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Thanks, metalmangler. Latest problem from someone in the park? Hmmmm.
2002 Newmar Dutch Star Cummins Diesel on a Spartan chassy. Has a decent 4wd toad. Driving through Colorado, someone tells him to pull over. His connector to the toad has come loose and is dragging on the ground. Ripped it up good and the connector end is gone and the wires are damaged from dragging the ground. No diodes, the dealer ran wires from the front of the toad to the back and put in extra light bulbs, so he replaced the cord and all is good there. (For those of you with toads where you have diodes in the lines from certain dealer installs -- if you are connected to the RV and turn on the headlights (and some other systems) in the toad, you create a feedback loop. Burns out the diodes and will do very weird things to your RV electrics. Make sure you unhook that connector before doing anything involving electricity with the toad or no lights on the toad and some very weird issues that could end up being Electronic Control Module related).
Anyway, he's back on the road. About 40 miles from here, his gauges suddenly go bonkers. All read wrong. He pulls in here (Fountain Creek RV Park in Colorado Springs) and calls a mobile maintenance man (who we that live here have never seen before - he'd just dropped a business card in the office - the normal guy we see is really good and does have all the testers. But being a biker couldn't be reached and is probably at Sturgis for the big bike rally). Anyway, no ODBC tester; he just starts checking some mains and fuses and relays. A couple relays he replaces. After 2 hours, no fix, but gives up. Charges 90.00. His neighbor and I have no ODBC tester either, but we are both pretty good with electrics (prior military jobs and I work for HP) and know from watching the maintenance guy that he didn't bother to check all the fuses. So the search is on. Guy doesn't know where his dash fuse box is. Look everywhere and can't find it - inside and out. Ask him about the cover on the top of the dash, he says the dealer told him it's an airbag under there (hey, they're making advances all the time, who knew?). We exhaust every possibility; turn off the battery disconnect, wait 2 minutes and reset. Same problem. Unhook toad, same problem. Check every fuse and circuit breaker we can find with a ohmmeter, mainly checking for continuity; find a cuple bad and replace them, same problem. Finally he pulls that cover on the top of the dash. Lo and behold!!! Fuse board. Every fuse is good, all the relays check out, but can't get the ignition (F9) relay to budge. Likely burned inside and fried itself to the contacts. Not going to break the circuit board (I work computers - doesn't pay to ruin circuit boards for nothing) by prying it up with a screwdriver; suspect that's what caused his other 2 relays which deal with the ignition to go bad. For the record, all gauges point straight up (although sitting still, for instance, the speedo reads 40 mph and he has 1/2 tank of gas when he knows he has under 1/4). Sure, pull a couple relays (I don't recommend this, the maintenance man did it and I just shook my head- good way to fry other systems; got the feeling the so-called maintenance guy didn't know squat; but I'm not going to interfere - some of those guys get pretty upset when you do and the Dutch Star owner was paying for this and didn't want to upset him either) while the engine is running and either nothing on the dash, just red lights everywhere, or the gauges are working, or going crazy. That's how he came to replace 2 relays under the hood maintenance man figured they were fried so replaced them and said that's all I can do, got paid, and left. Twit. Quit for the night, this guy's had a hard day and at least he had SOMETHING to check on. Went online and printed out his recalls from NHTSA (3 - one for fumes, 2 for brake systems) and the Newmarcorp.com recommended service centers, one of which is 8 miles from here. And point him to a decent restaurant so he and the wife can eat.
After dinner, we sit down and have a beer, and then off to bed (after all, I have to work in the morning and he has some calls and decisions to make).
In the morning, he calls Fleetwood (authorized Newmar service center here) and they can't get to him until Thursday. He calls Spartan. Their service center is closer and can get him in tomorrow, and while after an hour they agree it may be the relay, they want to make sure (and if they break the board, they have to pay for it). Then he buys us each a 6-pack for our trouble. We (his neighbor, who I ride motorcycles with) say thanks, 'twerent nothing and we'd do it for anyone. So his neighbor and I invite them to dinner and a local (awesome) German restaurant and pick up the bill, letting him take the tip. He balks, but we remind him we've both been places where stuff goes wrong and all of a sudden something happens and money starts going up in smoke (my trip to Havasu, his neighbor's trips to bike rallys in a class A towing the bikes where he had to pay for an engine one trip, a tranny another, and on the last an air conditioner). He acquiesces at that point, we come home, give him directions on how to get to the maintenance center Spartan told him about, and we all sit down and have a couple beers and about an hour worth of really good conversation. Nice evening. We'll see what happens at the maintenance garage, and I'll keep you posted.
Oh, and by the way. I did relay a couple of the experiences people on here have posted (took 5 hours to read through 38 pages, but I enjoyed it), but not all. Didn't want to turn the guy and his wife into people just waiting for the other shoe to drop. He has Michelins. Does check his pressure before moving that thing. Knows now to get and keep spare fuses and maybe some other parts. Laughed that I immediately thought of Utahans when I read She Who Must be Obeyed. Laughed about the wife towing the RV with the 4wd when you have coverage to get towed (laughing with you folks, not at you - it's all a learning experience). Knows he can (did you know?) talk to Newmar and Spartan and Cummings and order manuals (parts, service, and user) and schematics, although he may have to pay for them. The manual with the RV is good for some things, but has no real schematics (doesn't even say where the fuse boxes are),and he knows a darn sight more now about his rv than he did (like dealers may not know what they are talking about when it comes to air bags in an rv), talking to us and a couple other neighbors (one of which has of all things a 2003 Dutch Star who just happened to pull in 3 days ago for a week stay). I know the service center he's going to will have the right ODBC unit (after reading these posts and living in a park, I'm going to buy the whole kit(odbc1, 2, and the foreign one complete with code manuals for all makes and models 1983 through 2007) for 299.00 off of a website I found. Would have loved to have been able to isolate the exact cause for him, and I've used those items before, just never bought one.
I'll keep you posted on the results of his problem.
And just in case...anyone know how to turn off that annoying air pressure alarm they have on those Dutch Stars? Until there's enough pressure, the thing goes off after the engine is started. Dang that's annoying. Also, if he hits a hard enough bump on the road, one of his jacks will evidently drop an inch or less, but enough to activate the jacks down light and alarm. Scares the bejesus out of him and the wife. He stops immediately every time and verifies the jack is indeed up, but that alarm......he'd love a way around that. I advised he ask the maintenance shop tomorrow, but thought some of you would have an idea as well. Seem like a pretty smart group of people here, and I've certainly gained a lot of information from you as well.
As a final note for now, he and the wife are dropping off the rv in the morning, taking the cog railway to the top of Pike's Peak around 1 p.m., and spelunking in Cave of the Winds tomorrow. Always make the best you can of what seems like a bad situation and learn to laugh. At yourself, and at what others have gone through. Commiserate with them too, as we did with all of you. Sure makes life in an rv more bearable. For instance; the guy and his wife who got pulled over by a new highway patrolman in Arizona for not wearing seat belts. Class A, older one, say late 70's early 80's. Those didn't have shoulder belts, just lap belts (which they did have on but the cop could only see that no shoulder belts were being worn and presumed....). Had to invite him inside and show him there weren't any holes for them so they hadn't removed them, they were just not installed back then. At least the cop got an education and a cup of hot coffee and a sandwich out of the deal. He won't be pulling over any more Class A drivers for that, although he's likely learned also that the newer units do have shoulder belts. They are friends of mine and we all laughed our rear ends off over that one. As I expect you are right now.....lol. And as you are online, check your vehicle's recalls using NHTSA.com. Especially as if in this case, you've bought it used and aren't registered with your parent company - they don't know how to tell you there may be a problem with your unit if they can't find you. He's going to have those recalls checked tomorrow too.
2002 Newmar Dutch Star Cummins Diesel on a Spartan chassy. Has a decent 4wd toad. Driving through Colorado, someone tells him to pull over. His connector to the toad has come loose and is dragging on the ground. Ripped it up good and the connector end is gone and the wires are damaged from dragging the ground. No diodes, the dealer ran wires from the front of the toad to the back and put in extra light bulbs, so he replaced the cord and all is good there. (For those of you with toads where you have diodes in the lines from certain dealer installs -- if you are connected to the RV and turn on the headlights (and some other systems) in the toad, you create a feedback loop. Burns out the diodes and will do very weird things to your RV electrics. Make sure you unhook that connector before doing anything involving electricity with the toad or no lights on the toad and some very weird issues that could end up being Electronic Control Module related).
Anyway, he's back on the road. About 40 miles from here, his gauges suddenly go bonkers. All read wrong. He pulls in here (Fountain Creek RV Park in Colorado Springs) and calls a mobile maintenance man (who we that live here have never seen before - he'd just dropped a business card in the office - the normal guy we see is really good and does have all the testers. But being a biker couldn't be reached and is probably at Sturgis for the big bike rally). Anyway, no ODBC tester; he just starts checking some mains and fuses and relays. A couple relays he replaces. After 2 hours, no fix, but gives up. Charges 90.00. His neighbor and I have no ODBC tester either, but we are both pretty good with electrics (prior military jobs and I work for HP) and know from watching the maintenance guy that he didn't bother to check all the fuses. So the search is on. Guy doesn't know where his dash fuse box is. Look everywhere and can't find it - inside and out. Ask him about the cover on the top of the dash, he says the dealer told him it's an airbag under there (hey, they're making advances all the time, who knew?). We exhaust every possibility; turn off the battery disconnect, wait 2 minutes and reset. Same problem. Unhook toad, same problem. Check every fuse and circuit breaker we can find with a ohmmeter, mainly checking for continuity; find a cuple bad and replace them, same problem. Finally he pulls that cover on the top of the dash. Lo and behold!!! Fuse board. Every fuse is good, all the relays check out, but can't get the ignition (F9) relay to budge. Likely burned inside and fried itself to the contacts. Not going to break the circuit board (I work computers - doesn't pay to ruin circuit boards for nothing) by prying it up with a screwdriver; suspect that's what caused his other 2 relays which deal with the ignition to go bad. For the record, all gauges point straight up (although sitting still, for instance, the speedo reads 40 mph and he has 1/2 tank of gas when he knows he has under 1/4). Sure, pull a couple relays (I don't recommend this, the maintenance man did it and I just shook my head- good way to fry other systems; got the feeling the so-called maintenance guy didn't know squat; but I'm not going to interfere - some of those guys get pretty upset when you do and the Dutch Star owner was paying for this and didn't want to upset him either) while the engine is running and either nothing on the dash, just red lights everywhere, or the gauges are working, or going crazy. That's how he came to replace 2 relays under the hood maintenance man figured they were fried so replaced them and said that's all I can do, got paid, and left. Twit. Quit for the night, this guy's had a hard day and at least he had SOMETHING to check on. Went online and printed out his recalls from NHTSA (3 - one for fumes, 2 for brake systems) and the Newmarcorp.com recommended service centers, one of which is 8 miles from here. And point him to a decent restaurant so he and the wife can eat.
After dinner, we sit down and have a beer, and then off to bed (after all, I have to work in the morning and he has some calls and decisions to make).
In the morning, he calls Fleetwood (authorized Newmar service center here) and they can't get to him until Thursday. He calls Spartan. Their service center is closer and can get him in tomorrow, and while after an hour they agree it may be the relay, they want to make sure (and if they break the board, they have to pay for it). Then he buys us each a 6-pack for our trouble. We (his neighbor, who I ride motorcycles with) say thanks, 'twerent nothing and we'd do it for anyone. So his neighbor and I invite them to dinner and a local (awesome) German restaurant and pick up the bill, letting him take the tip. He balks, but we remind him we've both been places where stuff goes wrong and all of a sudden something happens and money starts going up in smoke (my trip to Havasu, his neighbor's trips to bike rallys in a class A towing the bikes where he had to pay for an engine one trip, a tranny another, and on the last an air conditioner). He acquiesces at that point, we come home, give him directions on how to get to the maintenance center Spartan told him about, and we all sit down and have a couple beers and about an hour worth of really good conversation. Nice evening. We'll see what happens at the maintenance garage, and I'll keep you posted.
Oh, and by the way. I did relay a couple of the experiences people on here have posted (took 5 hours to read through 38 pages, but I enjoyed it), but not all. Didn't want to turn the guy and his wife into people just waiting for the other shoe to drop. He has Michelins. Does check his pressure before moving that thing. Knows now to get and keep spare fuses and maybe some other parts. Laughed that I immediately thought of Utahans when I read She Who Must be Obeyed. Laughed about the wife towing the RV with the 4wd when you have coverage to get towed (laughing with you folks, not at you - it's all a learning experience). Knows he can (did you know?) talk to Newmar and Spartan and Cummings and order manuals (parts, service, and user) and schematics, although he may have to pay for them. The manual with the RV is good for some things, but has no real schematics (doesn't even say where the fuse boxes are),and he knows a darn sight more now about his rv than he did (like dealers may not know what they are talking about when it comes to air bags in an rv), talking to us and a couple other neighbors (one of which has of all things a 2003 Dutch Star who just happened to pull in 3 days ago for a week stay). I know the service center he's going to will have the right ODBC unit (after reading these posts and living in a park, I'm going to buy the whole kit(odbc1, 2, and the foreign one complete with code manuals for all makes and models 1983 through 2007) for 299.00 off of a website I found. Would have loved to have been able to isolate the exact cause for him, and I've used those items before, just never bought one.
I'll keep you posted on the results of his problem.
And just in case...anyone know how to turn off that annoying air pressure alarm they have on those Dutch Stars? Until there's enough pressure, the thing goes off after the engine is started. Dang that's annoying. Also, if he hits a hard enough bump on the road, one of his jacks will evidently drop an inch or less, but enough to activate the jacks down light and alarm. Scares the bejesus out of him and the wife. He stops immediately every time and verifies the jack is indeed up, but that alarm......he'd love a way around that. I advised he ask the maintenance shop tomorrow, but thought some of you would have an idea as well. Seem like a pretty smart group of people here, and I've certainly gained a lot of information from you as well.
As a final note for now, he and the wife are dropping off the rv in the morning, taking the cog railway to the top of Pike's Peak around 1 p.m., and spelunking in Cave of the Winds tomorrow. Always make the best you can of what seems like a bad situation and learn to laugh. At yourself, and at what others have gone through. Commiserate with them too, as we did with all of you. Sure makes life in an rv more bearable. For instance; the guy and his wife who got pulled over by a new highway patrolman in Arizona for not wearing seat belts. Class A, older one, say late 70's early 80's. Those didn't have shoulder belts, just lap belts (which they did have on but the cop could only see that no shoulder belts were being worn and presumed....). Had to invite him inside and show him there weren't any holes for them so they hadn't removed them, they were just not installed back then. At least the cop got an education and a cup of hot coffee and a sandwich out of the deal. He won't be pulling over any more Class A drivers for that, although he's likely learned also that the newer units do have shoulder belts. They are friends of mine and we all laughed our rear ends off over that one. As I expect you are right now.....lol. And as you are online, check your vehicle's recalls using NHTSA.com. Especially as if in this case, you've bought it used and aren't registered with your parent company - they don't know how to tell you there may be a problem with your unit if they can't find you. He's going to have those recalls checked tomorrow too.
