Norton Security

[salem]

HP has terminated their agreement with Norton to provide free protection for HP users. Would you suggest renewing the subscription or use one of the free downloads. If the free ones, which ones? Thanks FWIW, I've been trouble free with Norton.

[Timmo_]

Gdetrailer wrote:

SPRey wrote:

AsheGuy wrote:
A "Microsoft Account" is not mandatory on Windows 10. It is the default so only those that allow Microsoft to dictate your Windows configuration get a "Microsoft Account" instead of a local PC account.

With that being said, I am a Google app user and therefore Google knows all about me. I don't care as I have nothing to hide but also in today's tech world information about you is harvested in many different ways anyway. My credit card company is very good at warning of a possible scam. I have never had any problem operating in this world since the Internet came on the scene.

To download any app from Microsoft store, you must log in. Yep, to download any app, including Skype--gotta have an account.

I've been hit real bad with Identity Theft twice. Both times it took hundreds of hours and attorneys to fix it. I thwart all high tech tracking and try to be inconspicuous. LOL, and yes, I don't have a Facebook account neither.

Most identity thefts happen from your own lack of care, sometimes physically like allowing the waiter to disappear with your credit or debit card, hacked gas stations with card skimmers and online stuff typically from spammers and spoofers sending you unsolicited junk emails that require or demand you to enter personal information and without it they will close or lock your accounts..

It is called "social engineering" and is the weakest link in your chain of defense..

Yep, it is YOU, YOU ARE THE WEAKEST LINK not the software on your PC..

A/V software that blocks you from doing something stupid is not needed if you just used your own brains as most social engineering attempts play on your mind, they use tactics that break down your defenses, want you to make spit second decisions that lead to you giving out detailed privileged information that can be used to steal your identity.

Many A/V blocking hits are actually FALSE POSITIVES and as such you LOSE.. You LOSE access to a lot of Internet access and content because you chose to let software prevent you from accessing items that are not and issue but has been "black listed" by accident..

I have that issue with my new ISP, they use a device called PLUME, plume will not allow me access to some sites that I HAVE used for many years claiming those sites are "suspicious".. Even though I have setup "exceptions" Plume still blocks those websites. One of these days, that plume device will be replaced by a real router.

I refuse to live my life hiding behind brick walls and safety glass wondering just what the real world looks like without being "nannied" to death..

I am dealing with a place right now that is using ESET, had to upgrade to a newer version and now the problem has started with ESET continually nannying everything, blocking software from checking for updates, blocking every program from starting, blocking programs from accessing PC resources, ESET took over the firewall, forcing the user to acknowledge over and over to yes to everything it thinks is bad.. If it was my PCs, ESET would be gone in a heart beat..

But, I have to deal with folks that do not understand PCs and they are scared to death that Defender is not good enough.

If you are this scared of things this bad, you are best to take your entire life off of the wobbly web, don't answer your phone, don't answer texts, don't answer emails..

I like my PCs to work without the need for a nanny looking over my shoulder questioning me like a Kindergartner.

For us grownups we tend to know good from evil and often can make good choices..

Three points.

First. The Identity Theft matters I experienced were not petty; 1st one was finding a $300k lien filed against my home (default loan), and when I ran my credit report, we discovered over $150k loans for boats and cars. All in my name. $450k was that nightmare back in 2001. Second hit came 2010 and was all credit cards; some fool changed my address and received a shitload of credit cards using my name and credit. That was an easier battle since no real estate was involved.

Second. When someone that does not know my technical background thinks I need a lesson in technology, I laugh. For the record, remember the 8088 microprocessor? I used assembly/machine language to program utilities, and later did database programming with COBOL and SQL--long before personal computers were mainstream for business, and was quite helpful as I changed paths and enjoyed a nice career in corporate finance and tax compliance.

Third. Privacy. Some people believe it is OK to allow their private life exposed for all to see, while others, like me, believe TMI (too much information) is not your friend. Example, Cancel Culture--things that were acceptable in years past are suddenly verbotten, and if there is any record evidence that you said, believed, published, those things, then guess what? Pop goes the weasel.

And it is about money, why provide an enterprise valuable information (ie shopping habits) without compensation? Why allow tracking of my moves without compensation? Why should big tech record my keystrokes without compensation? I turn off those features (location on smartphone) and opt out for the collection of my personal data (disguised "to provide and improve your experience".

And the question is: What do I have to hide? I have nothing to hide, I like my privacy; when negotiate business deals, the person that knows more of their opponent has the advantage. Less is best in my book.

Microsoft Defender did me wrong years ago and since then I have always had a 3rd party virus/malware protection. Now we know my opinions, as we all know yours.

[1492]

SPRey wrote:

You mean the same folks that awarded PC Matic AV-TEST Award earlier last year?

Past ratings are irrelevant? What matters is how effective is it in today's threat environment? Microsoft Security Essentials (MSE), the predecessor to Defender used to be rated at the very bottom of AV software protection by AV-Test.org, for which I would not consider using it. When Defender achieved top rating, I switched from BitDefender and Avira.

SPRey wrote:

I wonder if Defender tracks users...hmmm.

Defender is not an add-on AV product. It's integrated in Windows OS. Just as Mac OSX has its own integrated AV. You disable user activity tracking for Windows, not Defender?

Without independent verification, I would take anything a company claims about their product or practices with a grain of salt. You really don't know?

About user tracking? Your internet service provider is already tracking your Net activity? So are your browsers? As is your email providers, unless you are running your own servers?

[free_radical]

Gdetrailer wrote:

SPRey wrote:

AsheGuy wrote:
A "Microsoft Account" is not mandatory on Windows 10. It is the default so only those that allow Microsoft to dictate your Windows configuration get a "Microsoft Account" instead of a local PC account.

With that being said, I am a Google app user and therefore Google knows all about me. I don't care as I have nothing to hide but also in today's tech world information about you is harvested in many different ways anyway. My credit card company is very good at warning of a possible scam. I have never had any problem operating in this world since the Internet came on the scene.

To download any app from Microsoft store, you must log in. Yep, to download any app, including Skype--gotta have an account.

I've been hit real bad with Identity Theft twice. Both times it took hundreds of hours and attorneys to fix it. I thwart all high tech tracking and try to be inconspicuous. LOL, and yes, I don't have a Facebook account neither.

Most identity thefts happen from your own lack of care, sometimes physically like allowing the waiter to disappear with your credit or debit card, hacked gas stations with card skimmers and online stuff typically from spammers and spoofers sending you unsolicited junk emails that require or demand you to enter personal information and without it they will close or lock your accounts..

It is called "social engineering" and is the weakest link in your chain of defense..

Yep, it is YOU, YOU ARE THE WEAKEST LINK not the software on your PC..

A/V software that blocks you from doing something stupid is not needed if you just used your own brains as most social engineering attempts play on your mind, they use tactics that break down your defenses, want you to make spit second decisions that lead to you giving out detailed privileged information that can be used to steal your identity.

Many A/V blocking hits are actually FALSE POSITIVES and as such you LOSE.. You LOSE access to a lot of Internet access and content because you chose to let software prevent you from accessing items that are not and issue but has been "black listed" by accident..

I have that issue with my new ISP, they use a device called PLUME, plume will not allow me access to some sites that I HAVE used for many years claiming those sites are "suspicious".. Even though I have setup "exceptions" Plume still blocks those websites. One of these days, that plume device will be replaced by a real router.

I refuse to live my life hiding behind brick walls and safety glass wondering just what the real world looks like without being "nannied" to death..

I am dealing with a place right now that is using ESET, had to upgrade to a newer version and now the problem has started with ESET continually nannying everything, blocking software from checking for updates, blocking every program from starting, blocking programs from accessing PC resources, ESET took over the firewall, forcing the user to acknowledge over and over to yes to everything it thinks is bad.. If it was my PCs, ESET would be gone in a heart beat..

But, I have to deal with folks that do not understand PCs and they are scared to death that Defender is not good enough.

If you are this scared of things this bad, you are best to take your entire life off of the wobbly web, don't answer your phone, don't answer texts, don't answer emails..

I like my PCs to work without the need for a nanny looking over my shoulder questioning me like a Kindergartner.

For us grownups we tend to know good from evil and often can make good choices..

Best advice so far,,think people will listen ? LOL
I use Samsung tablet and it warns me when some questionable site shows up,,simply close it and no harm done.
Same with phone
I never answer any calls IF I dont know whos calling,thats what mailbox is for.
When callers dont even leave a msg its 100% scamers

[Gdetrailer]

SPRey wrote:

AsheGuy wrote:
A "Microsoft Account" is not mandatory on Windows 10. It is the default so only those that allow Microsoft to dictate your Windows configuration get a "Microsoft Account" instead of a local PC account.

With that being said, I am a Google app user and therefore Google knows all about me. I don't care as I have nothing to hide but also in today's tech world information about you is harvested in many different ways anyway. My credit card company is very good at warning of a possible scam. I have never had any problem operating in this world since the Internet came on the scene.

To download any app from Microsoft store, you must log in. Yep, to download any app, including Skype--gotta have an account.

I've been hit real bad with Identity Theft twice. Both times it took hundreds of hours and attorneys to fix it. I thwart all high tech tracking and try to be inconspicuous. LOL, and yes, I don't have a Facebook account neither.

Most identity thefts happen from your own lack of care, sometimes physically like allowing the waiter to disappear with your credit or debit card, hacked gas stations with card skimmers and online stuff typically from spammers and spoofers sending you unsolicited junk emails that require or demand you to enter personal information and without it they will close or lock your accounts..

It is called "social engineering" and is the weakest link in your chain of defense..

Yep, it is YOU, YOU ARE THE WEAKEST LINK not the software on your PC..

A/V software that blocks you from doing something stupid is not needed if you just used your own brains as most social engineering attempts play on your mind, they use tactics that break down your defenses, want you to make spit second decisions that lead to you giving out detailed privileged information that can be used to steal your identity.

Many A/V blocking hits are actually FALSE POSITIVES and as such you LOSE.. You LOSE access to a lot of Internet access and content because you chose to let software prevent you from accessing items that are not and issue but has been "black listed" by accident..

I have that issue with my new ISP, they use a device called PLUME, plume will not allow me access to some sites that I HAVE used for many years claiming those sites are "suspicious".. Even though I have setup "exceptions" Plume still blocks those websites. One of these days, that plume device will be replaced by a real router.

I refuse to live my life hiding behind brick walls and safety glass wondering just what the real world looks like without being "nannied" to death..

I am dealing with a place right now that is using ESET, had to upgrade to a newer version and now the problem has started with ESET continually nannying everything, blocking software from checking for updates, blocking every program from starting, blocking programs from accessing PC resources, ESET took over the firewall, forcing the user to acknowledge over and over to yes to everything it thinks is bad.. If it was my PCs, ESET would be gone in a heart beat..

But, I have to deal with folks that do not understand PCs and they are scared to death that Defender is not good enough.

If you are this scared of things this bad, you are best to take your entire life off of the wobbly web, don't answer your phone, don't answer texts, don't answer emails..

I like my PCs to work without the need for a nanny looking over my shoulder questioning me like a Kindergartner.

For us grownups we tend to know good from evil and often can make good choices..

[AsheGuy]

SPRey wrote:
To download any app from Microsoft store, you must log in. Yep, to download any app, including Skype--gotta have an account.

I never download an app from the Microsoft store. I abandoned Microsoft apps years ago. No problem as there are plenty of alternatives. I just use Windows as an operating system and I would abandon it for Linux except for a couple of apps I need to don't have a Linux version.

[Timmo_]

AsheGuy wrote:
A "Microsoft Account" is not mandatory on Windows 10. It is the default so only those that allow Microsoft to dictate your Windows configuration get a "Microsoft Account" instead of a local PC account.

With that being said, I am a Google app user and therefore Google knows all about me. I don't care as I have nothing to hide but also in today's tech world information about you is harvested in many different ways anyway. My credit card company is very good at warning of a possible scam. I have never had any problem operating in this world since the Internet came on the scene.

To download any app from Microsoft store, you must log in. Yep, to download any app, including Skype--gotta have an account.

I've been hit real bad with Identity Theft twice. Both times it took hundreds of hours and attorneys to fix it. I thwart all high tech tracking and try to be inconspicuous. LOL, and yes, I don't have a Facebook account neither.

[Timmo_]

1492 wrote:
From which independent testing organizations? The only 'independent' security testing of PCMatic that I've been able to locate, AV-Test.org found PCMatic scored well below industry average for 'real-world' threats than virtually all the top AV software including free MS Defender? Any AV software can and should score top ratings against known threats, the challenge being zero-day malware.

I would never rely on commercial magazine reviews or commissioned expert testing as they have a vested interest in the results.

False positives are not necessarily a bad thing. Better than AV software not finding an actual threat. It tells you should confirm with secondary security scanning. There is no such thing as one all encompassing security app. Especially, these days.

You mean the same folks that awarded PC Matic AV-TEST Award earlier last year?



With the AV-TEST Award, the leading test institute for IT security selects each year the best products in their class. To be honored with one of the internationally renowned awards, however, IT security products have to score the highest ratings in comprehensive tests throughout the test period of one full year. That is precisely what PC Matic has achieved with its "Home" product. The AV-TEST Award 2019 in the test category of performance for consumer products goes to PC Matic.

But its cool, for the past 3 years I have subscribed to PC Matic and quite happy, no malware. Can't say that for Norton and McAfee.

And then we this issue earlier this year, Avast was caught harvesting users highly sensitive data and selling it to Google and Microsoft". Oh no, not the guys that make Defender! I wonder if Defender tracks users...hmmm.

https://appleinsider.com/articles/20/01/27/avast-antivirus-harvested-user-data-then-sold-to-google-m...

PC Matic has an Data Integrity Pledge to not sell user data.

https://techtalk.pcmatic.com/2020/01/29/pc-matic-announces-data-integrity-pledge/

Where's Microsoft's pledge?

[AsheGuy]

SPRey wrote:

BTW, isn't Defender Microsoft based? And with the now mandatory "Microsoft Account", Bill Gates and Company have full knowledge of Windows 10 users' actions.

A "Microsoft Account" is not mandatory on Windows 10. It is the default so only those that allow Microsoft to dictate your Windows configuration get a "Microsoft Account" instead of a local PC account.

With that being said, I am a Google app user and therefore Google knows all about me. I don't care as I have nothing to hide but also in today's tech world information about you is harvested in many different ways anyway. My credit card company is very good at warning of a possible scam. I have never had any problem operating in this world since the Internet came on the scene.

[1492]

SPRey wrote:
Let's just say, PCMatic has caught more "bad internet pages" (preventing my access) than Norton/McAffe and from reviews and independent tests, PC Matic bested other non US commie based malware/ransomware software companies.

From which independent testing organizations? The only 'independent' security testing of PCMatic that I've been able to locate, AV-Test.org found PCMatic scored well below industry average for 'real-world' threats than virtually all the top AV software including free MS Defender? Any AV software can and should score top ratings against known threats, the challenge being zero-day malware.

I would never rely on commercial magazine reviews or commissioned expert testing as they have a vested interest in the results.

False positives are not necessarily a bad thing. Better than AV software not finding an actual threat. It tells you should confirm with secondary security scanning. There is no such thing as one all encompassing security app. Especially, these days.

[Timmo_]

Let's just say, PCMatic has caught more "bad internet pages" (preventing my access) than Norton/McAffe and from reviews and independent tests, PC Matic bested other non US commie based malware/ransomware software companies.

Maybe it is due to their unique method of using "white listing" (list of known safe files) for protection. Most virus apps use "black listing" (list of constantly evolving malware codes/algorithms) for protection. If it ain't on their list, you could get infected.

Most all malware/virus pros agree that Defender can be inconsistent and produce a higher rate of false positives. But more importantly, if you use Internet Explorer or Edge, then Defender's anti-phishing feature will work just fine. The trouble starts when you use non-Microsoft browsers like Chrome and Firefox (what I use). And what about smart devices, like my Android phone? Defender can't help you but PC Matic has you covered.

What computer/program optimization features are available on Defender? None. PC Matic has a nice suite of optimization tools incorporated.

BTW, isn't Defender Microsoft based? And with the now mandatory "Microsoft Account", Bill Gates and Company have full knowledge of Windows 10 users' actions.

If one thinks Microsoft Defender is more "private", that's OK with me; most of us know differently.

Added on edit: PC Matic only replaces Defender's virus/malware features--it is not an either/or.

[1492]

RickLight wrote:
The IT security pros i know say use 3rd party AV. Norton has bailed me out several times!

In my organization, all staff are allowed free 3rd party AV software for personal devices, which is included in our enterprise license.

However, everyone in my IT office including myself all use MS Defender on our personal PCs. Based on our own office experience, and concerns about our AI based AV app.

What's funny was when I first installed Office 365 (v19) suite on my personal desktop, we're allowed 10 free licenses on personal devices, I forgot to uncheck "apply my organization policy to this computer". I didn't realize that this included installing my company AV software. I quickly found out I couldn't uninstall it. So ended up re-imaging my desktop PC, so I could re-enable Defender.

[1492]

BradBurns wrote:
Sorry, but this sounds very hopeless

You're best protection is to be vigilant, and practice layered security approach.

[obgraham]

I guess you didn't read my post, GDE. I specifically agreed that "stuff happens". I only stated that the whole computer experience is a lot smoother having switched from the company started by one "egocentric guru", to the company started by "a different egocentric guru".

Beyond that, your checkoff list of vulnerabilities has exactly Zero to do with which operating system one uses.

[Gdetrailer]

obgraham wrote:

And for those touting "i" stuff, yeah, they to can get virus's, keyloggers, malware and are not "exempt" and you shouldn't throw rocks at non "i" products because some day, one of those rocks may bounce back and smash your "i" products glass house..

It's not a question of "touting", we all know stuff can happen. I can say, however, that after over 25 years on Windows stuff, I switched to Mac. Virtually all the issues I had with Win -- slow startups, hangups on shutdown, browser incompatibility, progressively slower machinery, and nefarious junk being attached to my computer -- all went away, once I got past the MS mindsets and learned the Apple mindsets.

Will it last? -- who knows?

I have had well over 30 yrs of PC/Windows/DOS/NT and many older OSs "experience" than I care to list.

In all of that time, I have only twice been hit by a virus/malware. Have spent many yrs of my life being online or having some sort of online connection as part of my job. I think getting hit twice in 30 yrs using non "i" products is pretty reasonable and should be expected..

Just because you bought into the "i" thing doesn't mean you will make it through your entire life without getting hit by a virus/malware.. Lots of online "i" forums with same issue with virus/malware issues..

You can bury your head in the sand, run and hide but eventually luck will run out on you as long as you have your "i" product attached to the wobbly web.

For many of us doing real work with real companies, we can't duck and run or hide our head in the sand because well over 95% of the worlds softwares runs exclusively on a PC platform using some form of Windows..

Pretty much everything you use or buy has been touched by a process that was exclusively run on a MS software platform..

Do you bank?

Use a ATM?

Have you been to a DR?

Hospital?

How about your electric Co?

Water bill?

Grocery store?

Gas station?

Own a car?

All of the above and more will be using a MS windows platform somewhere in their business..

Those are just a few examples of what IS "running the world"..

On edit..

It is also worthwhile to mention the "i" company DOESN'T make/sell "server hardware", nor do they make "server software"..

Without servers, your "i" products would be 99.9% useless and there would not be any such thing as "the Internet"..

You should be thanking the Non "i" products for at least the fact that you can "connect" to the Internet..