a 1000 and its grcwr was low because of it. I towed heavy anyway and the trans was never an issue.
  • troubledwaters's avatar
    troubledwaters
    Nomad
    Mar 16, 2018
    ShinerBock wrote:
    Because GM is not in a "best in class" pissing match like Ram and Ford are and I commend them for it. Just because your truck can tow 30k at the minimum 35 mph using J2807 doesn't mean that is what you have to rate your truck for. Using a higher minimum speed limit like 55 mph will make your tow rating lower than the J2807 standard, but it is a more reasonable speed at which most would prefer to tow and many will respect that. It is only the fan boys that are concerned with "best in class" and care about the highest tow ratings possible even though they themselves would never tow that much. This is coming from a Ram owner who also prefers a Ford over GM.
    The other side of the coin is I'm never going to tow up the Davis Dam grade in 100° heat. So if it can do that at 35 mph, it should be just fine at 65 mph anywhere I'm going.
  • ShinerBock's avatar
    ShinerBock
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    Because GM is not in a "best in class" pissing match like Ram and Ford are and I commend them for it. Just because your truck can tow 30k at the minimum 35 mph using J2807 doesn't mean that is what you have to rate your truck for. Using a higher minimum speed limit like 55 mph will make your tow rating lower than the J2807 standard, but it is a more reasonable speed at which most would prefer to tow and many will respect that. It is only the fan boys that are concerned with "best in class" and care about the highest tow ratings possible even though they themselves would never tow that much. This is coming from a Ram owner who also prefers a Ford over GM.
  • Huntindog's avatar
    Huntindog
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    Viperpoker wrote:
    i believe all three use the same ratings system now.

    The new standard lays out minimum performance standards for acceleration, braking and handling. There are parking brake tests and grade-launch standards. The trailers used to conduct all such tests are spelled out specifically, and they must be ballasted and connected in a specific way.

    And J2807 sets a minimum speed for the truck-trailer combination when climbing a specific mountain grade — the so-called "Davis Dam" grade that climbs eastward out of the Colorado River valley at Laughlin, Nevada. Cooling systems must bear the strain of the 11-mile trip when the outside temperature is at least 100 degrees and the air-conditioner is set to full blast.
    Minimum is the key word. GM has stated that they rate their trucks to the performance level that their customers have come to expect. That happens to be a higher level than the j standard. This can be seen in the many tests where GM smokes the competition at their rating.
    What are you getting that exceeds GMs rating?
    I have been looking at big THs as well, and haven’t seen any that a GM could not tow.
  • Viperpoker's avatar
    Viperpoker
    Explorer
    Mar 16, 2018
    i believe all three use the same ratings system now.

    The new standard lays out minimum performance standards for acceleration, braking and handling. There are parking brake tests and grade-launch standards. The trailers used to conduct all such tests are spelled out specifically, and they must be ballasted and connected in a specific way.

    And J2807 sets a minimum speed for the truck-trailer combination when climbing a specific mountain grade — the so-called "Davis Dam" grade that climbs eastward out of the Colorado River valley at Laughlin, Nevada. Cooling systems must bear the strain of the 11-mile trip when the outside temperature is at least 100 degrees and the air-conditioner is set to full blast.

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