People have very different ideas of what the terms "Adventure" and "Difficult" and "Bad Road" or "Good Road" means.This is why I feel some of the questions I see on this forum (R&R) are really futile. Mostly because The questioner has no idea of what the person who is answering considers the above terms to mean. And vice-versa.Therefore I offer this short video of an overland truck in Central Asia, which is really quite amazing but not unusual for some parts of the world, for folks to consider when asking their questions. Watch ALL of it it's very entertaining driving.Click Here Watch ThisThe road you see in this video is a road I consider to be Adventurous and a bit difficult. But I'd drive it in a heartbeat (not with my 30ft trailer) And I have driven similar roads in different parts of the world.Therefore when I answer your question about "How is that road between Smithville and Johnson gulch?" remember I have a different point of view about what constitutes a truly "Bad" road. This is why, particularly on this Forum, it's important to make your questions as specific as possible and give some idea of how comfortable you are driving certain roads. And for the responders it's equally important to state your prejudices and what you consider to be a challenge.I think this would limit the responses to more helpful detail and not so much of the..."Why dont you just read the map?" sort of answers as we saw in a recent topic that is now closed. On a personal note: It has been a dream of mine to do basically the same trip you see in the video by motorcycle. I'll have to hurry to get it in before I turn 70.

Since good and bad require a moral judgement of the road. I guess I agree that no road is good or bad, but a road can be difficult to drive on; for some people, in some vehicles, on some days, in certain weather, under certain conditions. I am sure every post and respond writer knows that it is all IMHO when it comes to roads and most other subjects on the forum. IMHO :D

Kind of like the weather. Weather that gets head line front page back east doesn't get any mention in N & S Dakota, Montana, Idaho & Wyoming because it happens all the time. Tourists think mountain grade in the west are steep & bad in the summer. We drive those same roads in the winter with snow and ice.

That ' (not with my 30ft trailer)' is key. Most posters, when asking about a route, are planning to drive it their trailer or RV. They aren't asking whether the road is difficult in their Wrangler toad. They want to know whether to drive it with the 40ft RV towing the Wrangler.Often, though not always, OP mention the size of their RV, or its in their sig. They may also mention personal difficulties, like a passenger who gets vertigo when looking over the road's edge from the elevated position in WyoTraveler's Monarch.

I'm presuming your initial post is facetious. Certainly every road is rated by the driving skill and experience of the responder. When I respond to a threat and say NO don't drive there in a motorhome, eg" Big Sur highway 1 or the Million Dollar Highway 550, I am responding from experience. Some thrill seeking experienced full time big rig driver might find these roads totally acceptable. Me, not so much.

My guide is whether the road is paved or not. I figure if they can get paving equipment over it I can get my rig over it. Has not failed me yet.

Adventure and Difficult Roads - Way over used terms

NMDriver
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
Since good and bad require a moral judgement of the road. I guess I agree that no road is good or bad, but a road can be difficult to drive on; for some people, in some vehicles, on some days, in certain weather, under certain conditions.

I am sure every post and respond writer knows that it is all IMHO when it comes to roads and most other subjects on the forum.

IMHO :D
WyoTraveler
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
Kind of like the weather. Weather that gets head line front page back east doesn't get any mention in N & S Dakota, Montana, Idaho & Wyoming because it happens all the time. Tourists think mountain grade in the west are steep & bad in the summer. We drive those same roads in the winter with snow and ice.
paulj
Explorer II
Feb 04, 2015
That ' (not with my 30ft trailer)' is key. Most posters, when asking about a route, are planning to drive it their trailer or RV. They aren't asking whether the road is difficult in their Wrangler toad. They want to know whether to drive it with the 40ft RV towing the Wrangler.

Often, though not always, OP mention the size of their RV, or its in their sig. They may also mention personal difficulties, like a passenger who gets vertigo when looking over the road's edge from the elevated position in WyoTraveler's Monarch.
kalynzoo
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
I'm presuming your initial post is facetious. Certainly every road is rated by the driving skill and experience of the responder. When I respond to a threat and say NO don't drive there in a motorhome, eg" Big Sur highway 1 or the Million Dollar Highway 550, I am responding from experience. Some thrill seeking experienced full time big rig driver might find these roads totally acceptable. Me, not so much.
Tinyandthegang
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
My guide is whether the road is paved or not. I figure if they can get paving equipment over it I can get my rig over it. Has not failed me yet.
Crowe
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
This is why I feel some of the questions I see on this forum (R&R) are really futile

Really? We have the grammar police, the "the topic is too vague" police, criticisms because people don't do a search before they ask a question, someone who not only thinks he can define what a "bad" road is for everyone but believes asking a question about a road is a waste of time and those that tell us if we buy a dog other than a rescue we are evil. WHAT ARE ALL OF YOU ON HERE FOR THEN? It's a place to ask questions, get information, share stories and interests, and to make friends, not constantly criticize and whine. Is cabin fever setting and making everyone cranky? Lighten up people. If you don't want to answer a question or the title of the post is too vague for your liking, save yourself the stress and don't respond/don't click. It's that easy.
4X4Dodger
Explorer II
Feb 04, 2015
kalynzoo wrote:
I'm presuming your initial post is facetious. Certainly every road is rated by the driving skill and experience of the responder. When I respond to a threat and say NO don't drive there in a motorhome, eg" Big Sur highway 1 or the Million Dollar Highway 550, I am responding from experience. Some thrill seeking experienced full time big rig driver might find these roads totally acceptable. Me, not so much.

No I was being serious. If you viewed the video, which I hope you did, it would make my point a bit clearer. I for one WOULD drive Big Sur with your motorhome and even my trailer. And this is precisely my point. My view of what is challenging or doable may be very different from some others. What I feel comfortable driving is very very different from most I would guess. This is why I put the video there. Having said that if there is a Restriction put on the road by authorities I dont violate that. If however it is an "Advisory" I usually go.

About three minutes into the video starts some mountain roads that are truly challenging and driven very well by the guy in the MAN Truck/Camper which is a very Large vehicle.

I just fear that if we are not careful in our responses we may be scaring people away from great drives unnecessarily. Thats why I think it better to admit to your particular prejudices when answering. But also that someone like me who considers the roads on the video great fun...I must be careful to not do the opposite.
BillMFl
Explorer
Feb 04, 2015
I agree that a lot depends on the individual. For example, there isn't an Interstate Hwy that I have driven on (and I've traveled all over the lower 48) that an average driver with a fairly new RV of any type that is in good operating condition (and probably even most older or under powered) that can't be traveled on relatively easily. And yet there are plenty of folks who are scared to death crossing the Rockies and even the Blue Ridge in the east. So I don't look down on folks who ask for advice, especially concerning non Interstate routes that can be much more challenging for more timid folks. Folks on here range from highly experienced and confident to less so. And I try to cut the less confident folks some slack. Snide responses don't belong here.
4X4Dodger
Explorer II
Feb 04, 2015
Crowe wrote:
This is why I feel some of the questions I see on this forum (R&R) are really futile

Really? We have the grammar police, the "the topic is too vague" police, criticisms because people don't do a search before they ask a question, someone who not only thinks he can define what a "bad" road is for everyone but believes asking a question about a road is a waste of time and those that tell us if we buy a dog other than a rescue we are evil. WHAT ARE ALL OF YOU ON HERE FOR THEN? It's a place to ask questions, get information, share stories and interests, and to make friends, not constantly criticize and whine. Is cabin fever setting and making everyone cranky? Lighten up people. If you don't want to answer a question or the title of the post is too vague for your liking, save yourself the stress and don't respond/don't click. It's that easy.

I don't know how you could read my post and watch the video and so completely miss the entire point of both. It seems clear to me that you didnt read my post carefully and did not watch the video.

No one is mentioning rules or police here. I never said that it was not a place to ask questions. Nor do I have Cabin fever. And I certainly am NOT defining what a bad road is or should be to anyone. What I was doing was showing what I consider to be a challenging road and to put my advice to others in context of how I veiw some roads others would say never to take.

The premise is simply this: a questioner must have some kind of idea about what the person that answers feels is a challenging road or condition to have any idea how valuable that particular advice is to them. Without that the answer is really useless.

All I am saying is that it would be HELPFUL to everyone if people would just give an idea of what they think of certain roads or conditions in their questions or answers. This way the questioner can put the answers they receive in some meaningful context.

Now please tell me what riled you up so much about that idea?
4X4Dodger
Explorer II
Feb 04, 2015
BillMFl wrote:
I agree that a lot depends on the individual. For example, there isn't an Interstate Hwy that I have driven on (and I've traveled all over the lower 48) that an average driver with a fairly new RV of any type that is in good operating condition (and probably even most older or under powered) that can't be traveled on relatively easily. And yet there are plenty of folks who are scared to death crossing the Rockies and even the Blue Ridge in the east. So I don't look down on folks who ask for advice, especially concerning non Interstate routes that can be much more challenging for more timid folks. Folks on here range from highly experienced and confident to less so. And I try to cut the less confident folks some slack. Snide responses don't belong here.

This was exactly my point. For advice to be truly meaningful people need to have some context to put it in. What is a good road for you may not be to someone else. As for me there are even very few two lane roads in this country that arent perfectly good as far as I am concerned...rather than judging for someone else and tailoring my answer I think it's better to let them know how I view what is a bad road and let them decide how to use my advice.