Step one. Bought the van.

[WVvan]

Hello Everybody,
First post.
I camp a lot in tents but after spending three days straight in a tent in the rain at Dolly Sods I swore I'd make a change.
Here it is.


Bought it Wednesday.
Drove it home today.
1999 Ford E-250, 6 cylinder, 125K miles.
Was a home builders work van. Some slight surface rust.
Cargo doors a bit dinged up.
I'm planning on doing a full conversion. Most of the work I'll do myself but some will be beyond my abilities. I'm giving myself a deadline of no later than spring. Van won't fit into my small garage so that will affect how/when I can work on it.

I've been reading this and other conversion forums for a few weeks. It's been a huge help so far. Learned quite a lot already but there's still a lot I don't know. Counting on the pros who frequent this forum for some advice.

Advice like: The previous owner drilled some 3/4 inch holes in the floor for bolted down shelving. Whats the best way to cover these holes from underneath? Should I treat the metal edges of the holes before I start?

Thanks for your time, now and in the future.
WVvan

P.S. I'm thinking of call it "HAL the Van".
Why HAL? Well since my name is Dave....

Dave Bowman: Open the pod bay doors, HAL.
HAL: I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that.

[WVvan]

Sofa-bed continued:

I've constructed the seat frame this way since I'm planning on having "hatches" to access the area under the sofa.


I copied the same design for the back frame but the hatch part won't be hinged.

Before I assemble the frame pieces I want to route out a lip so the plywood hatches will sit partially recessed. Here's my router attached to the router table.


Like other power tools the router can put a put a good bit of hurt on you if you're not careful when using it. It uses a sharp bit spinning at very high speed and the wood has to be held tight against the bit as it is moved across the table. All kinds of chances to make a unfortunate slip.

In operation there is one noticeable difference between a router and other power tools, like a saw for instance. A saw takes one piece of wood and then produces two pieces of wood and some sawdust. With a router you start and stop with one piece of wood but the amount of sawdust that is produced seems exponentially larger than the amount wood that was removed. I think of it more as a sawdust production machine than as a router. Because of the sawdust problem I always attach my shopvac to the router table. The table has a fitting just for this.


Problem is that once you start both the router and shopvac the amount of noise the two of them make in a small garage is not to be believed. I've never stuck my head inside the exhaust of a spinning jet engine but I bet I know how it might sound. I make a point of not using my power tools later that 9:00pm so my kindly neighbours won't be tempted to host a necktie party in my honor.

Here is the router bit I've installed on the router. It's a double fluted carbide tipped straight bit. It's used to make square edged cuts. I'm going to make the recess cut 3/4" wide. I could explain why this is the best possible size for this application but in reality it's just the widest bit I have.


The boards I'm routing are 3/4" thick so I'm setting the bit to cut 1/4" deep (1/3 the thickness). Use the caliper to set the router bit depth (height?).


After making changes to the router bit I always do a test cut with a piece of scrap wood to check the settings.


Here's how you'd use the depth probe on the cailpers to check the cut.




continued -

[WVvan]

My three-ramp bed can thus withstand almost a ton of fun.

:W

Too funny!

[doughboy81972]

bananadanna wrote:
If I knew how to weld my van would have come out much different. But my "found art" skills are still better than my woodworking.

I solved the "bouncy bouncy" problem in two main ways. My bench supports are aluminum locker room bench cantilevers from Rakks. (You can imagine the forces they're designed to withstand.) The bench/sofa/bed platform is made from Reese 15"x 75" atv ramps. Each ramp is 12.5 lbs but rated for 650 lbs. My three-ramp bed can thus withstand almost a ton of fun. Our bed size is 30x80 as a twin and 45 x 80 as a narrow double. (We like each other.) I could have a 4-section 60x80 but more typically stagger two 30x80's when I have a guest in lieu of my DW.

Everything KDs easily, a dropdown set of legs make for a two-section folding sofa, a couple of aluminum u-channels slip in to span the cantilever gap for the three section bed. The design got rebuilt twice to let everything fold flat to the walls and to let the bed assemble tool-free.

My primary design thought was to allow me to carry canoes inside on daytrips but the aisle space also often holds bikes. And I think my van should be able to work for a living occasionally---the clear floor span is great for plywood and I folded the benches to carry three stories of scaffolding for some stick house work.

My fold-away interior

Dan

now that is cool that is what I was thinking about when I build my van all though I was thinking about e track I am over 300 lbs and like the strength of steel

[bananadanna]

If I knew how to weld my van would have come out much different. But my "found art" skills are still better than my woodworking.

I solved the "bouncy bouncy" problem in two main ways. My bench supports are aluminum locker room bench cantilevers from Rakks. (You can imagine the forces they're designed to withstand.) The bench/sofa/bed platform is made from Reese 15"x 75" atv ramps. Each ramp is 12.5 lbs but rated for 650 lbs. My three-ramp bed can thus withstand almost a ton of fun. Our bed size is 30x80 as a twin and 45 x 80 as a narrow double. (We like each other.) I could have a 4-section 60x80 but more typically stagger two 30x80's when I have a guest in lieu of my DW.

Everything KDs easily, a dropdown set of legs make for a two-section folding sofa, a couple of aluminum u-channels slip in to span the cantilever gap for the three section bed. The design got rebuilt twice to let everything fold flat to the walls and to let the bed assemble tool-free.

My primary design thought was to allow me to carry canoes inside on daytrips but the aisle space also often holds bikes. And I think my van should be able to work for a living occasionally---the clear floor span is great for plywood and I folded the benches to carry three stories of scaffolding for some stick house work.

My fold-away interior

Dan

[WVvan]

I had considered something similar. If I had used solid plywood sheets I'm sure the bed platform would have been stronger but I used the pine boards so I can have "hatches" to access the space under the sofa. If this plan doesn't work out my next idea would be to weld a frame of angle iron that the bed platform rests in. Then just lift up the whole bed platform to access under the sofa.
The one hitch with this plan is I don't know how to weld. A friend who does has offered to let me use his equipment to learn. I'll consider this Plan B.

[landyacht318]

My plywood bed platform has to span a distance of 43 inches, from wheel well storage to wheel well storage.

I was also worried about the 'bouncy bouncy', fatiguing or just outright breaking the plywood.

I re-enforced the leading edge of the plywood with some cold rolled angle steel. I cut a rabbitt in the ~3/4 plywood and gorilla glued and screwed the steel to the plywood.
Now my sliding storage boxes fit under the bed rise to within 3/16 of an inch of the platform, but I can lie in bed and still slide out the boxes, so that shows how little the plywood flexes with the steel re-enforcement.

One of my wheel well storage boxes has a pullout that is also 43 inches long, six inches wide, and I use it as a bridge and pull the 48 inch wide bed away from the back doors to give more room. I also re-enforced this piece of plywood with 2 lengths of the steel angle iron. Unsupported by the storage boxes below, it holds up my 225 lbs when squatted in the middle while making up the bed.

The steel also protects the leading edges of the plywood from dings. Before I glued and screwed the steel to the plywood, I rounded the sharp corners and painted the exterior surface with flat black paint. Next to the dark walnut stained and polyurethaned plywood it is not too obvious.

If you are worried about the plywood breaking, I just wanted to convey my solution to the problem.

[WVvan]

Sofa-Bed.
It's not done yet but at this point I've finally got it all figured out.
Time to start the write-up. The sofa-bed will be the most complex thing I'm going to build for the van conversion. It would have been nice to put this off until later in the project but so many other elements depend on the size and placement of the sofa-bed so it has to go first.

The usual warnings apply. I've never designed and built anything like this before. I've had to make a bunch of assumptions (wild a** guesses) and not sure how these will work out in practice. Will find out after I put it to some use.

One more point. Even though this will fold out to a bed I don't believe it's sturdy enough for any serious "bouncy-bouncy". Seeing is how I camp alone that wasn't a design consideration, unfortunately. I like how the English would phrase it, "More's the pity".

When the the sofa-bed is in the bed position it will be 74 inches long by 42 inches wide. I choose 74" long since I'm 6 ft tall (72") so that gives me room to lay flat with a couple inches extra. 42" wide because when it's in the sofa position the seat and the back will each be 21 inches wide and that felt to me like a comfortable seat size. I'm using two electric actuators to open and close the sofa-bed.

For padding I've bought 3 inch thick foam and a 2" thick memory foam topper. Not yet decided about how to cover them.

Here is the basic design I started with. I've stayed fairly close to it.




So far on this build I've made more mistakes and wrong turn than I care to admit. Here's a picture of the sofa-bed bone pile and I'm not even done yet.


I got started on this about a month and a half ago. First cut the two end pieces. They are 30" x 31". I'm using 19/32" plywood.


Made the seat and back frames from a 3/4" thick pine planks I had laying around.


Each frame is made from five pieces. Here are the dimensions of the pieces used on the back frame.


The seat frame is slightly different in size. I had some 5-1/2" wide boards on hand so instead of ripping them down to 5" I just increased the width of the frame an inch. So the back frame is 74"x20" while the seat frame is 74"x21". 20" + 21" doesn't equal 42" but the foam is cut to 42" and it can easily overhang the edge of the frame by 1".

continued.

[qjane]

WVvan wrote:
... As a bonus if you listen carefully at 34 seconds you can hear Bob expressing her opinion. You can just see a part of her to the left...

Bob on the Job :C ... priceless!

[WVvan]

Sofa-bed partial FAIL.

Two steps forward, one step back. My mechanism to raise the back of the sofa-bed doesn't work as well as I'd hoped. It does raise the back, just not far enough. I'm moving on to Plan C. Plan B would be to keep working on the mechanism until I get it right but I've already spent enough time on this. I know I can get it working but I've got a van conversion to finish. Plan C is to use another actuator to raise just the back. I really wanted the sofa-bed to work off of just one actuator. Maybe I'll come back to this problem some day. I've already drawn up a whole new design today while stuck waiting at the doctors office. It was either that or look at "People" magazines that were so old the Flintstones were on the cover.


Before taking the current lifter apart I created a .avi file that shows it in operation. The back is propped open so to see better. In operation it would be flat like this.


Caution - large files.
lifter .avi file - 6Mb
As a bonus if you listen carefully at 34 seconds you can hear Bob expressing her opinion. You can just see a part of her to the left.

Since I was making .avi files here is one showing the actuator in operation. It's kind of loud. Not that bad in real life.
actuator .avi file - 6Mb

[WVvan]

Got the sofa-bed sliders finished tonight. Getting closer. In the mean time.....

A quick post on using calipers. More particular vernier calipers.
If you've been following these postings you'll have seen pictures where I'm using them.
Here's the three I own.


The top (plastic) one cost me about a buck. The middle one got for around $6. The bottom one I inherited.
I use them to measure width or depth.
I wouldn't trust the markings on the plastic one but it's good for getting a size then comparing it to a tape measure.


These are the Outside Jaws.


And for measuring inside, the Inside Jaws.


On the other end is the Depth Probe.


Once you've taken a measurement, this is how to read it.
On the Main Scale is marked inches and 1/10 of inches. Only the even numbered 1/10 marks are labeled. The top scale is the Vernier Scale. This caliper is accurate to 3 decimal places.


Here's an example measurement.
Find where the zero mark on the Vernier Scale lines up on the Main Scale. It's between 0 and 1 inch.


On the Main Scale the zero mark is pointing between 0.5 and 0.6. Between the 1/10 inch marks are three shorter marks. Each mark equals .025 inches. This value will be the same as the largest value on the Vernier Scale. Since the zero mark is to the right of the third .025 mark the measurement is
.5 + .025 + .025 + .025 = .575
before adding the Vernier Scale.


To use the Vernier Scale find which of it's marks line up exactly with any mark on the Main Scale. It will only line up with one but you have to look closely to determine which one. Add the value from the Vernier Scale, .012 in this example, to get the total measurement.
.575 + .012 = .587 inches.


Or you could use a dial caliper.


And why might you need to know measurements this accurate?
Here's one way I used them. The smaller bits had fallen out of my drill case.


The bits have been used so much you could no longer read the end markings.


Use the dial caliper to get the diameter from a drill bit then convert fraction to decimal.


Worked like a champ.


PS
Final score.
Duke 78 WV 57
On the bright side, there should be no couch fires tonight.

[WVvan]

Hey McZippie

if your electric DIY sofa/bed doesn't work out

Failure is not an option! I hope, I hope, I hope.

I do wish I had the extra room you have.


Hey thriftydutch,
I'd not heard of stripper bolts or shoulder screws. Sounds like what I need. I'll look into it.

[thriftydutch]

I would suggest you use stripper bolts or shoulder screws. (Both the same) These will give you an exact fit if you ream your holes to the same size.Put a thin nylon washer in between. Oh, by the way these shoulder screws are hardened.

[McZippie]

One reason for the electric part is the lack of room for muscling it open since there will be cabinets across the aisle from it. Once it's bolted into place I'm not planning on moving it.

FWIW... if your electric DIY sofa/bed doesn't work out; our jack knife sofa bed can be opened and closed from the end. When building our Rig I considered all types of electric sofa/beds and chose a manual Jack Knife because they can be positioned closer to the wall while in the upright position.

[WVvan]

Perhaps they are a one time use

I think you're right. I started turning the nut on a bolt and it got tight fast so I stopped since I was just checking. I'll plan to use it once.

How do you plan on keeping the drawers closed when driving?

The draw slides are for the sofa-bed. If you look at the top photo on this page you can see the sofa-bed with the electric actuator in the center. The actuator is what will open (open position bed) and close (closed position sofa) the sofa-bed.
You can see angled metal on the 30x31 inch plywood end. Originally the bed was supposed to slide on this. Didn't work as well in practice as in theory. The draw slides will replace the metal angle.

My bed will run along the wall behind the drivers seat. My floor plan is to have a clear center aisle so I can still use the van for occasional hauling. One reason for the electric part is the lack of room for muscling it open since there will be cabinets across the aisle from it. Once it's bolted into place I'm not planning on moving it.

A nice thing about the movable mattress is to lift it off the platform after a cold night, and let all the condensation evaporate, otherwise mildew will form.

Good to know. I hadn't thought about that.

[landyacht318]

I have removed those nuts before. They remained tight, But I then tried to reuse them and they did not work as designed. The star would spin on the bolt. Perhaps they are a one time use or different design.

Nice drawer slides.
How do you plan on keeping the drawers closed when driving?

My bed lift requires muscle to attach it to a center adjustable height S hook. and underneath I built two Birch plywood boxes that fit tightly in between the storage areas I built over each wheel humps. I then Use a 1 foot 5/8 inch thick long white oak wedge to press the 2 storage boxes into the wheel well storage. I used a lot of felt padding on the bottom of the boxes to allow them to slide easily, But they are pretty heavy filled as I have them, and muscle is again required.

Crude but effective, and maximizes underbed storage. I can also remove the mattress, bed platform, and storage boxes in under 5 minutes. I can store them to the side and be able to load 4x8 sheets of plywood inside. Again, crude but functional.

A nice thing about the movable mattress is to lift it off the platform after a cold night, and let all the condensation evaporate, otherwise mildew will form.