50 amp fiver - 30 amp service

[bodacious]

I'm looking to upgrade to a 50 amp 5th wheel and and keep it parked there for the winter. Not sure if my favorite campground has any 50 amps sites available. Would I be OK using the 30 amp service (with an adapter) as long as I don't exceed the 30 amp load?

[john_bet]

TT_Tim wrote:

john&bet wrote:
I may be mistaking, but according to the NEC any two circuits using the same neutral the circuit breakers must be tied together. This is so if one trips all power is removed from the circuit. I believe our rv's are a branch circuit from the pedestal/main panel. Just because they make them for sale does not make it the right way to do it. JMHO.

No. For single split phase 240V (120 across each line to neutral) the neutral can be shared and it can feed two separate circuits. If the 2 individual 120v lines - (240v & neutral) feed a single appliance such as an electric range, the CBs must be tied together.
This does not apply anyway, as there are no 240v appliances in RVs.

I stand by what I said. I wired houses to code and a lot of industrial wiring too. But I retired from it 6 years ago so thinks may have changed, but I doubt it. JMHO.

[Bumpyroad]

Water-Bug wrote:


The statement that there are NO 240V appliances in RVs is an assumption. .

OK I will go out on a limb and guess here that in 99.732% of all RVs there are no 240 v appliances.
bumpy

[Water-Bug]

TT_Tim wrote:

john&bet wrote:
I may be mistaking, but according to the NEC any two circuits using the same neutral the circuit breakers must be tied together. This is so if one trips all power is removed from the circuit. I believe our rv's are a branch circuit from the pedestal/main panel. Just because they make them for sale does not make it the right way to do it. JMHO.

No. For single split phase 240V (120 across each line to neutral) the neutral can be shared and it can feed two separate circuits. If the 2 individual 120v lines - (240v & neutral) feed a single appliance such as an electric range, the CBs must be tied together.
This does not apply anyway, as there are no 240v appliances in RVs.

The statement that there are NO 240V appliances in RVs is an assumption. The fact that both legs of the breaker/breakers of a 50 amp circuit on a RV pedistal are tied to trip together, emphasises the fact that it is the safe/proper way to do things. People circumvent codes and laws all the time to suit themselves, so nothing said here is going to change things. People will continue to do what suites them and their NEEDS.

[Water-Bug]

john&bet wrote:
I may be mistaking, but according to the NEC any two circuits using the same neutral the circuit breakers must be tied together. This is so if one trips all power is removed from the circuit. I believe our rv's are a branch circuit from the pedestal/main panel. Just because they make them for sale does not make it the right way to do it. JMHO.

X2

[TT_Tim]

john&bet wrote:
I may be mistaking, but according to the NEC any two circuits using the same neutral the circuit breakers must be tied together. This is so if one trips all power is removed from the circuit. I believe our rv's are a branch circuit from the pedestal/main panel. Just because they make them for sale does not make it the right way to do it. JMHO.

No. For single split phase 240V (120 across each line to neutral) the neutral can be shared and it can feed two separate circuits. If the 2 individual 120v lines - (240v & neutral) feed a single appliance such as an electric range, the CBs must be tied together.
This does not apply anyway, as there are no 240v appliances in RVs.

[john_bet]

I may be mistaking, but according to the NEC any two circuits using the same neutral the circuit breakers must be tied together. This is so if one trips all power is removed from the circuit. I believe our rv's are a branch circuit from the pedestal/main panel. Just because they make them for sale does not make it the right way to do it. JMHO.

[TT_Tim]

If you do a search, there are LOTS of places you can purchase this adapter. I have seen approval on a lot worse designs (such as press on wire connectors). The concept of the Camco Power Maximizer is good and I don't see a problem with it. As long as the electrical wiring to and at the pedestal is to code, it shouldn't be an issue.
As stated before, the problem is when someone tries to turn on too many items at once and they continually go out and reset the circuit breaker. That can happen no matter what plug and/or adapters for whatever size RV it is.

[Bumpyroad]

Water-Bug wrote:
Local code enforcement would love it too.

do household "codes" apply to the use of extension cords? When I ran an electric cord to my dock, instead of hard wiring it, and opening up the need for permits/codes/etc. I just made it a long extension cord.
bumpy

[Water-Bug]

drfife wrote:
http://www.camco.net/Products/Item?prodID=10768#.VIz-QXtPQzI

Get up to 45 amps combined power. When connecting to your RV’s 50 Amp power cord, don’t be limited to just 15 or 30 amps. Camco’s Power Grip™ Power Maximizer draws the combined power from a 15- and a 30-amp outlet, which allows your RV to receive up to 45 amps. Will not work when plugged into GFI-type outlets. Patented. This is a polarized adapter designed solely for recreational vehicles and is not for use with any other adapter or device. Adapter must be used in conjunction with properly sized circuit breakers.

Bet you won't find an UL (Underwriters Labratories) or Good Housekeeping stamp of approval on this one. Local code enforcement would love it too.

[drfife]

http://www.camco.net/Products/Item?prodID=10768#.VIz-QXtPQzI

Get up to 45 amps combined power. When connecting to your RV’s 50 Amp power cord, don’t be limited to just 15 or 30 amps. Camco’s Power Grip™ Power Maximizer draws the combined power from a 15- and a 30-amp outlet, which allows your RV to receive up to 45 amps. Will not work when plugged into GFI-type outlets. Patented. This is a polarized adapter designed solely for recreational vehicles and is not for use with any other adapter or device. Adapter must be used in conjunction with properly sized circuit breakers.

[MartyG2]

http://www.americanrvcompany.com/Camco-55025-Power-Maximizer-50A-Camper-Trailer-RVHere it is. It does say it won't work with GFI breakers, now very often found on the 20 Amp outlets. Keeping in mind that an RV doesn't really use the 240 volt application from a 50 amp outlet, rather, it uses each "hot" as a 50 amp 120 Volt line separately. Using this gives one 50 amp side 30 amps, and the other 20 amps. I understand well the point of keeping usage low during these hookups. The point of the story is that, unrestrained, a load that is typical or "normal" in a 50 amp rig will overload a 30 amp outlet. Even more so, using this rig, anything significant on the other leg will trip the 20 amp side. However, this adapter DOES provide a total of 50 amps to a plug that expecting 2x50. In that case it's better than the above-described adapter that puts both sides together on a 30 alone. If you can find a non-GFI 20 amp.
Bottom line: If you have a 50 amp rig, use a 50 amp outlet whenever possible.

[Water-Bug]

MFL wrote:

Allworth wrote:
Tinner,

I hope the fire doesn't burn anybody elses trailer as yours goes up in a flash. (Pun intended.)

Allworth, I agree with you, I don't see how the wiring and breakers, in a 30-20 pole could handle a 45 amp draw.

I see the adapter in my RV book, it is made by Camco. If they were truly dangerous, I don't see how they could sell them. IDK

Jerry

I'd like to see that adapter. I can't believe that any company would make an adapter that combines two circuits on different breakers. There is nothing to assure that both breakers will break the circuits at the same time. If the 20 amp breaker were to break, the 30 amp breaker is supplying 30 amps to wireing designed for only 20 amps.

EDIT This is an over simplification, but 20 amps requires 12 ga wire, 30 amps requires 10 ga wire, 40 amps requires 8 ga wire and 50 amps requires 6 ga wire. Circuit length and type of load can modify the requirement. The easiest way to provide 30 amps to a pedistal is with 10-2 w/ground wire. By making it 10-3 w/ground, it can support both a 30 amp and a 20 amp circuit. 10ga wire does not support a 50 amp circuit.

[MFL]

Allworth wrote:
Tinner,

I hope the fire doesn't burn anybody elses trailer as yours goes up in a flash. (Pun intended.)

Allworth, I agree with you, I don't see how the wiring and breakers, in a 30-20 pole could handle a 45 amp draw.

I see the adapter in my RV book, it is made by Camco. If they were truly dangerous, I don't see how they could sell them. IDK

Jerry

[Allworth]

Tinner,

I hope the fire doesn't burn anybody elses trailer as yours goes up in a flash. (Pun intended.)