an interesting new design rv

[pianotuna]

Hi all,

This seems to be well thought out!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqk2eiiV0B4&feature=youtu.be

[pnichols]

Gjac wrote:

pnichols wrote:

ron.dittmer wrote:
Comparing a B-Box to my 2007 Phoenix Cruiser 2350 HERE.

B-Box - 9'-8" tall to the top of the roof plus vent pipes = 9'-11".
My Phoenix Cruiser - 9'-10" to the highest point, the a/c unit.

B-Box - 22'-9" long.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 23'-8" long.

B-Box - ~83" wide.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 93" wide.

B-Box has a wet bath with shower curtain out in the main isle.
My Phoenix Cruiser has a private dry bath.

B-Box has a couch/bed facing forward, and front seats that swivel rearward.
You sleep on the couch/bed. Where do you eat?
My Phoenix Cruiser has full-time double bed, full size dinette, 3rd captain seat, and front passenger swivel seat. I have dedicated eating, sleeping, and relaxing areas, something for everyone at the same time.

Watching the video, I see the auto-levelers hanging way down. Their thoughts about off-roading seems risky without them, let alone with them.

B-Box has technical complexity up the ying-yang.
My Phoenix Cruiser is simple.

B-Box costs between $300,000 and $490,000? Is that right?
My Phoenix Cruiser cost me $67,000 back in 2007.

B-Box may be ideal for someone else, but not for me.
Still, I admire their creativity and wish the company great success.

Ron ... nice comparison you did above.

Here's just a few comparisons of the B-Box to my 2005 24 foot E450 Itasca Class C:

1. My ground clearance along the bottom edges of the coach sidewalls is ~15" or more, including under the retracted automatic entrance step. The ground clearance of the bottom edge of my rear coach wall is much more. BTW for off-road considerations, isn't "real" ground clearance that between the ground and the bottom of the lowest differential casing point?

2. I have 45 gallons of FW, 39 gallons of BW, and 29 gallons of GW.

3. My BW and GW tanks can be combined or uncombined, at will, with handy pull-valves.

4. My GW and BW tanks are heated with 12V heaters, if I turn on a switch.

5. In addition to gauges that I may or may not trust, I can easily use the ultimate method - check visually to see how full my FW and BW tanks are.

6. Although my coach roof is higher and my coach is wider, what I get is 5 extra inches at both my head and feet (for storage) when I sleep crosswise in one of my queen beds. My other two beds are not as long, but they're still useful when needed. However, a higher and wider coach body is usually of no concern in much of the Western U.S. when boondock camping off other than overgrown forest roads.

7. The "wide-ness" of my RV is made possible by well-spaced rear tire dual sets, which provides for excellent lateral stability in cross-winds and on highway curves.

8. My main gas engine can be fueled everywhere - unlike some of the new finicky diesel engines.

9. My main gas engine can be idled super-quietly for hours to provide emergency backup for - battery charging, whole coach heating, and whole coach cooling.

10. And of course what a built-in generator adds to the mix is legendary.

BTW, the video showed a construction tech using plastic wire-wraps on wire bundles. I use a lot of these around my stick house and on our Class C. Plastic wire-wraps indeed do age, crack, and break. Whenever I use them on our RV, I use double ones at each point so that I get "redundant reliability" in holding together whatever they're supposed to hold together.

I paid around $54K (not including tax) for our Class C when we bought it new in 2006.

But Phil, you and Ron don't have a gray water recycling system.(I still don't know how to make those smiley faces on my laptop).

"But Phil, you and Ron don't have a gray water recycling system.(I still don't know how to make those smiley faces on my laptop)."

Awww ... a gray water recycling system is no big technology deal worth spending extra $$$$$$ for.

The real design challenge to include in a State-Of-The-Art $$$$$$ Class C to extend onboard water availability for drinking, cooking, and grey purposes is ... a black water recycling system! :B :B and 😉 😉 and :C :C

[Gjac]

pnichols wrote:

ron.dittmer wrote:
Comparing a B-Box to my 2007 Phoenix Cruiser 2350 HERE.

B-Box - 9'-8" tall to the top of the roof plus vent pipes = 9'-11".
My Phoenix Cruiser - 9'-10" to the highest point, the a/c unit.

B-Box - 22'-9" long.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 23'-8" long.

B-Box - ~83" wide.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 93" wide.

B-Box has a wet bath with shower curtain out in the main isle.
My Phoenix Cruiser has a private dry bath.

B-Box has a couch/bed facing forward, and front seats that swivel rearward.
You sleep on the couch/bed. Where do you eat?
My Phoenix Cruiser has full-time double bed, full size dinette, 3rd captain seat, and front passenger swivel seat. I have dedicated eating, sleeping, and relaxing areas, something for everyone at the same time.

Watching the video, I see the auto-levelers hanging way down. Their thoughts about off-roading seems risky without them, let alone with them.

B-Box has technical complexity up the ying-yang.
My Phoenix Cruiser is simple.

B-Box costs between $300,000 and $490,000? Is that right?
My Phoenix Cruiser cost me $67,000 back in 2007.

B-Box may be ideal for someone else, but not for me.
Still, I admire their creativity and wish the company great success.

Ron ... nice comparison you did above.

Here's just a few comparisons of the B-Box to my 2005 24 foot E450 Itasca Class C:

1. My ground clearance along the bottom edges of the coach sidewalls is ~15" or more, including under the retracted automatic entrance step. The ground clearance of the bottom edge of my rear coach wall is much more. BTW for off-road considerations, isn't "real" ground clearance that between the ground and the bottom of the lowest differential casing point?

2. I have 45 gallons of FW, 39 gallons of BW, and 29 gallons of GW.

3. My BW and GW tanks can be combined or uncombined, at will, with handy pull-valves.

4. My GW and BW tanks are heated with 12V heaters, if I turn on a switch.

5. In addition to gauges that I may or may not trust, I can easily use the ultimate method - check visually to see how full my FW and BW tanks are.

6. Although my coach roof is higher and my coach is wider, what I get is 5 extra inches at both my head and feet (for storage) when I sleep crosswise in one of my queen beds. My other two beds are not as long, but they're still useful when needed. However, a higher and wider coach body is usually of no concern in much of the Western U.S. when boondock camping off other than overgrown forest roads.

7. The "wide-ness" of my RV is made possible by well-spaced rear tire dual sets, which provides for excellent lateral stability in cross-winds and on highway curves.

8. My main gas engine can be fueled everywhere - unlike some of the new finicky diesel engines.

9. My main gas engine can be idled super-quietly for hours to provide emergency backup for - battery charging, whole coach heating, and whole coach cooling.

10. And of course what a built-in generator adds to the mix is legendary.

BTW, the video showed a construction tech using plastic wire-wraps on wire bundles. I use a lot of these around my stick house and on our Class C. Plastic wire-wraps indeed do age, crack, and break. Whenever I use them on our RV, I use double ones at each point so that I get "redundant reliability" in holding together whatever they're supposed to hold together.

I paid around $54K (not including tax) for our Class C when we bought it new in 2006.

But Phil, you and Ron don't have a gray water recycling system.(I still don't know how to make those smiley faces on my laptop).

[pnichols]

ron.dittmer wrote:
Comparing a B-Box to my 2007 Phoenix Cruiser 2350 HERE.

B-Box - 9'-8" tall to the top of the roof plus vent pipes = 9'-11".
My Phoenix Cruiser - 9'-10" to the highest point, the a/c unit.

B-Box - 22'-9" long.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 23'-8" long.

B-Box - ~83" wide.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 93" wide.

B-Box has a wet bath with shower curtain out in the main isle.
My Phoenix Cruiser has a private dry bath.

B-Box has a couch/bed facing forward, and front seats that swivel rearward.
You sleep on the couch/bed. Where do you eat?
My Phoenix Cruiser has full-time double bed, full size dinette, 3rd captain seat, and front passenger swivel seat. I have dedicated eating, sleeping, and relaxing areas, something for everyone at the same time.

Watching the video, I see the auto-levelers hanging way down. Their thoughts about off-roading seems risky without them, let alone with them.

B-Box has technical complexity up the ying-yang.
My Phoenix Cruiser is simple.

B-Box costs between $300,000 and $490,000? Is that right?
My Phoenix Cruiser cost me $67,000 back in 2007.

B-Box may be ideal for someone else, but not for me.
Still, I admire their creativity and wish the company great success.

Ron ... nice comparison you did above.

Here's just a few comparisons of the B-Box to my 2005 24 foot E450 Itasca Class C:

1. My ground clearance along the bottom edges of the coach sidewalls is ~15" or more, including under the retracted automatic entrance step. The ground clearance of the bottom edge of my rear coach wall is much more. BTW for off-road considerations, isn't "real" ground clearance that between the ground and the bottom of the lowest differential casing point?

2. I have 45 gallons of FW, 39 gallons of BW, and 29 gallons of GW.

3. My BW and GW tanks can be combined or uncombined, at will, with handy pull-valves.

4. My GW and BW tanks are heated with 12V heaters, if I turn on a switch.

5. In addition to gauges that I may or may not trust, I can easily use the ultimate method - check visually to see how full my FW and BW tanks are.

6. Although my coach roof is higher and my coach is wider, what I get is 5 extra inches at both my head and feet (for storage) when I sleep crosswise in one of my queen beds. My other two beds are not as long, but they're still useful when needed. However, a higher and wider coach body is usually of no concern in much of the Western U.S. when boondock camping off other than overgrown forest roads.

7. The "wide-ness" of my RV is made possible by well-spaced rear tire dual sets, which provides for excellent lateral stability in cross-winds and on highway curves.

8. My main gas engine can be fueled everywhere - unlike some of the new finicky diesel engines.

9. My main gas engine can be idled super-quietly for hours to provide emergency backup for - battery charging, whole coach heating, and whole coach cooling.

10. And of course what a built-in generator adds to the mix is legendary.

BTW, the video showed a construction tech using plastic wire-wraps on wire bundles. I use a lot of these around my stick house and on our Class C. Plastic wire-wraps indeed do age, crack, and break. Whenever I use them on our RV, I use double ones at each point so that I get "redundant reliability" in holding together whatever they're supposed to hold together.

I paid around $54K (not including tax) for our Class C when we bought it new in 2006.

[obgraham]

Considering that ARV is a custom builder, and each rig is a one-off, I've no doubt they will be able to sell this rig and others like it.

Now whether that is a good value for dollar is a totally different question.

[Gjac]

theoldwizard1 wrote:

Gjac wrote:
On second thought I googled the B box RV cost. They said it was between $300-$490k I think I will pass. Still a nice design, they just need to make it more affordable.

Sadly, at that price point, it will not sell !

You are right, the class B vans tend to be much higher in price than small class C's mainly because they have to build inside the van chassis where as a C or A they can build on the floor and install the sides and top afterwards. To me that is not a van chassis but a cutaway like what the C's are built on. I would eliminate all the high tech electronic stuff, 4 LI batteries, recycled water system etc use Al extrusions instead of the FG pultrusion's buy just the flat panels and build it like a C rather than inside the box. If they could get the price down to $80k I think it would sell well. More room inside than a CLass B van but shorter, narrower and lower in height than a Class C. To me it is just a C- or a B+ what ever you want to call it.

[ppine]

Vans are all the rage. There is a lot of innovation that comes with them, and the cult of smallness. They have some high tech solutions.

They are the RVs for people that don't like RVs.
The problem has always been the cost. The people that buy the tricked out vans tend to be high income, high education urbanites.

[theoldwizard1]

Gjac wrote:
On second thought I googled the B box RV cost. They said it was between $300-$490k I think I will pass. Still a nice design, they just need to make it more affordable.

Sadly, at that price point, it will not sell !

[Gjac]

GDS-3950BH wrote:

Gjac wrote:
On second thought I googled the B box RV cost. They said it was between $300-$490k

ROFLMAO. Good luck with that although there is one born every minute, or so they say.

Meanwhile for the low low price of $389K.

Way too big.

[GDS-3950BH]

Gjac wrote:
On second thought I googled the B box RV cost. They said it was between $300-$490k

ROFLMAO. Good luck with that although there is one born every minute, or so they say.

Meanwhile for the low low price of $389K.

[IAMICHABOD]

pianotuna wrote:

IAMICHABOD wrote:

But it comes with Air Tabs.......:B

I already have those.......

YA Me TOO.........................:B

[ron_dittmer]

Comparing a B-Box to my 2007 Phoenix Cruiser 2350 HERE.

B-Box - 9'-8" tall to the top of the roof plus vent pipes = 9'-11".
My Phoenix Cruiser - 9'-10" to the highest point, the a/c unit.

B-Box - 22'-9" long.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 23'-8" long.

B-Box - ~83" wide.
My Phoenix Cruiser - 93" wide.

B-Box has a wet bath with shower curtain out in the main isle.
My Phoenix Cruiser has a private dry bath.

B-Box has a couch/bed facing forward, and front seats that swivel rearward.
You sleep on the couch/bed. Where do you eat?
My Phoenix Cruiser has full-time double bed, full size dinette, 3rd captain seat, and front passenger swivel seat. I have dedicated eating, sleeping, and relaxing areas, something for everyone at the same time.

Watching the video, I see the auto-levelers hanging way down. Their thoughts about off-roading seems risky without them, let alone with them.

B-Box has technical complexity up the ying-yang.
My Phoenix Cruiser is simple.

B-Box costs between $300,000 and $490,000? Is that right?
My Phoenix Cruiser cost me $67,000 back in 2007.

B-Box may be ideal for someone else, but not for me.
Still, I admire their creativity and wish the company great success.

[Gjac]

Lwiddis wrote:
Is the ground clearance low or am I imagining that?

The GC at the lowest point is a little over 10 in, the rest is about 15 in if I remember correctly.

[DrewE]

I think they may technically need to put clearance lights on (the overall width of the body seems to be maybe an inch over 80").

It is an interesting and pretty well thought out design. I'd be interested to see how the laminated fiberglass and foam structure holds up over time without a metal framework for the basic body; it probably can't be any worse than some more traditionally built RVs, at the least.

Also: A nice amount of counter space, a big kitchen sink, a large fridge and freezer, but no stovetop at all (unless I missed it somewhere)?

[pianotuna]

IAMICHABOD wrote:

pianotuna wrote:
Bumpy,
It is, too rich for my blood. But I can wish.

But it comes with Air Tabs.......:B

I already have those.......