Looking to upgrade to a fifth wheel.

[usmc616]

Hi all, I currently tow a TT but am looking to get a fifth wheel. My questions are about "pin weight". My current TV is a 2004.5 Ram 2500 with the HO 5.9 Cummins rated to tow 13,050lbs. GCWR is 20,000lbs ( I found this on several tow guides), GVWR is 9,000lbs ( from label on door) and curb weight is 6727 lbs ( from same label on door) but weighed 7540 on scale( full tank of diesel, 140lb driver, cap on bed and tool box in bed) . My truck is a 4x4 with a 6' 3" bed.
With the above info I am trying to find out what will be my limiting factor when looking at fifth wheel campers. If I understand it correctly I should estimate 15-20% of the fifth wheel GVWR to be my pin weight, is that correct??Iif so then I only have 1490lbs available of pin weight? ( GVWR- Curb weight) is that correct? Educate me please

[usmc616]

I just want to thank everyone for their input. Last week I purchased my new TV. She is a 2017 Silverado 4x4 3500HD Dually with a 8' bed, Allison transmission and the 6.6 Duramax engine. It took me several months to decide which 1 ton I wanted and then another couple months to time selling my truck and purchasing a new to me truck.

[usmc616]

camper1013 wrote:
towingplanner.com has some great weight info. You can enter your weights and it will help calculate thing out for you.

My 5th wheel is 14k on the scale and just about 3k pin weight. There are a lot of people that pull mid sized 5th wheels with 3/4 trucks. We had to upgrade from a 1500 and went straight to the 3500.

Thank you for the info.

[camper1013]

towingplanner.com has some great weight info. You can enter your weights and it will help calculate thing out for you.

My 5th wheel is 14k on the scale and just about 3k pin weight. There are a lot of people that pull mid sized 5th wheels with 3/4 trucks. We had to upgrade from a 1500 and went straight to the 3500.

[garyp4951]

Subtract your rear empty weight from 6000lbs, or from your rear tires max load rating, and use the lesser amount for max rear loading.

[usmc616]

Michelle.S wrote:
Your Wife, Kids, and Dogs aren't going Camping with you?? Since you're only adding your weight.

Since you asked, my son was the driver that weighed the truck.My wife usually meets me at the CG with our 13 year old and a few of the dogs. My 3 oldest kids are in college and work part time so they drive themselves to the CG. The only weight I need to add is mine 230lbs - the 140 so I will add 90 more pounds to the scaled weight.

Now that I have answered your question could you answer mine: Is this equation correct: GVWR - scaled weight = available payload.

[usmc616]

4x4ord wrote:

usmc616 wrote:
Hi all, I currently tow a TT but am looking to get a fifth wheel. My questions are about "pin weight". My current TV is a 2004.5 Ram 2500 with the HO 5.9 Cummins rated to tow 13,050lbs. GCWR is 20,000lbs ( I found this on several tow guides), GVWR is 9,000lbs ( from label on door) and curb weight is 6727 lbs ( from same label on door) but weighed 7540 on scale( full tank of diesel, 140lb driver, cap on bed and tool box in bed) . My truck is a 4x4 with a 6' 3" bed.
With the above info I am trying to find out what will be my limiting factor when looking at fifth wheel campers. If I understand it correctly I should estimate 15-20% of the fifth wheel GVWR to be my pin weight, is that correct??Iif so then I only have 1490lbs available of pin weight? ( GVWR- Curb weight) is that correct? Educate me please

Many 3/4 ton owners ignore the GVWR of their truck and use the rear axle rating as their limiting value. If you where buying a truck to use for a fiver I'd say get a 1 ton SRW but because you've already got a truck I'll say ignore the GVWR and let your rear axle rating determine your maximum pin weight.

My door label says the GAWR Rear is 6000lbs, so does that mean my maximum pin weight is 6000lbs?

[Michelle_S]

Your Wife, Kids, and Dogs aren't going Camping with you?? Since you're only adding your weight.

[usmc616]

TXiceman wrote:
The limiting weight on your 2500 is the pin weight of the trailer and the trucks GVWR and GAWR for the rear axle. A typical 5er when loaded has a pin weight around 20% of the trailers GVWR.

Weigh your truck loaded for travel with passengers, cargo, hitch and fuel. now you have a baseline for selecting a trailer that will not over load the trucks ratings. Adding air bags and help springs does nothing toward increasing the trucks ratings.

Ken

Ken, The scaled weight I provided included my cap and tool box, I estimate both weight 200lbs probably close to a fifth wheel hitch, since I do not have a fifth wheel now I o not have a fifth wheel hitch to weigh. The only other thing I would add to the truck is myself, 230lbs. I do understand air bags and springs will not increase my trucks ratings.

[troubledwaters]

Bob Shaw wrote:

troubledwaters wrote:
You can tow a lot bigger TT than a fifth wheel and still stay within your ratings - Just Saying.

That's not what my owners manual says. My 5th wheel tow rating is higher than the tt tow rating.

Yes, but your payload rating hasn't changed; and 10% vs. 20% means you can carry twice as much TT. And everyone knows you run out a payload long before you get to the tow rating. Simple Math.

[Bob_Shaw]

troubledwaters wrote:
You can tow a lot bigger TT than a fifth wheel and still stay within your ratings - Just Saying.

That's not what my owners manual says. My 5th wheel tow rating is higher than the tt tow rating.

[TXiceman]

The limiting weight on your 2500 is the pin weight of the trailer and the trucks GVWR and GAWR for the rear axle. A typical 5er when loaded has a pin weight around 20% of the trailers GVWR.

Weigh your truck loaded for travel with passengers, cargo, hitch and fuel. now you have a baseline for selecting a trailer that will not over load the trucks ratings. Adding air bags and help springs does nothing toward increasing the trucks ratings.

Ken

[rhagfo]

valhalla360 wrote:
There should be a sticker on your door frame that gives the max payload and subtract off anything added since it came from the factory.

Actual scale weights are better but if you want to start selectively ignoring the ratings, you can do whatever you like but live with the results...it may be nothing but it's on you.

Generally 5ers assume 20-25% of the trailer as pin weight.

The payload sticker was not required until 2006, as as you stated scales weights are far better, which the OP provided. He scaled his truck at 7,450# and has a GVWR of 9,000# leaving 1,460# of payload left before exceeding GVWR.
Others, the go by rear GAWR will state the likely as scaled only about 3,000# on the rear axle, so with the 6,000# rear axle about 3,000# payload before reaching GAWR.

[troubledwaters]

You can tow a lot bigger TT than a fifth wheel and still stay within your ratings - Just Saying.

[Crabbypatty]

Keep in mind that fifth wheels have evolved, from being super heavy to now lighter series. The most popular trucks sold are the 1500's, f 150 and the manufacturers are building light fivers for them. I thought that I needed a diesel until we stayed at a favorite cg. The owner had a 2500 gas chevy told me to look at the light series fivers. We tow with a f250 4x4 short bed quad cab. 6.2l 6 speed gasser 3.73 rears. Our 37 ft Heritage Glen, dry weight just under 10k wet weight just a hair over 12k. Pin weight around 1700 lbs. Tows and drives like a dream we aren't suffering.